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  • FIRST POST
    • AMRjr
    • By AMRjr 28th Feb 17, 5:25 PM
    • 6Posts
    • 0Thanks
    AMRjr
    Premier Park - Torquay Marina Car park
    • #1
    • 28th Feb 17, 5:25 PM
    Premier Park - Torquay Marina Car park 28th Feb 17 at 5:25 PM
    I have received a Parking Charge Notice for Torquay Marina Car park. I purchased a ticket for 30 minutes but not straight away and on returning to my car I didn't leave for sometime as I have a child with a disability who I couldn't convince to get in the car (a total time before and after of 28 minutes)! The parking charge notice only mentions the entry and exit times to the car park and the total time which was 58 minutes with photos of my car entering and leaving. I don't recall seeing anywhere that licence plate recognition was in operation or that you had to purchase a ticket from the time of entry to exit time. I have appealed and been declined on the basis that I should have purchased a second ticket.


    I have spoken to British Parking Association who have advised that Premier Parking have complied with the terms and conditions by putting a picture on the notice board showing a camera and that it is usual practice for companies to give 10 minutes grace. I advised that as a member of the public how would I know this and had I done I would have either put more money in or tried harder to persuade my son into the car. I was also advised that council car parks give the same grace period to which I established that council car parks aren't allowed to use licence plate recognition cameras so it's down to a warden who would physically see if you were at your car or not and ticket accordingly.

    Both citizens advice and British Parking Association say my next option is to submit a further appeal through POPLA. I am reluctant as you lose your right to a reduced fine if you go down this route. I think a lot of people will just end up paying based on these threats, so premier park get away with fining people based on the entry and exit time and not the actual time they were away from their car.

    Does anyone have any advice ..... do I go down the POPLA route and if so any wording that may be helpful?


    Thanks.
    Last edited by AMRjr; 28-02-2017 at 5:31 PM.
Page 1
    • Redx
    • By Redx 28th Feb 17, 5:33 PM
    • 14,770 Posts
    • 18,579 Thanks
    Redx
    • #2
    • 28th Feb 17, 5:33 PM
    • #2
    • 28th Feb 17, 5:33 PM
    there is no "fine" , its merely an invoice

    I would not pay a penny unless I lost in court and a judge said I owed £xx.xx amount of money to the PPC

    yes I would appeal to POPLA

    the appeal grounds for POPLA are listed in post #3 of the NEWBIES sticky thread , which includes TWO grace periods, one before the parking time (possibly up to 10 minutes) and one to leave the car park (of over 10 minutes) - its clause #13 of the BPA CoP

    but your popla appeal will contain SEVERAL appeal points
    Last edited by Redx; 28-02-2017 at 5:36 PM.
    Newbies !!
    Private Parking ticket? check the 2 sticky threads by coupon-mad and crabman in the Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking Board forum for the latest advice or maybe try pepipoo or C.A.G. or legal beagles forums if you need legal advice as well because this parking forum is not about debt collectors or legal matters per se
    • beamerguy
    • By beamerguy 28th Feb 17, 6:03 PM
    • 5,516 Posts
    • 7,099 Thanks
    beamerguy
    • #3
    • 28th Feb 17, 6:03 PM
    • #3
    • 28th Feb 17, 6:03 PM
    Both citizens advice and British Parking Association are useless.

    With the great advice on here, appeal to POPLA
    RBS - MNBA - CAPITAL ONE - LLOYDS

    DISGUSTING BEHAVIOUR
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 2nd Mar 17, 9:03 AM
    • 48,233 Posts
    • 61,698 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #4
    • 2nd Mar 17, 9:03 AM
    • #4
    • 2nd Mar 17, 9:03 AM
    Search the forum for 'Premier Torquay Marina POPLA' (don't have the word 'park' when searching the parking forum)! Also read the NEWBIES thread post #3 about how to appeal to POPLA and which has the templates to use.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • AMRjr
    • By AMRjr 9th Mar 17, 10:21 AM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    AMRjr
    • #5
    • 9th Mar 17, 10:21 AM
    • #5
    • 9th Mar 17, 10:21 AM
    Thanks all have appealed to POPLA
    • AMRjr
    • By AMRjr 10th Apr 17, 9:22 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    AMRjr
    • #6
    • 10th Apr 17, 9:22 PM
    • #6
    • 10th Apr 17, 9:22 PM
    Have just received my declined appeal by POPLA due to taking 17 minutes to leave. Am absolutely furious and flabberghasted that they have gone against the BPA recommended 'at least 10 minutes to leave' and feel 17 minutes is unreasonable despite taking the time to get my son with a disability into the car. They also suggest that there is adequate signage and that the ANPR cameras are clearly marked - they are not, there is no mention of ANPR cameras anywhere. There is just a picture on the board by the machine with a camera and advise camera enforcement in operation. They have not commented on the contract that Premier park gave as evidence which is out of date so they don't have a right to charge on this land, I assume. Are they on Premiers payroll? Where do I go next as I still think they are completely out of order and wrong? Any advice gratefully received.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 10th Apr 17, 9:39 PM
    • 48,233 Posts
    • 61,698 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #7
    • 10th Apr 17, 9:39 PM
    • #7
    • 10th Apr 17, 9:39 PM
    Loads of people have lost v PP at POPLA, no big deal. Search the forum for all the other cases. No-one pays.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • AMRjr
    • By AMRjr 17th May 17, 10:06 AM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    AMRjr
    • #8
    • 17th May 17, 10:06 AM
    • #8
    • 17th May 17, 10:06 AM
    I appealed to POPLA but they declined the appeal to my amazement. Their main point was that you have a minimum of 10 minutes to leave the car park and they felt 17 minutes was unreasonable despite having a child with a disability who took time to get into the car.


    I received a letter from Premier advising that the POPLA decision was to deny my appeal and I had until 12th May to pay and threatening court action. I haven't paid nor have I responded to them and today have received a further letter (quite well written and pleasant but threatening court) if I don't pay by 22nd May.


    This is really stressing me out. I have a lot going on, father has had a stroke recently, son has a disability and it would just be easier to pay it but me being me feels wronged as I bought a ticket and they didn't have a sign anywhere to advise ANPR at the entrance or anywhere in the car park. I was really surprised by POPLA's decision as they backed up that the signs were adequate and didn't comment on the out of date contract with the landowners that Premier had put forward in the evidence pack. They just seemed to pick up on the 17 minutes to leave was too long.


    I have read a lot of the threads and particularly the one about contacting the landowner but I don't want to contact the people on the contract as I don't know if they are fictitous.


    I haven't contacted anyone since the POPLA decision and now have the next letter. I'm in a quandary do I write to Premier to say stop harassing me, British Parking Association advises a minimum of 10 minutes to leave a car park (son with disability so took 17 minutes) and the signage, despite POPLA suggesting was acceptable, clearly wasn't as they didn't advise they were using ANPR or do I try and find out who the landowner is (advice on how gratefully received) and write to them saying call them off?


    Any similar experiences or advice gratefully received.
    • freester
    • By freester 17th May 17, 6:23 PM
    • 60 Posts
    • 77 Thanks
    freester
    • #9
    • 17th May 17, 6:23 PM
    • #9
    • 17th May 17, 6:23 PM

    Any similar experiences or advice gratefully received.
    Originally posted by AMRjr
    Don't stress

    I had a very badly written POPLA appeal rejected about a year ago. Mine was with Premier Park also.

    I sent them a letter saying since the appeal I had familiarised myself with the BPA recommendations on Signage and the signs where I got a ticket didn't meet the recommendations. I had also familiarised myself with Beavis (they mentioned that in the latest letter right?) and the signage was nowhere near as clear as that in the Beavis case. I also mentioned the statement about a CCJ was misleading (they mentioned that right?) and that would only happen if County Court found against me and the claim was not paid in full by the a date required by court. I asked them to desist from any further letters unless it was a letter before claim and that I was fully prepared to fight this small claim in court.

    I haven't heard back from them since.
    • freester
    • By freester 17th May 17, 6:25 PM
    • 60 Posts
    • 77 Thanks
    freester
    You could also mention how the law would look at how the judge might consider things regarding your child's disability. Although hopefully another member might suggest how to word that better.
    • waamo
    • By waamo 17th May 17, 6:48 PM
    • 1,723 Posts
    • 2,042 Thanks
    waamo
    They rarely issue a claim. It looks like they go for very soft targets. Here are the figures http://www.bmpa.eu/companydata/Premier_Park.html
    This space for hire.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 17th May 17, 11:52 PM
    • 48,233 Posts
    • 61,698 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Ignore them and come back for our help if they try a small claim. You will get some letters including one from 'Gladstones' that is in fact from the boring old toothless pen-pushers at Debt Recovery Plus, LOL at that one.

    Like here, this is someone ahead of you in the little game:

    http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=109893&st=60&start=60

    Don't stress. Laugh at the letters, I've collected them myself. Come back if they actually try court, not to mention every silly debt demand, they are amusing the first time but not the ten thousandth time you've seen them on forums over this past decade, all the same...

    No worries, live your life. We will help if a defence is needed.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • AMRjr
    • By AMRjr 5th Jun 17, 4:10 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    AMRjr
    As expected I have received the first debt recovery letter from ZZPS Ltd with a £72 admin charge and using the success of the parkingeye v beavis case. I am so tempted to write either to them or premier to say back off, child with disability and are they really going to pursue this one when I did buy a ticket and the BPA say at least 10 minutes to leave and I took 17 due to my son and there were no ANPR signs at the entrance or anywhere on their signage. The other side of me says sit it out and ignore until they stop as has been suggested previously. It makes me so cross that so many people will have caved by now and just paid up.
    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 5th Jun 17, 4:22 PM
    • 39,719 Posts
    • 79,509 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    As expected I have received the first debt recovery letter from ZZPS Ltd with a £72 admin charge and using the success of the parkingeye v beavis case. I am so tempted to write either to them or premier to say back off, child with disability and are they really going to pursue this one when I did buy a ticket and the BPA say at least 10 minutes to leave and I took 17 due to my son and there were no ANPR signs at the entrance or anywhere on their signage. The other side of me says sit it out and ignore until they stop as has been suggested previously. It makes me so cross that so many people will have caved by now and just paid up.
    Originally posted by AMRjr
    Either continue to ignore unless you get real court papers, or write to the PPC as suggested by freester in post 9. Point out that all things considered they stand no chance of success in court so they should give up now instead of wasting their money. Put the draft letter up here if you wish first.

    Personally I wouldn't bother but it might make you feel less stressed if you fired a shot across their bows about what they can expect if they try court. You could even tell them you are being assisted by MSE if you like.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
    I don't have a sister.

    All my screwdrivers are cordless.
    "You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 5th Jun 17, 7:01 PM
    • 48,233 Posts
    • 61,698 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Ignore means ignore.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

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