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  • FIRST POST
    • glasgowm148
    • By glasgowm148 29th Jan 17, 5:55 PM
    • 143Posts
    • 195Thanks
    glasgowm148
    Getting money owed to me
    • #1
    • 29th Jan 17, 5:55 PM
    Getting money owed to me 29th Jan 17 at 5:55 PM
    Not sure if this is the right forum but wasn't sure where else to post it.

    A guy I used to work with owes me 470 - 120 of that was hosting fees a client left in the office for me and he took to give me (and never did!). The rest was for some work I done for him (graphic design).

    I have the invoice I sent him for the work, and acknowledgement of the debt (him saying he'd have it soon, etc). I have no proof of the 120 other than texts he's sent me.

    Where do I go from here? He just ignores my calls/emails. I have full control over his website/emails and in my rage I've considered just shutting him down but I'd rather solve this reasonably..

    I've looked into small claims - would this be my best route? He's an absolute chancer so I don't even think he'd pay up after that. I also don't have his current address since his gf kicked him out.

    I'm in Scotland
    Last edited by glasgowm148; 29-01-2017 at 5:58 PM.
Page 1
    • Arleen
    • By Arleen 29th Jan 17, 6:00 PM
    • 826 Posts
    • 601 Thanks
    Arleen
    • #2
    • 29th Jan 17, 6:00 PM
    • #2
    • 29th Jan 17, 6:00 PM
    Whatever is equivalent of small claims court in Scotland. This way he will either have to pay it up or get a mark on his credit file, so that is something. But if he doesn't want to pay up, and doesn't care about the mark, you won't be getting money back (not worth trying to collect it unless you are certain you can easily find it).

    I absolutely would not touch his website or email in any way shape or form. And unless you need this access for any actual reason, other than revenge, delete them (access credentials) to not be tempted.
    Last edited by Arleen; 29-01-2017 at 6:02 PM.
    • glasgowm148
    • By glasgowm148 29th Jan 17, 6:05 PM
    • 143 Posts
    • 195 Thanks
    glasgowm148
    • #3
    • 29th Jan 17, 6:05 PM
    • #3
    • 29th Jan 17, 6:05 PM
    How will they be able to find him without an address? Would I need to find that first?
    • Arleen
    • By Arleen 29th Jan 17, 6:10 PM
    • 826 Posts
    • 601 Thanks
    Arleen
    • #4
    • 29th Jan 17, 6:10 PM
    • #4
    • 29th Jan 17, 6:10 PM
    How can you invoice him but not have an address? According to http://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/taking-action/simple-procedure you may want to contract your local sheriff court, and they will be able to advise you on the process of address unknown.

    But in future, get a contract. Or at least full details for invoice.
    • Pixie5740
    • By Pixie5740 29th Jan 17, 7:58 PM
    • 10,093 Posts
    • 13,870 Thanks
    Pixie5740
    • #5
    • 29th Jan 17, 7:58 PM
    • #5
    • 29th Jan 17, 7:58 PM
    You could try 192.com or Monkey Finder to track him down. Companies House could be another avenue if he has a limited company.
    Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen pounds nineteen and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds nought and six, result misery.
    • DebtFreeDebbie
    • By DebtFreeDebbie 30th Jan 17, 1:24 AM
    • 14 Posts
    • 19 Thanks
    DebtFreeDebbie
    • #6
    • 30th Jan 17, 1:24 AM
    • #6
    • 30th Jan 17, 1:24 AM
    Though not particularly helpful for an amicable end result, I had a friend who worked on someone's website. At the end of the day, the client disappeared and didn't pay a cent. Only thing is, they didn't change the login information, so my friend still had access to the site. She changed passwords, and then spent the next month gradually lowering the opacity of the site's on-page stuff (text / images etc) via CSS, accompanied by an email saying she'd keep doing it until she was paid. That thing was barely visible by the time they finally paid up lol.

    An option for you? Possibly. Otherwise, local authorities or 192.com are likely your best bet.
    • dieselv2
    • By dieselv2 30th Jan 17, 1:29 AM
    • 156 Posts
    • 92 Thanks
    dieselv2
    • #7
    • 30th Jan 17, 1:29 AM
    • #7
    • 30th Jan 17, 1:29 AM
    Has he blocked you on Facebook? How about a private message on there saying you need payment or will apply for a CCJ to be taken out against him. A few words to scare him.

    If it's allowed that is haha
    Start of 2017 Debt: 15,889 | 31st Jan 2017 Debt: 13,400 | 16% Repaid
    • Arleen
    • By Arleen 30th Jan 17, 2:38 AM
    • 826 Posts
    • 601 Thanks
    Arleen
    • #8
    • 30th Jan 17, 2:38 AM
    • #8
    • 30th Jan 17, 2:38 AM
    Though not particularly helpful for an amicable end result, I had a friend who worked on someone's website. At the end of the day, the client disappeared and didn't pay a cent. Only thing is, they didn't change the login information, so my friend still had access to the site. She changed passwords, and then spent the next month gradually lowering the opacity of the site's on-page stuff (text / images etc) via CSS, accompanied by an email saying she'd keep doing it until she was paid. That thing was barely visible by the time they finally paid up lol.
    Originally posted by DebtFreeDebbie
    That is a dumb thing to do. Just because friend still has login information does not mean that your friend is allowed to access the resource, and for sure has no right to deface it. If he keeps doing that, one day one of those clients will, rightfully, go to the police.
    • leespot
    • By leespot 30th Jan 17, 7:29 AM
    • 484 Posts
    • 379 Thanks
    leespot
    • #9
    • 30th Jan 17, 7:29 AM
    • #9
    • 30th Jan 17, 7:29 AM
    The OP still owns the work they haven't been paid for - it would not be unreasonable for them to remove their design work from the website. Only remove the work you haven't been paid for, though.
    • MEM62
    • By MEM62 30th Jan 17, 10:54 AM
    • 1,194 Posts
    • 827 Thanks
    MEM62
    If you want instant pressure I would view the 120 is a simple case of theft. Why not report it as such?
    • Arleen
    • By Arleen 30th Jan 17, 12:07 PM
    • 826 Posts
    • 601 Thanks
    Arleen
    The OP still owns the work they haven't been paid for - it would not be unreasonable for them to remove their design work from the website. Only remove the work you haven't been paid for, though.
    Originally posted by leespot
    It's not that simple, and this is 15 years of IT contracting/outsourcing talking.
    While the client is in breach of contract, no argument about that, that doesn't give you right to break into client computer systems (that is what you are doing, as there is no reason for you to think that you have the right to take stuff from his website). Nor gives it your the right to deface his website on top of it. What it does is provides you with a legal remedy of going to courts which can then rectify the situation in any way they see fit. But we are not to take justice in our hands, like some vandalism-vigilante.

    The pro tip for small contracts, which are not worth chasing up through courts, is to not work a minute before getting 50% of money down and deliver the work to the client only after full and final payment. Until then display it on your server/laptop. Ideally as JPEG so they can't just cut it out themselves if they are that sneaky. This way in the very worst case you at least will have half of the money for the work.
    Last edited by Arleen; 30-01-2017 at 12:12 PM.
    • MataNui
    • By MataNui 30th Jan 17, 1:47 PM
    • 753 Posts
    • 375 Thanks
    MataNui
    It's not that simple, and this is 15 years of IT contracting/outsourcing talking.
    While the client is in breach of contract, no argument about that, that doesn't give you right to break into client computer systems (that is what you are doing, as there is no reason for you to think that you have the right to take stuff from his website). Nor gives it your the right to deface his website on top of it. What it does is provides you with a legal remedy of going to courts which can then rectify the situation in any way they see fit. But we are not to take justice in our hands, like some vandalism-vigilante.
    Originally posted by Arleen
    Well thats not exactly true. We dont know the details of the original contract (if it was design work only or design and hosting) or why/how the OP has control over the website/email. If it was just for design and the OP only has those details as a convenience or favor for the debtor then you would be right. If it was for creation/hosting etc and the OP has control for that reason then its entirely within his rights to remove access or remove/delete any work for which he has not been paid as he is not 'breaking in' or otherwise accessing anything owned by the client. He would simply be withdrawing the service he has not been paid for.
    • Arleen
    • By Arleen 30th Jan 17, 2:04 PM
    • 826 Posts
    • 601 Thanks
    Arleen
    Well thats not exactly true. We dont know the details of the original contract (if it was design work only or design and hosting) or why/how the OP has control over the website/email. If it was just for design and the OP only has those details as a convenience or favor for the debtor then you would be right. If it was for creation/hosting etc and the OP has control for that reason then its entirely within his rights to remove access or remove/delete any work for which he has not been paid as he is not 'breaking in' or otherwise accessing anything owned by the client. He would simply be withdrawing the service he has not been paid for.
    Originally posted by MataNui
    Reply you quote was in context of the friend story, where there was no hosting debacle - simply access of convinience.

    As for applying it to OP, I imagine that there is no contract for nothing, so we can be guessing all day what are the provisions for shutdown due to non-payment. For sure shutdown after reasonalbe attempts to contact him and past payment date is fine, although you really want a contracct when hosting stuff for people that lays out all those details, including what happens with the data in case of a shut down.

    But I am not so sure that you have rigth to meddle with those files, especially when there are no signed T&C. In the end you are renting out a space to host those files, and doing so doesn't grant you rights to them, at least that is what common sense dictates and what is a standard point for hosting T&C.
    • Cap Hero
    • By Cap Hero 30th Jan 17, 7:43 PM
    • 102 Posts
    • 172 Thanks
    Cap Hero
    Though not particularly helpful for an amicable end result, I had a friend who worked on someone's website. At the end of the day, the client disappeared and didn't pay a cent. Only thing is, they didn't change the login information, so my friend still had access to the site. She changed passwords, and then spent the next month gradually lowering the opacity of the site's on-page stuff (text / images etc) via CSS, accompanied by an email saying she'd keep doing it until she was paid. That thing was barely visible by the time they finally paid up lol.

    An option for you? Possibly. Otherwise, local authorities or 192.com are likely your best bet.
    Originally posted by DebtFreeDebbie

    This seems like an amicable solution, prior to potentially taking the site completely offline lol!
    • Sleazy
    • By Sleazy 30th Jan 17, 7:48 PM
    • 5,038 Posts
    • 3,954 Thanks
    Sleazy
    Has he blocked you on Facebook? How about a private message on there saying you need payment or will apply for a CCJ to be taken out against him. A few words to scare him.

    If it's allowed that is haha
    Originally posted by dieselv2
    Depends if he's classed as a minority
    Signed Sleazy
    Otherwise known as the Lounge Lizard
    • Nostrus
    • By Nostrus 15th Mar 17, 3:50 PM
    • 8 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    Nostrus
    In short, you want to raise a Simple Procedure case against him. Small Claims ceased to exist in Scotland on 28th November 2016.
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