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  • FIRST POST
    • anorakus
    • By anorakus 9th Jan 17, 7:35 PM
    • 3Posts
    • 3Thanks
    anorakus
    UK CPM - resident parking in resident's bay w/o permit - Gladstones letter
    • #1
    • 9th Jan 17, 7:35 PM
    UK CPM - resident parking in resident's bay w/o permit - Gladstones letter 9th Jan 17 at 7:35 PM
    I'd be grateful if someone could point me in the direction of some suitable wording for the court paperwork, should it be needed..

    Brief circs:

    We have owned our flat with a residents' parking area for several years. The parking area was controlled by a barrier when we moved in (this is referred to in the leasehold agreement, which gives residents permission to park in the non-allocated spaces). Some time afterwards, this changed to a permit system.

    In spring 2016, UK CPM took over policing the car park from UKPC. Each resident was given one resident's permit and a visitor's permit. As we have two cars, we asked for an additional resident's permit, which the management company took a few weeks to provide. In the meantime, my car got a ticket for not displaying a resident's permit.

    CPM and DRP sent the usual threatening letters which I ignored (yes I was taking a calculated risk). After going quiet for a few months, they have followed up with a letter from Gladstone's demanding payment of £149 "or our client may instruct us to take legal action against you".

    Thanks for any help,

    A.
    Last edited by anorakus; 09-01-2017 at 7:57 PM.
Page 1
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 9th Jan 17, 8:26 PM
    • 49,944 Posts
    • 63,353 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #2
    • 9th Jan 17, 8:26 PM
    • #2
    • 9th Jan 17, 8:26 PM
    Well you certainly have grounds to defend a claim here and to counter-claim under the DPA, it seems to me. Your case ticks a lot of boxes in your favour.

    I would start with a response a bit like this one, only quote your leasehold agreement, which gives residents permission to park in the non-allocated spaces, and point out you were there first (basically) and have primacy of contract:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5521723&page=2

    You can add more because you OWN the flat, giving you title and rights of way/rights to park (more than most tenants we see here). You can say that the temporary reduction in the provision of parking spaces you and your wife had previously enjoyed for both cars, without incident or interference for many years under the grant of the lease, is a case of derogation from grant. Refer them to Saeed v Plustrade (seems similar, a managing agent cannot reduce the parking spaces available nor charge for them) and Pace v Mr N (transcript available from the Parking Prankster under 'case law') and Jopson v Homeguard which is also available and was a persuasive Appeal decision, as summarised and linked here:

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/residential-parking.html

    I would then continue in the style of this sort of wording:

    It is apparent that your clients have breached the KADOE rules, by obtaining my data from the Secretary of State (via the DVLA) without reasonable cause at a location where the residents of this property enjoy rights under a pre-existing lease. This makes the data processing unlawful and UKCPM have no excuse; when contracting to enforce parking charges at a residential site they have a duty to pay regard to the lawful rights of those living there and to ascertain what arrangements already exist under leasehold agreements.

    This misuse of my data and unwarranted, unwelcome demand and escalation to debt collector letters and your threat of court, has caused me significant harassment and distress. As agents for the landowner, all parties are responsible for a clear breach of the DPA Principles in processing my data, obtained from the DVLA without reasonable cause. UKCPM and their client can now be pursued in court by me for compensation, both having joint and several liability for the conduct of the data controller, UKCPM.

    I will serve notice separately on UKCPM's client, should I decide to issue a claim and you should pass a copy of this letter to UKCPM immediately.

    s13 of the DPA states under “Compensation for failure to comply with certain requirements” at 13(1) that:
    “An individual who suffers damage by reason of any contravention by a data controller of any of the requirements of this Act is entitled to compensation from the data controller for that damage”.

    Two significant authorities support my claim:

    Vidal-Hall v Google Inc [2015] EWCA 311

    and

    Halliday v Creation Consumer Finance Ltd [2013] EWCA Civ 333


    In Vidal-Hall, it was held by the Court of Appeal that compensation was payable upon the fact of breach and it was not necessary to quantify a pecuniary loss. In Halliday, the Court of Appeal held that a compensatory sum of £750 was ‘appropriate and sufficient’.

    Accordingly, since my case also involves significant data misuse by obtaining it from the DVLA without reasonable cause and outwith the KADOE and BPA CoP rules, my claim at this point in time, if settled within 14 days is in the mid range, namely in the sum of £450 which I will accept from UKCPM without recourse to their client if settled immediately.

    You and your client are further warned that should any party contact me again in pursuit of the 'parking charge', each breach may give rise to a further sum in compensation and £450 is a time-limited offer for UKCPM to settle their joint liability, whilst promising to cease and desist with issuing any tickets to our vehicles - VRNs xxx xxxx and xxx xxxx - the details of which are supplied solely for the purpose of allowing your client to include them in the location 'white (exempt) list' and not for any other purpose.

    I look forward to receiving your client's remittance and/or substantive response within 14 days of the date of this letter, failing which I will write to their clients. I intend to draw their attention to UKCPM's lack of due diligence and total disregard for the interests of the residents and their rights under the lease and will advise UKCPM's client of my proposed action against them both, for damages under the tort of misuse of my private information.

    yours faithfully,
    Last edited by Coupon-mad; 09-01-2017 at 8:33 PM.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • The Deep
    • By The Deep 9th Jan 17, 8:48 PM
    • 7,001 Posts
    • 6,067 Thanks
    The Deep
    • #3
    • 9th Jan 17, 8:48 PM
    • #3
    • 9th Jan 17, 8:48 PM
    Some reading


    http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?377246-UKPC-liable-for-trespass-**SUCCESS**

    https://bmpa.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/213077149-Milton-Keynes-woman-secures-landmark-victory-for-flat-tenants-in-parking-dispute

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/residential-parking.html

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/ukpc-hit-for-352-for-discontinuing.html

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/tenancy-agreement-not-overruled-by.html

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/link-parking-lose-in-wrexham-flat-owner_2.html

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/smart-parking-settle-out-of-court-for.html

    http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/tenancy-agreement-not-overruled-by.html
    You never know how far you can go until you go too far.
    • anorakus
    • By anorakus 9th Jan 17, 9:27 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    anorakus
    • #4
    • 9th Jan 17, 9:27 PM
    • #4
    • 9th Jan 17, 9:27 PM
    Fantastic, thanks for the replies and links!

    The letter from Gladstone's specifies that proposals should be sent to Debt Recovery Plus. Hopefully this will shut them up

    I've checked the relevant bit of the leasehold agreement.. it reads:

    The right in common with all others entitled thereto from time to time to park a domestic private motor vehicle in any free parking space other than those specifically allocated or to be allocated (if any)

    A.
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 9th Jan 17, 9:29 PM
    • 49,944 Posts
    • 63,353 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    • #5
    • 9th Jan 17, 9:29 PM
    • #5
    • 9th Jan 17, 9:29 PM
    Great wording in that lease. Pretty damning of this scam.

    You have primacy of contract and it's not just about shutting them up, you rally can sue for a 3 figure sum.
    PRIVATE PCN? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT TWO Clicks needed for advice:
    Top of the page: Home>>Forums>Household & Travel>Motoring>Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking - read the 'NEWBIES' FAQS thread!
    Advice to ignore is WRONG, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • anorakus
    • By anorakus 21st Jan 17, 3:06 AM
    • 3 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    anorakus
    • #6
    • 21st Jan 17, 3:06 AM
    • #6
    • 21st Jan 17, 3:06 AM
    Quick update - I e-mailed the management company of our flats asking them to contact the PPC to cancel the ticket. I pointed out that our leasehold agreement gave us the right to park private vehicles in the car park, and I quoted the case law above. I also threatened to take the PPC to the small claims court myself for breach of data protection if they persisted with a court case. I got a reply back a few days later confirming that the PPC was dropping the 'case' - result!

    Thanks for the advice, much appreciated. I know I could probably have got a few hundred £'s out of them through the small claims court, but TBH I didn't have the time and I just wanted them to go away. At least I don't have to worry about any more tickets in the future

    A.
    • safarmuk
    • By safarmuk 21st Jan 17, 9:43 AM
    • 456 Posts
    • 849 Thanks
    safarmuk
    • #7
    • 21st Jan 17, 9:43 AM
    • #7
    • 21st Jan 17, 9:43 AM
    Well be careful, they will continue to target residents whose permits 'fall of the dashboard' or genuine visitors and contractors ... my advice to you - based on experience - would be to get a written agreement from the Management Company that they agree to cancel any ticket sent to them from a genuine Leaseholder or Tenant without question.

    I'd also let your fellow residents know about this and make sure no resident has yet actually paid one of these PCNs. This kind of thing is happening all over right now and not everyone knows to come on here and get help - so please do spread the word.
    • beamerguy
    • By beamerguy 21st Jan 17, 10:10 AM
    • 5,936 Posts
    • 7,639 Thanks
    beamerguy
    • #8
    • 21st Jan 17, 10:10 AM
    • #8
    • 21st Jan 17, 10:10 AM
    I also threatened to take the PPC to the small claims court myself for breach of data protection if they persisted with a court case. I got a reply back a few days later confirming that the PPC was dropping the 'case' - result!
    Originally posted by anorakus
    Great result. They key seems to be "a breach of data protection"

    This is something that is going to hit and hurt PPC's in the future

    Please ensure that you let all the residents know of this as a reference point should they be attacked by these vermin.

    Your aim is to make this PPC redundant in the car park. Maybe they will not hang around for long but they will probably have to break a contract which could be very costly
    RBS - MNBA - CAPITAL ONE - LLOYDS

    DISGUSTING BEHAVIOUR
    • sdaspland
    • By sdaspland 15th Sep 17, 5:45 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    sdaspland
    • #9
    • 15th Sep 17, 5:45 PM
    • #9
    • 15th Sep 17, 5:45 PM
    Nice result 😀I wonder if someone could help me with my situation? I have started my own thread:
    Millenium parking services PCN

    Basically I rent a place where parking is provided and you have to enter with a fob as it has security gates, I don't have transport at the moment so borrow my girlfriends car a lot which has a permit on the screen in an old tax disc holder. This basically fell off one night and now she has received a NTK.

    Someone has advised on here that my MA should get this cancelled but I am in need of help on how to word the email to them and the PPC who are millenium parking services.

    Would really appreciate any help.
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 15th Sep 17, 7:29 PM
    • 14,503 Posts
    • 22,794 Thanks
    Umkomaas
    Nice result 😀I wonder if someone could help me with my situation? I have started my own thread:
    Millenium parking services PCN

    Basically I rent a place where parking is provided and you have to enter with a fob as it has security gates, I don't have transport at the moment so borrow my girlfriends car a lot which has a permit on the screen in an old tax disc holder. This basically fell off one night and now she has received a NTK.

    Someone has advised on here that my MA should get this cancelled but I am in need of help on how to word the email to them and the PPC who are millenium parking services.

    Would really appreciate any help.
    Originally posted by sdaspland
    Why are you resurrecting such an ancient thread that is neither your own, nor even about the same PPC?

    Was there anything wrong with the advice given to you in your own current thread?

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5711352

    Keep it all there please.
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • sdaspland
    • By sdaspland 15th Sep 17, 8:03 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    sdaspland
    I commented on here as the poster was helped out in the wording which is what I was after. The advice I received on my own post was much appreciated but I didn't want to risk wording the appeal wrong to the PPC and my MA. I was only after help!
    Thanks for your help!
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