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  • FIRST POST
    • Cbella38
    • By Cbella38 11th Feb 17, 4:53 PM
    • 91Posts
    • 17Thanks
    Cbella38
    Help needed
    • #1
    • 11th Feb 17, 4:53 PM
    Help needed 11th Feb 17 at 4:53 PM

    Please can you help .

    My mom owns a car and has a named driver or drivers on the insurance.

    Last October the driver took their daughter to have her college interview and parked in a Euro Parking car park and paid for their hours stay as they weren't going to be there long.

    Now a bit of background on the driver

    They have an ileostomy- so a stoma if your not aware of what it is and they have to wear bags and they have days where the bags can fill up so quickly without warning of fluid that they have to empty the bag because if they don't they risk burns to their skin and leaks.

    Anyway on their way out of the college their bag filled up with fluid so have to do a detour to the toilet, sanitize the area as they are at high risk of infection ..empty the bag, clean up and then they left

    by the time they got to the car it was 4 MINUTES over the ticket they had BOUGHT for the hour stay and had a parking warden telling them they were going to issue a ticket .

    The driver told him reason they were a little late but he wasn't interested .

    A few weeks later my mom got a letter went into mad panic but the driver said they are not paying it as they were only 4 minutes over for starters, have a condition that is beyond their control at times and things happen, and not gonna pay for a 2 hour stay when only going to be there an hour of that.

    Anyway my mom insisted that the driver wrote to them so they did and enclosed the medical card, information about an ileostomy and also what the government say about parking "fines" and how we have a 10 minute grace period.

    But they still won't have it anyway after advice we ignored any more letters but today my mom received a letter from a Solicitors called Gladstones Ltd saying they want to take it to court .

    What should I do ?

    It feel like the driver is being discriminated against all because they have something which they have to have and don't have control over and it's not like the driver couldn't be bothered to pay as they did pay for the stay.

    Really need some sound advice
    Last edited by Cbella38; 11-02-2017 at 8:30 PM.
Page 4
    • Cbella38
    • By Cbella38 9th Mar 17, 9:55 AM
    • 91 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    Cbella38
    This is soooooo helpful THANK YOU. The KEEPER did not respond to the NTK the DRIVER did giving FULL account as to what happened on that day and gave FULL NAME AND ADDRESS but still everything was sent to KEEPER and first letter back from Parking company addressed letter as.if the KEEPER had written then letter yet it was the driver they should have written too.
    • waamo
    • By waamo 9th Mar 17, 10:23 AM
    • 2,159 Posts
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    waamo
    It also doesn't matter who names the driver. The keeper can give the details or the driver themselves can fess up. All that matters is the company have the drivers details.

    Read POFA a few times. Honestly the penny will drop, it might take a while but it will.

    Whilst you have a pretty cast iron defence (on the face of things) throw the kitchen sink at it. Use every point possible. A judge only has to find one point in your favour and it's game over for the PPC.
    This space for hire.
    • Cbella38
    • By Cbella38 9th Mar 17, 10:27 AM
    • 91 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    Cbella38
    Let me Re write defence then repost
    • safarmuk
    • By safarmuk 9th Mar 17, 10:30 AM
    • 613 Posts
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    safarmuk
    It also doesn't matter who names the driver. The keeper can give the details or the driver themselves can fess up. All that matters is the company have the drivers details.
    Indeed, but the key thing here is that CBella has proof that the driver was named. Was there a letter with Proof of Posting or an email with a Delivery Receipt or was it all done over the phone?

    Whilst you have a pretty cast iron defence (on the face of things) throw the kitchen sink at it. Use every point possible. A judge only has to find one point in your favour and it's game over for the PPC.
    Agree, if the point above is evidenced and they are proven to be pursuing the wrong person then they should lose in the Small Claims Court. If this happens can they then subsequently start pursuing the driver for this PCN?
    Last edited by safarmuk; 09-03-2017 at 12:31 PM.
    • Cbella38
    • By Cbella38 9th Mar 17, 11:37 AM
    • 91 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    Cbella38
    All letters was sent via post but no correspondence was made to driver
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 9th Mar 17, 11:39 AM
    • 51,855 Posts
    • 65,486 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    This is soooooo helpful THANK YOU. The KEEPER did not respond to the NTK the DRIVER did giving FULL account as to what happened on that day and gave FULL NAME AND ADDRESS but still everything was sent to KEEPER and first letter back from Parking company addressed letter as.if the KEEPER had written then letter yet it was the driver they should have written too.
    Originally posted by Cbella38
    Put that in the defence as well. Once they know the driver they cannot pursue a keeper, as others have said. But did they get the letter?

    Can you prove it at the hearing (copy letter/proof of posting?).
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • Cbella38
    • By Cbella38 9th Mar 17, 11:41 AM
    • 91 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    Cbella38
    This is what is wanted so DRIVER can argue case as I believe I have a strong case. Therefore do I still write a defence statement and now your understanding why it's different to other Gladstone defences what are the details that need to be put in ? Shall I just phone the court and see if can speak to someone ?
    • Cbella38
    • By Cbella38 9th Mar 17, 11:42 AM
    • 91 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    Cbella38
    Yes they got letter because responded to it but wrote as if responding to keeper not driver yet keeper didn't write letter
    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 9th Mar 17, 11:48 AM
    • 7,429 Posts
    • 6,480 Thanks
    The Deep
    I am not convinced that this is anything but a slam dunk win for the appellant.

    Am I being simplistic in thinking that all the RK needs to say is "Sir/madam. I was not the driver. The driver has been named to the PPC and this action is ill considered/vexatious. May I have some money for my wasted time please?
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • Cbella38
    • By Cbella38 9th Mar 17, 11:53 AM
    • 91 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    Cbella38
    Thinks RK and Driver deserve compo nothing but stressful situation
    • Cbella38
    • By Cbella38 9th May 17, 10:04 AM
    • 91 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    Cbella38
    *UPDATE *

    RK still keeps getting letters despite DRIVER giving them all information needed.

    Sent defence papers to court, had a reply from GLADSTONES and they want to settle outside of court.

    RK wrote back to court saying they have nothing to do with this and to please contact driver .

    Letter back from court was received about going through mediation - does RK agree to this and driver goes with them ?

    Does RK contact or even driver contact Gladstones to explain situation again as they simply don't get it ?

    Euro car park even wrote back to the MP who acted upon this as felt it was out of order and they admit they have a 10 minute grace period and the driver in fact returned the the car just over 8 mins so under the 10 min grace period and admitted no fine was place into the hand of driver or on windscreen.

    So where do we go from here ?
    • beamerguy
    • By beamerguy 9th May 17, 10:33 AM
    • 6,479 Posts
    • 8,312 Thanks
    beamerguy
    *UPDATE *

    RK still keeps getting letters despite DRIVER giving them all information needed.

    Sent defence papers to court, had a reply from GLADSTONES and they want to settle outside of court.

    RK wrote back to court saying they have nothing to do with this and to please contact driver .

    Letter back from court was received about going through mediation - does RK agree to this and driver goes with them ?

    Does RK contact or even driver contact Gladstones to explain situation again as they simply don't get it ?

    Euro car park even wrote back to the MP who acted upon this as felt it was out of order and they admit they have a 10 minute grace period and the driver in fact returned the the car just over 8 mins so under the 10 min grace period and admitted no fine was place into the hand of driver or on windscreen.

    So where do we go from here ?
    Originally posted by Cbella38
    An unreal story all about scammers

    The reason Gladstones "don't get it", is because they are a highly incompetent solicitors.

    Of course they would like you to settle out of court, they try the scam on to the very last minute before they discontinue

    The trouble with mediation is the lack of knowledge of the great parking scam by the mediator, Gladstones know this and such action suggests they already know they are on a loser.

    With everything you say, it points to a huge whooping in court by a judge. Will not be the first time Gladstones have been whooped for complete incompetence

    You want a judge to hear the case
    RBS - MNBA - CAPITAL ONE - LLOYDS

    DISGUSTING BEHAVIOUR
    • IamEmanresu
    • By IamEmanresu 9th May 17, 11:37 AM
    • 1,819 Posts
    • 3,214 Thanks
    IamEmanresu
    You might want to send a Letter before Claim to EPS for the misuse of your personal data. Give them 14 days to pay compo or face the court.

    If the parking charge case goes to court and you win, the win will cement the basis of the DPA claim against EPS.

    Gives EPS the choice to drop it or suffer later. Don't mess around with mediation.
    Life's for living, get on with it rather than worrying about these. If they hassle, counter claim.

    Send them that costs schedule though, 24 hours before the hearing, and file it with the court. Take with you evidence that you have sent the costs schedule to them and when.
    LoC
    • Cbella38
    • By Cbella38 9th May 17, 11:45 AM
    • 91 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    Cbella38
    Too right I want a judge to hear this case , therefore any guidance or examples of a letter that can be sent to EPS. ? Thanks for your help by the way
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 9th May 17, 4:38 PM
    • 15,956 Posts
    • 24,760 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    Too right I want a judge to hear this case , therefore any guidance or examples of a letter that can be sent to EPS. ? Thanks for your help by the way
    Originally posted by Cbella38
    Read through the following which cover LBCs. You can no doubt draw up your own from the various examples provided, especially those in 'thebridesmother' templates.

    http://www.parking-prankster.com/letter-before-action.html

    http://www.parkingcowboys.co.uk/letter-before-claim/

    http://www.thebridesmother.co.uk/Media/Templates.pdf
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • Cbella38
    • By Cbella38 11th May 17, 10:09 AM
    • 91 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    Cbella38
    How does this read before it is sent?

    Ref PCN No. xxxxx

    I am in receipt of the NTK above, as the registered keeper. I have duly passed your letter across to the driver but I am not obliged to pass on any personal identity so decline to do so. You had an opportunity to invoke keeper liability under the provisions of the Protection of Freedoms Act, clause 12 which was enacted specifically to aid you in these circumstances but that you have chosen not to use the route to keeper liability. I was not the driver so there is no reason to suggest or infer otherwise.

    As a consequence you fall short of imposing any liability to myself as the registered keeper.
    So that you are fully informed I attach a witness statement which evidences that I was not the driver at the time of the contravention.

    Whether or not the driver contacts you directly having been advised of your notice, is of no concern to me, although I am aware driver may have already contacted you, explaining the situation and their disability and as to why were a few minutes late back to the car, which is something beyond their control. My part in this matter is now concluded and I require you to remove my personal details from your system as they are no longer relevant to you.

    I also attach a copy of the letter you sent back to the MP admitting you have a 10 minute grace period and the driver was back within the 10 minute period and that in fact no ticket was issued to the driver either by hand or placed onto the car windscreen.

    WARNING

    As I have no liability in this matter, and the ticket details have been passed to the driver, I now place you on warning that you have no reasonable cause to continue using my personal data. If you continue your claim against me, or correspond further via any third party debt collection company being Gladstones or anyone else you will be subject to a claim of damages for a breach of the Data Protection Act. The claim amount will be determined by the amount of aggravation I am subject to prior to its issue in a County Court claim. Please note that this situation has caused great amount of stress that is not needed and you have in fact made the driver to become even more distressed and as a result made her condition worse and now has depression brought on by this situation and is rather poorly because of all of this.

    A copy of this has been issued to the court for their reference.
    • waamo
    • By waamo 11th May 17, 10:23 AM
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    • 2,580 Thanks
    waamo
    To me that sounds like you haven't named the driver and are declining to do so.

    I would hammer home the point the driver has named themselves and provided their contact details.

    Don't be afraid to put it in your own words.
    This space for hire.
    • safarmuk
    • By safarmuk 11th May 17, 11:10 AM
    • 613 Posts
    • 1,125 Thanks
    safarmuk
    As I have no liability in this matter, and the ticket details have been passed to the driver, I now place you on warning that you have no reasonable cause to continue using my personal data. If you continue your claim against me, or correspond further via any third party debt collection company being Gladstones or anyone else you will be subject to a claim of damages for a breach of the Data Protection Act. The claim amount will be determined by the amount of aggravation I am subject to prior to its issue in a County Court claim. Please note that this situation has caused great amount of stress that is not needed and you have in fact made the driver to become even more distressed and as a result made her condition worse and now has depression brought on by this situation and is rather poorly because of all of this.
    The only point here is it would be you - the RK - claiming for a breach of the DPA. But you are talking about the distress caused to the Driver. If the RK brought the DPA breach to court then I am not sure the RK could claim for distress caused to the Driver?
    • Cbella38
    • By Cbella38 14th Jul 17, 10:54 PM
    • 91 Posts
    • 17 Thanks
    Cbella38
    *UPDATE*

    Had to reply to court saying wanted to see the judge and the first lot of paper got 'mislaid' so having emailed the court they sent more forms to which they were completed again and this time record delivered back to the courts.

    Then RK got a letter saying that missed the date and now got to pay a fine. Driver has said they want to see the judge over this case and RK has emailed court to say NO MONEY will be paid as want the opportunity to see the judge.

    After emailing Euro Car Park with the above letter not, not heard nothing else from them or the solicitors.

    What more can be done with the court as want to see someone about this case as so unfair.

    RK and driver are willing to get to court as not settle outside like ECP want.

    Any advice would be great
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 14th Jul 17, 11:04 PM
    • 51,855 Posts
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    Coupon-mad
    Then RK got a letter saying that missed the date and now got to pay a fine.
    What? You missed a hearing, or you didn't send a Witness Statement in time?

    It's not a fine and it's not Euro Car Parks, either, so your eye for detail is a worry. What have you missed?
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

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