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  • FIRST POST
    • Biglad74
    • By Biglad74 14th Feb 17, 9:43 PM
    • 14Posts
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    Biglad74
    Parking Eye Parking ticket.
    • #1
    • 14th Feb 17, 9:43 PM
    Parking Eye Parking ticket. 14th Feb 17 at 9:43 PM
    Hi,
    I have recieved a Parking Charge Notice from Parking Eye for parking in a service area behind a retail park and have a couple of questions:

    1. It says on the notice date of issue 31/01/2017 and gives the offer to pay the discounted rate (£60) if paid within 14 days (Today) however the notice didn't arrive on my doormat until 09/02/2017. Is this a tactic by the company of sitting on the ticket until near the 14 day period has expired to pressure me into paying??

    2. In the grey box at the bottom it says they "we have originally written to the registered keeper of the vehicle whose details were held by the DVLA at the time of the parking event and they have informed us that you were responsible for this vehicle at the time of the parkin event"
    Well I am the registered keeper, but they haven't sent anything previously or it hasn't arrived.
    Are they just trying it on or has a first letter gone astray??

    3. They call the area a service yard, but then go on to describe that the signage/car park/appropriate permit-authorisation all relate to a car park.... is this worth pointing out/using as a technicality?

    4. Myself and x3v colleagues were there, all in seperate vehicles (x1 private and x2 marked/liveried) but I am the only one to have recieved a notice. Is it worth calling the cameras accuracy into account as it hasn't recorded the x3 other vehicles.

    5. What is the best course of intial action - say that I am refusing to name the driver or go straight to the appeals process?

    Thanks in anticipation.
Page 2
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 12th Mar 17, 6:56 PM
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    Coupon-mad
    I would make 'ANPR Evidence' your final point and you've still missed point #1 which should be stating why the NTK is not a POFA one, showing POPLA why there can be no keeper liability with this particular non-POFA PCN served out of time (give dates) and without the 9(2)f warning from Schedule 4 about 'keeper liability'.

    Slam dunk win but you MUST tell POPLA where to look!
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Biglad74
    • By Biglad74 12th Mar 17, 8:53 PM
    • 14 Posts
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    Biglad74
    Redact your VRN NOW!
    Originally posted by Fruitcake
    Done - Thanks!
    • Biglad74
    • By Biglad74 12th Mar 17, 9:18 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    Biglad74
    I would make 'ANPR Evidence' your final point and you've still missed point #1 which should be stating why the NTK is not a POFA one, showing POPLA why there can be no keeper liability with this particular non-POFA PCN served out of time (give dates) and without the 9(2)f warning from Schedule 4 about 'keeper liability'.

    Slam dunk win but you MUST tell POPLA where to look!
    Originally posted by Coupon-mad
    Ok, I have ammended my draft and put the ANPR point at the end.
    I am now confused about the second part of your advice. I have the NTK with the space at the bottom of the box, which is not a POFA one. However the alleged incident took place on 11/01/2017 and the NTK is dated 31/01/2017, so how can I claim this is out of time?

    I researched POFA section 9 and this is what it contains -

    9(1)A notice which is to be relied on as a notice to keeper for the purposes of paragraph 6(1)(b) is given in accordance with this paragraph if the following requirements are met.

    (2)The notice must—

    (a)specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;

    (b)inform the keeper that the driver is required to pay parking charges in respect of the specified period of parking and that the parking charges have not been paid in full;

    (c)describe the parking charges due from the driver as at the end of that period, the circumstances in which the requirement to pay them arose (including the means by which the requirement was brought to the attention of drivers) and the other facts that made them payable;

    (d)specify the total amount of those parking charges that are unpaid, as at a time which is—

    (i)specified in the notice; and

    (ii)no later than the end of the day before the day on which the notice is either sent by post or, as the case may be, handed to or left at a current address for service for the keeper (see sub-paragraph (4));

    (e)state that the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and invite the keeper—

    (i)to pay the unpaid parking charges; or

    (ii)if the keeper was not the driver of the vehicle, to notify the creditor of the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and to pass the notice on to the driver;

    (f)warn the keeper that if, after the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given—

    (i)the amount of the unpaid parking charges specified under paragraph (d) has not been paid in full, and

    (ii)the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver,

    the creditor will (if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met) have the right to recover from the keeper so much of that amount as remains unpaid;
    (g)inform the keeper of any discount offered for prompt payment and the arrangements for the resolution of disputes or complaints that are available;

    (h)identify the creditor and specify how and to whom payment or notification to the creditor may be made;

    (i)specify the date on which the notice is sent (where it is sent by post) or given (in any other case).

    Which part if any, is relevant to my case?

    Many Thanks
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 12th Mar 17, 11:29 PM
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    Coupon-mad
    However the alleged incident took place on 11/01/2017 and the NTK is dated 31/01/2017, so how can I claim this is out of time?
    Because it is! A postal PCN should be ''a notice to keeper for the purposes of paragraph 6(1)(b)'' so read 6(1)(b) to understand the deadline is 14 days.

    Which part if any, is relevant to my case?
    All of it. This PCN is not POFA one so has none of the mandatory wording stated in Para 9. Look especially at 9(2)f...
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Biglad74
    • By Biglad74 13th Mar 17, 9:28 PM
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    Biglad74
    Updated Draft, please read and comment.
    Because it is! A postal PCN should be ''a notice to keeper for the purposes of paragraph 6(1)(b)'' so read 6(1)(b) to understand the deadline is 14 days.


    All of it. This PCN is not POFA one so has none of the mandatory wording stated in Para 9. Look especially at 9(2)f...
    Originally posted by Coupon-mad
    Ok, I have altered the draft appeal, by adding a further point (which I have added as point 1 and re numbered the others accordingly) outlining why the NTK does not comply with POFA 12.
    I have included this below and be grateful if you could take a look over it.

    1. The Notice to Keeper is in fact incorrect and does not comply with the POFA 2012 legislation. Specifically paragraph 4 which states :-


    “Right to claim unpaid parking charges from keeper of vehicle
    4(1)The creditor has the right to recover any unpaid parking charges from the keeper of the vehicle.
    (2)The right under this paragraph applies only if
    (a)the conditions specified in paragraphs 5, 6, 11 and 12 (so far as applicable) are met; and
    (b)the vehicle was not a stolen vehicle at the beginning of the period of parking to which the unpaid parking charges relate.”

    Paragraph 6 then goes onto outline the conditions :-
    6(1)The second condition is that the creditor (or a person acting for or on behalf of the creditor)—
    (a)has given a notice to driver in accordance with paragraph 7, followed by a notice to keeper in accordance with paragraph 8; or
    (b)has given a notice to keeper in accordance with paragraph 9.

    The conditions required to be met in paragraph 9 are detailed below and I draw your particular attention to points in subsection 2f and 5 which are marked in bold text :-
    9(1)A notice which is to be relied on as a notice to keeper for the purposes of paragraph 6(1)(b) is given in accordance with this paragraph if the following requirements are met.
    (2)The notice must—
    (a)specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;
    (b)inform the keeper that the driver is required to pay parking charges in respect of the specified period of parking and that the parking charges have not been paid in full;
    (c)describe the parking charges due from the driver as at the end of that period, the circumstances in which the requirement to pay them arose (including the means by which the requirement was brought to the attention of drivers) and the other facts that made them payable;
    (d)specify the total amount of those parking charges that are unpaid, as at a time which is—
    (i)specified in the notice; and
    (ii)no later than the end of the day before the day on which the notice is either sent by post or, as the case may be, handed to or left at a current address for service for the keeper (see sub-paragraph (4));
    (e)state that the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and invite the keeper—
    (i)to pay the unpaid parking charges; or
    (ii)if the keeper was not the driver of the vehicle, to notify the creditor of the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and to pass the notice on to the driver;
    (f)warn the keeper that if, after the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given—
    (i)the amount of the unpaid parking charges specified under paragraph (d) has not been paid in full, and
    (ii)the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver,
    the creditor will (if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met) have the right to recover from the keeper so much of that amount as remains unpaid;
    (g)inform the keeper of any discount offered for prompt payment and the arrangements for the resolution of disputes or complaints that are available;
    (h)identify the creditor and specify how and to whom payment or notification to the creditor may be made;
    (i)specify the date on which the notice is sent (where it is sent by post) or given (in any other case).
    (3)The notice must relate only to a single period of parking specified under sub-paragraph (2)(a) (but this does not prevent the giving of separate notices which each specify different parts of a single period of parking).
    (4)The notice must be given by—
    (a)handing it to the keeper, or leaving it at a current address for service for the keeper, within the relevant period; or
    (b)sending it by post to a current address for service for the keeper so that it is delivered to that address within the relevant period.
    (5)The relevant period for the purposes of sub-paragraph (4) is the period of 14 days beginning with the day after that on which the specified period of parking ended.
    (6)A notice sent by post is to be presumed, unless the contrary is proved, to have been delivered (and so “given” for the purposes of sub-paragraph (4)) on the second working day after the day on which it is posted; and for this purpose “working day” means any day other than a Saturday, Sunday or a public holiday in England and Wales.
    (7)When the notice is given it must be accompanied by any evidence prescribed under paragraph 10.
    (8)In sub-paragraph (2)(g) the reference to arrangements for the resolution of disputes or complaints includes—
    (a)any procedures offered by the creditor for dealing informally with representations by the keeper about the notice or any matter contained in it; and
    (b)any arrangements under which disputes or complaints (however described) may be referred by the keeper to independent adjudication or arbitration.

    Parking Eye Car park management has not complied with the above legislation, therefore making the Parking Charge Notice sent to myself, as the registered keeper, invalid
    • Biglad74
    • By Biglad74 14th Mar 17, 10:20 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    Biglad74
    Amended Appeal, advice please
    Hi,
    I have amended my appeal to include an extra paragraph. Could someone have a look at the amended part and offer some advice, good or bad. Thanks
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 15th Mar 17, 2:33 PM
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    Coupon-mad
    Put this bit in bold and state the dates of your NTK:

    (5)The relevant period for the purposes of sub-paragraph (4) is the period of 14 days beginning with the day after that on which the specified period of parking ended.
    Or copy parts of this perfect example of a PE appeal about their 'blank space' PCN version with no reference to keeper liability or the POFA.

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=72247892#post72247892

    HTH
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Biglad74
    • By Biglad74 16th Mar 17, 11:33 AM
    • 14 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    Biglad74
    Put this bit in bold and state the dates of your NTK:



    Or copy parts of this perfect example of a PE appeal about their 'blank space' PCN version with no reference to keeper liability or the POFA.

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=72247892#post72247892

    HTH
    Originally posted by Coupon-mad
    Thanks, for the input. I have copied part of the other case about POFA and added that to the start my appeal.
    I shall scan it and upload it to the POPLA website along with a couple of photographs during the next day or so hopefully.
    Does anyone know roughly how long it takes POPLA to make a decision on a case?
    Thanks
    • Sexylegs24
    • By Sexylegs24 16th Mar 17, 12:29 PM
    • 1 Posts
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    Sexylegs24
    Hi I apologise if I've posted In the Wrong place but I have no idea how to set up a new post .
    I received a letter in 2011 to say that I had overstayed on the car park , it was not long but they wanted to charge a ridiculous amount for a few extra minutes anyway I ignored everything from then on as lots of people were recommending I just ignore this and since then I have received a number of correspondence asking for more money and they have now sent me a letter asking for £267.16 for court costs , this last letter is from the county court business centre .
    I'm not very good at knowing which information relates to this on the Forums and would appreciate some help on how to tackle this in simple step by step if possible . This is really starting to stress me out now and I'm thinking I should have given in at the start and just paid but I've come this far so hoping someone can help me get through this.
    I was only late back to the car as a lady in one of the shops was having an epileptic fit and I was one of the only people who bothered to help her .
    • DoaM
    • By DoaM 16th Mar 17, 12:38 PM
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    DoaM
    Please start your own new thread ... you WILL NOT get any help in this thread - here we work on the basis of 1 case/1 thread. Read the NEWBIES sticky FAQ first.

    @Biglad74 ... It may be a case of "how long is a piece of string?". Some of the other regulars may be along shortly with extra info, if they happen to know the current lead times.
    Diary of a madman
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    • Fruitcake
    • By Fruitcake 16th Mar 17, 12:39 PM
    • 38,962 Posts
    • 77,736 Thanks
    Fruitcake
    Hi I apologise if I've posted In the Wrong place but I have no idea how to set up a new post .
    I received a letter in 2011 to say that I had overstayed on the car park , it was not long but they wanted to charge a ridiculous amount for a few extra minutes anyway I ignored everything from then on as lots of people were recommending I just ignore this and since then I have received a number of correspondence asking for more money and they have now sent me a letter asking for £267.16 for court costs , this last letter is from the county court business centre .
    I'm not very good at knowing which information relates to this on the Forums and would appreciate some help on how to tackle this in simple step by step if possible . This is really starting to stress me out now and I'm thinking I should have given in at the start and just paid but I've come this far so hoping someone can help me get through this.
    I was only late back to the car as a lady in one of the shops was having an epileptic fit and I was one of the only people who bothered to help her .
    Originally posted by Sexylegs24
    Look at post 27 and follow the guidance in Coupon-mad's signature on how to find the NEWBES thread.

    Once you are on the page showing the NEWBIES thread you will find a New Thread button.

    Alternatively, scroll to the top right of this page and click on the Forum Jump GO button and it will take you straight there.
    I married my cousin. I had to...
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    • Biglad74
    • By Biglad74 17th Apr 17, 11:24 AM
    • 14 Posts
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    Biglad74
    Success!
    Hi all, just a quick update.
    I received an email from POPLA saying that Parking Eye do not wish to contest the appeal and I do not have to pay the parking charge
    Shortly after I recieved an email from Parking Eye saying that the parking charge had been cancelled.
    Thanks to the regular's on the forum that took the time to reply to my questions and offer advice/help where needed. There is all the info needed on here to help, but it is a question of finding it and as a newbie can be a bit daunting.
    I submitted the appeal by email on the 19/03/2017 and the replies came back on the 07/04/2017, so around 3 weeks to get a conclusion.
    Thanks again to all those that helped
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 17th Apr 17, 11:43 AM
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    Coupon-mad
    Yay! That's great news!
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the trail, top of this page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Bashstreetkid
    • By Bashstreetkid 17th Apr 17, 9:27 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Bashstreetkid
    Great News Indeed ! Albion in the Prem. !
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