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  • FIRST POST
    • dizzybee001
    • By dizzybee001 24th Feb 17, 8:48 AM
    • 39Posts
    • 8Thanks
    dizzybee001
    Deeds not transferred on leasehold garage, owner missing!
    • #1
    • 24th Feb 17, 8:48 AM
    Deeds not transferred on leasehold garage, owner missing! 24th Feb 17 at 8:48 AM
    Hi, sorry this is really long and complicated.
    I am hoping someone can give me some honest advice.
    I bought a townhouse 5 years ago with a garage under a coach house. At the time I was not told that the garage was leasehold, and it never occurred to me to ask. My solicitor sent back queries to the sellers solicitor as there was a clause in the land registry contract? for the house about it not being able to be sold without the leasehold of the apartment. The sellers solicitor came back with the answer that it 'must be an error as the house is freehold'.
    I have had sole use of the garage, have never been asked for any contribution for any insurance, etc. Neither has my neighbour who owns a garage in the same block.
    It's only now that I want to sell my house, that I have discovered that the garage is indeed leasehold and there should be a separate land registry document for it. I have looked through all the correspondence from my solicitor and the original contract between Persimmon and the original buyer shows the draft leasehold contract and draft land registry document.
    I have got in touch with my solicitors firm (the solicitor that dealt with my purchase has now left), and they have discovered that the land registry certificate for the garage was never transferred from the original owner to my seller.
    There have been three owners of the house - the 1st bought the house new
    Then the second was my seller.
    So, the garage needs to be registered into my name, as the house is.
    This is my problem. I am in touch with the original owner, and he has agreed to sign whatever is necessary to transfer the leasehold to me. Unfortunately though, his ex-partner who co owned the house with him has vanished, it was an ugly split and she has disappeared, even if we did manage to find her it is unlikely that she will sign the forms.
    So, will both original owners need to sign the Transfer form, bearing in mind that that there is this clause in the land registry for the freehold house that the house cannot be sold without the garage, so there was full intention for them to sell both together? Or can just one of them sign it over to me?
    What do I tell any buyers if I sell my house?
    How long could this take to sort out?
    Thanks, I know that was very long I am so so worried about this as I have found a new house and just want this sorted!
Page 4
    • dizzybee001
    • By dizzybee001 13th Jul 17, 4:54 PM
    • 39 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    dizzybee001
    Hi thanks again for your advice and for replying. When i say the garage is linked on the title, I mean that there is a clause clearly stating that the title of the house cannot be transferred without contemporaneously transferring the deeds of the garage at the same time. So the garage cannot be sold separately.
    So my worry is, with this in mind, if the original owner refuses to sign, just to be difficult, I will never be able to sell my house.
    • DaftyDuck
    • By DaftyDuck 13th Jul 17, 5:27 PM
    • 3,705 Posts
    • 7,454 Thanks
    DaftyDuck
    ... but such a clause would mean both were transferred when you bought it....

    (apologies, not re-read whole thread, might be explained)
    • kirtondm
    • By kirtondm 13th Jul 17, 6:38 PM
    • 139 Posts
    • 93 Thanks
    kirtondm
    Sorry you lost the purchase and sale.

    hopefully you will get the garage transferred soon. I would certianly explore the possiblity of approaching the original solicitors.
  • Land Registry
    Hi thanks again for your advice and for replying. When i say the garage is linked on the title, I mean that there is a clause clearly stating that the title of the house cannot be transferred without contemporaneously transferring the deeds of the garage at the same time. So the garage cannot be sold separately.
    So my worry is, with this in mind, if the original owner refuses to sign, just to be difficult, I will never be able to sell my house.
    Originally posted by dizzybee001
    What sort of clause? Can you be specific as to whether it's a restriction, covenant or otherwise?

    It will be difficult to sell now but that will have more to do with the fact you know about the garage issue than the clause. But hopefully she will 'do the deed' so to speak and it can be resolved
    Official Company Representative
    I am the official company representative of Land Registry. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE"
    • dizzybee001
    • By dizzybee001 14th Jul 17, 5:44 PM
    • 39 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    dizzybee001
    Hi there It's a covenant I think I can check later, so if she doesn't sign then what??
  • Land Registry
    Many thanks - if it's a covenant then it doesn't prevent the 'erroneous' transfer from happening. But it should/could have been another flag to a buyer or their solicitor at the time of purchase.

    If she doesn't sign then it's most likely the scenario you have already highlighted, namely legal action. Then it's weight of evidence as to intent at the time of sale/purchase and efforts made to resolve. Your solicitor should advise, which I assume they have already as you mentioned litigation
    Official Company Representative
    I am the official company representative of Land Registry. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE"
    • dizzybee001
    • By dizzybee001 15th Jul 17, 9:17 AM
    • 39 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    dizzybee001
    Hi there
    Thank you, it was flagged but the answer from the other solicitor was 'we believe that to be a mistake as the house is freehold'. Of course I had no idea until the house was purchased that that was the answer. It's a series of errors on lots of parts. Interestingly my neighbour who has lived in their house since new, bought her ex partner out and transferred the house to her name, the garage was missed then, so it's fairly common I think.
    Yes, I think litigation will be the only path we can take now, as it doesn't look like she'll sign.
    Thanks
    • Janiewilts
    • By Janiewilts 12th Aug 17, 8:54 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Janiewilts
    I'm in the same position
    Hi, sorry to jump in on your post but we are in the same position. Due to exchange contracts on our 6 year old property last Friday when our buyers solicitor informs us that our garage has not been transferred!! We've been on to their solicitor and our old solicitor and done some detective work. We managed to track down the previous owners only to find they've moved! We popped a note through their door and the new owner rang us and said they've moved and will pass our letter to their new housing company. Our solicitor says it's our fault for not checking the deeds! Unbelievable! Any advice please
  • Land Registry
    Janiewilts best advice is you need to check/confirm who the registered owner is and find them. They are the ones who will need to transfer the legal ownership now.
    I read it you had but then you mention 'new housing company' so unsure who the owner is here?
    Official Company Representative
    I am the official company representative of Land Registry. MSE has given permission for me to post in response to queries about the company, so that I can help solve issues. You can see my name on the companies with permission to post list. I am not allowed to tout for business at all. If you believe I am please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com This does NOT imply any form of approval of my company or its products by MSE"
    • dizzybee001
    • By dizzybee001 13th Aug 17, 2:48 PM
    • 39 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    dizzybee001
    Hi there. I'm sorry to hear that you're in a similar situation. At first my solicitor tried to telll me it was my fault that I hadn't picked up on the fact that the red line round the very faded Deeds map didn't include the garage. But at the end of the day it was their job to advise me that the garage was on a seperate leasehold and had seperate deeds which they failed to do. So i would ask your solicitor what they intend to do to rectify this situation they have to take some of the responsibility
    If you can track down the original owners and get them to sign then you can probably get back on track with your buyers quickly. Can you get in touch with the person who said they'd moved and ask who the housing company is?
    I hope you haven't lost your sale because of this as unfortunately we did. Best of luck and keep us posted.
    • LadyDee
    • By LadyDee 13th Aug 17, 3:18 PM
    • 2,429 Posts
    • 2,519 Thanks
    LadyDee
    dizzybee - if the solicitors attempt to charge you for the extra work involved caused by their incompetence, then I think you should get straight on to the Law Society (after first following any of the firm's complaints procedures).
    • dizzybee001
    • By dizzybee001 13th Aug 17, 6:05 PM
    • 39 Posts
    • 8 Thanks
    dizzybee001
    Hi there fortunately they are not charging me, the person I have sorting it out is very reasonable, which is a good thing as we are now with the litigators
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