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    • bacoms
    • By bacoms 3rd Mar 17, 4:55 PM
    • 3Posts
    • 1Thanks
    bacoms
    Charitable trust status
    • #1
    • 3rd Mar 17, 4:55 PM
    Charitable trust status 3rd Mar 17 at 4:55 PM
    Help appreciated on clarifying my understanding on just what is a charitable trust. Am currently going through a head-banging exercise with Lloyds Bank trying to open a Treasurers' Account.
    According to Lloyds website, a Treasurers' Account is for 'a non-profit organisation such as a charity, church, club or society, our Treasurers' Account is a rewarding way to manage your funds'.
    We are a charity, governed by a Trust Deed, registered with The Charity Commission (i.e. we are a Charitable Trust). However, Lloyds insist that we are a business so must open a business account. I suspect that they have reached this conclusion purely because the name of our charity ends with the word 'Trust'.
    Are we a charity or are we a trust and consequently a business? Can anyone enlighten me on this, please?
Page 1
    • Savvy_Sue
    • By Savvy_Sue 3rd Mar 17, 10:42 PM
    • 37,281 Posts
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    Savvy_Sue
    • #2
    • 3rd Mar 17, 10:42 PM
    • #2
    • 3rd Mar 17, 10:42 PM
    Is there actually any difference between their Treasurers' account and their business account?

    But you can be both a charity and a business - the one I work for is a limited company (for protection of the trustees).

    If you get nowhere, do try another bank. Unity Trust, CAF and Triodos all do specialised charity accounts. I don't know how the last two manage cash in and out, but I know UT do it via the Post Office and selected local bank branches.
    Still knitting!
    Completed: 1 adult cardigan, 2 baby jumpers, 1 shawl, 2 pairs baby bootees,
    1 Wise Man Knitivity figure ...
    Current projects: 1 shawl, 1 baby jumper
    • Robin9
    • By Robin9 4th Mar 17, 7:30 AM
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    Robin9
    • #3
    • 4th Mar 17, 7:30 AM
    • #3
    • 4th Mar 17, 7:30 AM
    I am treasurer for a Charitable Trust and we gave up trying to open an account with Lloyds. We had been operating a passbook account with Nationwide until they closed their branch network.

    Lloyds wanted details of every single Trustee since we were established 50 years ago.

    We went to CAF, they only required details of the present Trustees. Its a cheque account - pay in at HSBC and Post Office.
    • bacoms
    • By bacoms 4th Mar 17, 11:06 AM
    • 3 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    bacoms
    • #4
    • 4th Mar 17, 11:06 AM
    • #4
    • 4th Mar 17, 11:06 AM
    Lloyds wanted details of every single Trustee since we were established 50 years ago.

    They don't make it easy. Almost like they don't really want to have charities opening Treasurers' Accounts. The hurdles they've put in the way of opening a Treasurers' Account are in chronological order:
    1. The Terms and Conditions have changed since applying online and the application being processed, so you have to fill in a new authority. But the new authority they have sent is identical to the old one. Why can't they simply use the original authority they already have.. Sorry, but those are the rules.
    2. On being transferred to their complaints department, I'm now told I ticked the wrong box on the online application. They maintain I ticked 'Charity' when I should have ticked 'Trust' despite 'Trust' not being an option.
    3. Then told that as a trust we are a business. Trying to explain that we are a charitable trust, governed by a trust deed approved and registered with The Charity Commission, cut no ice with them.
    We went to CAF, they only required details of the present Trustees. Its a cheque account - pay in at HSBC and Post Office.

    Since October 2016, banking with CAF is no longer free.
    • bacoms
    • By bacoms 4th Mar 17, 11:10 AM
    • 3 Posts
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    bacoms
    • #5
    • 4th Mar 17, 11:10 AM
    • #5
    • 4th Mar 17, 11:10 AM
    Is there actually any difference between their Treasurers' account and their business account?

    Yes. Basically, there are no fees associated with the daily running of a Treasurers' Account whereas, with a Business Account, there are.

    But you can be both a charity and a business - the one I work for is a limited company (for protection of the trustees).

    Yes, I know but we are not a limited company so not a business

    If you get nowhere, do try another bank. Unity Trust, CAF and Triodos all do specialised charity accounts. I don't know how the last two manage cash in and out, but I know UT do it via the Post Office and selected local bank branches.

    The reason we wanted to move from our present bank (NatWest) is that, with more and more banking being conducted online, we wanted the added protection of Online Payment Control not offered by NatWest. Lloyds, with their Treasurers' Account, offer this to charities at no charge. I looked at the other banks you mentioned but they either charge or couldn't provide what we wanted regarding everyday banking. (CAF used to be free but, since October 2016, they now charge a fee.)
    • Savvy_Sue
    • By Savvy_Sue 4th Mar 17, 1:18 PM
    • 37,281 Posts
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    Savvy_Sue
    • #6
    • 4th Mar 17, 1:18 PM
    • #6
    • 4th Mar 17, 1:18 PM
    Ah yes, NatWest ... I am also treasurer of a local walking group, and one of my first acts was to open an account with Unity Trust because I wanted to do online banking, and I did NOT want it to be under any one person's sole control.

    I haven't seen any charges on my account for the walking group, although I know we pay them at work - I am guessing that's because turnover at work is so much larger.

    We have 'managed' the charges at work to keep them down, and opened an account with CAF which pays a better rate of interest. Just wondering - without knowing your figures - if you can get the charges down to a reasonable level?

    I can see it's annoying, but you might jump through all the Lloyds hoops and then find they start charging anyway ...
    Still knitting!
    Completed: 1 adult cardigan, 2 baby jumpers, 1 shawl, 2 pairs baby bootees,
    1 Wise Man Knitivity figure ...
    Current projects: 1 shawl, 1 baby jumper
    • kazzah
    • By kazzah 24th Mar 17, 10:52 PM
    • 378 Posts
    • 365 Thanks
    kazzah
    • #7
    • 24th Mar 17, 10:52 PM
    • #7
    • 24th Mar 17, 10:52 PM
    our registered Charity has an account with Barclays - we don't pay any charges- but all of our correspondence from Barclays refer to our "business Account"
    we pay NOTHING at all in the way of fees
    can you show Lloyds your accounts/ details on the charity commission website to prove you aren't a business ?
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