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  • FIRST POST
    • Million Percent
    • By Million Percent 2nd Mar 17, 3:39 PM
    • 187Posts
    • 205Thanks
    Million Percent
    Wye Valley Visitors Centre PCN (ParkingEye)
    • #1
    • 2nd Mar 17, 3:39 PM
    Wye Valley Visitors Centre PCN (ParkingEye) 2nd Mar 17 at 3:39 PM
    Hi Everyone,

    Just looking for some advice. I've read the MSE guide and looked at the template letters there but browsing through this forum I've seen other templates that ask very specific questions to the parking company. So I'm genuinely a bit confused about what to do. I'm resolved that ignoring the PCN completely is not a good idea. Part of me thinks, just pay the £60 but then another part of me just feels so angry that these companies can profiteer from small innocent mistakes by people trying to play by the rules but getting caught out by confusing parking systems.

    Let me give you the background:

    Wye Valley Visitors Centre has always been free parking. The driver has been there many times over the years when suddenly they have installed an ANPR payment system. The driver turned up one day and didn't realise for around 20 minutes that you now have to pay. There was no barrier on the car park entry and the signage wasn't so obvious, particularly if you are not looking for it. Once the driver realised they needed to pay, they bought a ticket for a 4 hour stay (£3). However the driver had no way to know the exact time they entered the car park. The ticket only showed the time the ticket was purchased. The driver left the car park in the belief that they were still within their paid for time but a week later got a PCN for £100 (£60 discounted in paid within 14 days). According to ParkingEye's records the driver overstayed for 18 minutes.

    I really don't want to pay this charge, but equally I don't want to have to deal with the stress and worry of threatening letters and possible court action. My questions are:

    What is the best way to fight this? Do I have a realistic chance of getting it overturned by appeal? Is ParkingEye likely to take it to court if I just refuse to pay?

    Any advice/help much appreciated.
Page 2
    • Million Percent
    • By Million Percent 13th Mar 17, 8:39 AM
    • 187 Posts
    • 205 Thanks
    Million Percent
    So I've sent the letter to the landowner and submitted an appeal letter via the PE website. Let's see what happens.
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 13th Mar 17, 11:03 AM
    • 7,376 Posts
    • 6,423 Thanks
    The Deep
    Consider putting a complaint on here


    https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Attraction_Review-g190769-d2292866-Reviews-Wye_Valley_Butterfly_Zoo-Ross_on_Wye_Herefordshire_England.html


    and here


    https://www.facebook.com/WyeValleyVisitorCentre/?ref=page_internal
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • Million Percent
    • By Million Percent 14th Mar 17, 8:06 AM
    • 187 Posts
    • 205 Thanks
    Million Percent
    Thanks. If I don't get any joy from the landowners then I will definitely be posting some negative reviews
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 15th Mar 17, 1:18 PM
    • 51,502 Posts
    • 65,111 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Great - let us know, and if it is all rejected, win at POPLA instead, with forum assistance.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Million Percent
    • By Million Percent 17th Mar 17, 12:12 PM
    • 187 Posts
    • 205 Thanks
    Million Percent
    So PE have rejected the appeal and I have my POPLA code. No communication from the landowners in the 10 days since I wrote to them so I assume they are not going to help.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 17th Mar 17, 1:20 PM
    • 51,502 Posts
    • 65,111 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    OK so have a look at other recent 2017 ParkingEye POPLA drafts appeals on other threads (search for keywords). And get the template POPLA appeal points from post #3 of the NEWBIES thread, to make it long and detailed top put them off contesting it.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Half_way
    • By Half_way 17th Mar 17, 2:42 PM
    • 3,835 Posts
    • 5,411 Thanks
    Half_way
    keep an eye on the POPLA code expiry time, then try something like this, if they are not playing ball, then i dont see any reason why you shouldn't go full bore at them,

    Dear Wye valley visitors centre,
    Re parking charge notice _____ issued by your agents, Parking eye.
    I have attempted to be reasonable with you on this issue, however you have ignored all of my attempts to communicate with you on this matter.
    I would again like to remind you that you are jointly and severally liable for the actions of your agents, in this case Parking Eye.
    I expect a reply from you on this issue as a matter of urgency.

    I have alos noticed that you have failed to remove the missleading statement on your website http://bookings.wyevalleyvisitorcentre.co.uk/index.php?option=com_kunena&view=topic&catid=6&id= 78&Itemid=346
    regarding your agents, Pakring eye, where you state "If you want to appeal a Parking Charge Notice there is an independent regulated appeal process See the Parking Charge Notice for details.

    Please respect that it is not the business of Wye Valley Visitor Centre staff to give customer support on this issue."

    For your information, the Private parking industry is not regulated the British Parking Association limited is not a Regulatory body, it is a private members trade association and its so called code of practice was written by the BPA ltd and as no legal standing.
    POPLa is funded directly by the BPA ltd and it to can not be considered independent.
    As such I consider this statement on your website to be misleading at best and fraudulent at worst, I expect you to remove these claims form your website with immediate effect, contact all those who have been affected by a parking charge notice issued by Parking eye and re-fund them for any moneys that may have paid as a result of your misleading claims.

    The false claims on your website fall foul legislation backed up by the Advertising Standards Agency, who may also report this to Trading standards as being in breach of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008, this in itself is a criminal offence which can be processed through the Magistrates Court, Fines from a successful prosecution are unlimited and may also involve a custodial sentence of up to two years, see this leaflet for more details:
    https://www.asa.org.uk/asset/447A954A-A36D-4FEE-A9DCCC72DB35E66F/

    I feel that I have wasted enough time in dealing with this issue, and for the sake of expediency I will be constructing a POPLA appeal, however if you choose not to cancel this parking charge notice then i will have no other option than to consider charging you £19 per hour or part there of for my time plus any additional costs / expenses
    A copy of this letter has been posted to you by Royal mail and I have a certificate of postage which can be used as evidence that you have received it, should you chose to ignore this letter.
    I look forward to hearing from you within the next few days
    I also expect that you will now remove the misleading claims on your website, if not then I will have no other option that to report this matter to the Advertising standards agency.
    Yours, Million percent.


    You could also post something similar to their face book page.
    note if you do threaten anything such as reporting to the ASA you must go through with it

    this is the facebook page : https://www.facebook.com/WyeValleyVisitorCentre/
    From the Plain Language Commission:

    "The BPA has surely become one of the most socially dangerous organisations in the UK"
    • Myci85
    • By Myci85 24th Apr 17, 7:22 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Myci85
    How did you get on with your appeal?

    I have today received a PCN from the same place and am furious with them. They clocked me going in at 10.59 and going out at 15.09. They admitted on the phone that they can see I paid for 4 hours parking which expired at 15.06, but they are still trying to say I exceeded the grace period! So they are trying to make me pay £100 for going 3 minutes into the 10 minute maximum grace period demanded by the BPA legislation. I know that I will win if I appeal it as I am completely within the guidelines set out by BPA, however I am so cross with them for trying to con me out if money unfairly, knowing full well most people would just pay up, that I feel like I want to either invoice them for my time and distress, or actually take them to court and see how they like being on the receiving end! I just don't know if it would be futile and a waste of my time.

    What do people more experienced in this matter think?
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 24th Apr 17, 7:37 PM
    • 51,502 Posts
    • 65,111 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    You will win at POPLA on the Grace periods and ParkingEye are really trying it on recently with ten/eleven minute overstays, despite the Board resolution of the Professional Development & Standards Board meeting on 30th July 2015, linked here:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5637808

    You can see, it was agreed over 18 months ago, that the minimum 'grace period' would match Council/byelaws ones of a minimum of eleven minutes, not ten (and not a maximum, a bare minimum, which would be even longer under various circs that cause delays, not limited to disability...plenty of things can cause a delay).

    You will win that at POPLA with that evidence but you have to show POPLA as they will not know about that meeting.

    HTH, if you want comments on your draft POPLA appeal you must start your own thread.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Myci85
    • By Myci85 24th Apr 17, 7:49 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Myci85
    Thank you coupon mad. Presumably I should go through Parking Eye's appeal process before I get to POPLA involvement? And do you think there would be any point trying to take them to court over them clearly contravening the code of conduct issued by BPA, or should I just appeal, get it cancelled and leave it be? I'm just so annoyed I'm having to waste my time and effort on this when they should never have issued the notice in the first place!
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 24th Apr 17, 8:00 PM
    • 51,502 Posts
    • 65,111 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    You have to appeal to PE first to get a POPLA code.

    And yes, we encourage a fightback but more along the lines of suggesting that PE had no grounds to obtain your data at all, starting with a complaint to the ICO and finishing with a claim for compensation for data misuse, if you fancy a punt - as per Timothea's DPA thread.

    But win this appeal first. If you want it cancelled quickly, throw all the evidence at them.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Myci85
    • By Myci85 24th Apr 17, 8:27 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Myci85
    Excellent, thank you for the advice. I shall start the process off and will begin a thread on here for further advice if I need any (I'm sure I will!). ☺
    • PalaceJim
    • By PalaceJim 4th May 17, 3:21 PM
    • 16 Posts
    • 16 Thanks
    PalaceJim
    Wye Valley Visitor centre/Parking Eye
    Hi all,
    I've been done by Parking Eye at the Wye Valley Visitor centre too, on Easter Sunday. Both me and my son!
    We entered at 10:23 and left at 14:37. We paid 4 hours parking from 10:31 to 14:31, so 7 mins before and 7 mins after (14 mins over in total).
    I appealed to Parking eye but they turned it down. How likely am I to win my POPLA appeal?. I can't really afford £120 let alone £200!!. Feeling quite sick about it all.
    Any help or advise would be great.
    Cheers
    James
    • Redx
    • By Redx 4th May 17, 4:52 PM
    • 16,504 Posts
    • 20,667 Thanks
    Redx
    please start your own thread using the red NEW THREAD button , top left of this forum

    then study clause #13 of the BPA CoP, studying the grace periods both before and after a parking event

    this will be one of your main appeal points at popla
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 4th May 17, 5:54 PM
    • 7,376 Posts
    • 6,423 Thanks
    The Deep
    The are others, signage, contract. standing, timeliness, planning permissions etc., plus you can write bad stull on their Facebook and TripAdviser pages and complain to the principals.
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • PalaceJim
    • By PalaceJim 11th May 17, 12:18 PM
    • 16 Posts
    • 16 Thanks
    PalaceJim
    I have photo of the Wye Valley Car park if anyone needs them, message me with your email and I'll send a link to a dropbox folder.
    • DoaM
    • By DoaM 11th May 17, 1:16 PM
    • 3,492 Posts
    • 3,551 Thanks
    DoaM
    As I replied in the other thread, please just post a broken* link in a reply here ... no need to harvest email addresses.

    * change http to hxxp
    Diary of a madman
    Walk the line again today
    Entries of confusion
    Dear diary, I'm here to stay
    • PalaceJim
    • By PalaceJim 11th May 17, 1:34 PM
    • 16 Posts
    • 16 Thanks
    PalaceJim
    Photos of Wye valley Visitor car park and signs:

    dropbox.com/sh/qkpb9drk7gwqwi1/[/url] AAAwXJyh0X6xnOe8BaoGXjCIa?dl=0
    • PalaceJim
    • By PalaceJim 11th May 17, 1:35 PM
    • 16 Posts
    • 16 Thanks
    PalaceJim
    take out the [/url] in middle and this should work
    • brimoan
    • By brimoan 11th May 17, 3:47 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    brimoan
    On 12th March I paid £3 for a 4 hour parking ticket, but left after 59 minutes. ParkingEye are saying I entered the wrong registration number on the ticket machine. I have asked proof of this "wrong" number but they have NOT replied with it. Instead they say my appeal has been rejected. I threw away the parking ticket so I do not have proof but I will not give in. I will see them in court.
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