Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • sods_law
    • By sods_law 2nd Jan 17, 8:30 PM
    • 12Posts
    • 6Thanks
    sods_law
    UKPC Parking Charge - Incorrect Vehicle Registration
    • #1
    • 2nd Jan 17, 8:30 PM
    UKPC Parking Charge - Incorrect Vehicle Registration 2nd Jan 17 at 8:30 PM
    Good evening all (and happy new year!),

    I am lucky enough to be on the receiving end of a UKPC Parking Charge. I have read the Newbies sticky and am aware of the process that needs to be followed, however on closer inspection of the Parking Charge, they have got my vehicle registration incorrect.

    I have tried a forum search but this does not seem to be a common topic. A quick google shows that the vehicle registration detailed on the Parking Charge is a registered vehicle.

    What is the best course of action here?
    (PS. I do feel slightly bad for the other vehicle owner for the pain they might now endure).
Page 2
    • sods_law
    • By sods_law 18th Mar 17, 5:59 PM
    • 12 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    sods_law
    Hi Coupon-mad,

    I think we have looked at this different ways. There are 2 options under para 6 of POFA:

    (a)has given a notice to driver in accordance with paragraph 7, followed by a notice to keeper in accordance with paragraph 8; or
    (b)has given a notice to keeper in accordance with paragraph 9.

    I have assumed that the NTD and NTK are unrelated, i.e. NTD under (a) which is invalid, and no NTK following this up, and a separate NTK issued under (b) outside of the 14 day period which applies to para 9 (because the notices are different references).

    Should I assume that only (a) applies and the NTD and NTK are related even though they have different charge numbers? If so then para 8 (c) has been not met as different information?

    Technically both of the above could be argued?
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 18th Mar 17, 8:04 PM
    • 44,071 Posts
    • 56,794 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    I agree - but you need to explain that to POPLA. Neither para 8 nor para 9 have been met, but don't expect a typically fairly clueless, template-happy POPLA Assessor to spot that without spoon-feeding by you.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the breadcrumb trail, top of page: Household & Travel > Motoring > Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking & READ THE 'NEWBIES' FAQS THREAD.
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • sods_law
    • By sods_law 18th Mar 17, 10:28 PM
    • 12 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    sods_law
    I am hoping this is as black and white as it can be now, I have just reposted my section, as the others are forum templates:

    I assume I am ok to submit the evidence to POPLA at this stage?


    1. The operator has not met the conditions of POFA 2012 for there to be keeper liability for the charge

    The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (POFA) allows a car park operator to hold the registered keeper liable for a parking charge where the driver that incurred a notice cannot be identified. In order for the keeper to me made liable the strict conditions of the POFA must be met. Where these conditions have not been met, the operator has no legal right to enforce any charge against the keeper.

    In order for there to be keeper liability, paragraph 6 of the POFA outlines the conditions required to be met by the operator;

    6 (1) The second condition is that the creditor (or a person acting for or on behalf of the creditor)—
    (a) has given a notice to driver in accordance with paragraph 7, followed by a notice to keeper in accordance with paragraph 8; or

    (b) has given a notice to keeper in accordance with paragraph 9.

    The first option (a) requires a notice to driver and notice to keeper as detailed in the relevant paragraphs as follows:

    Paragraph 7 of Schedule 4 of the POFA clearly identifies the requirements of a notice to driver:

    (1) A notice which is to be relied on as a notice to driver for the purposes of paragraph 6(1)(a) is given in accordance with this paragraph if the following requirements are met.

    (2) The notice must—

    (a) specify the vehicle, the relevant land on which it was parked and the period of parking to which the notice relates;

    The operator, UK Parking Control Ltd (UKPC) has failed to meet the first condition of paragraph 7 (2)(a). The notice to driver issued was for a vehicle with a different vehicle registration mark than the vehicle relevant to this appeal; therefore the condition requirements under Schedule 4 paragraph 6 (1) (a) have not been met and therefore there can be no keeper liability established by the operator for the charge under this point on the notice to driver.

    UKPC issued a notice to keeper on (date), paragraph 8 of the POFA details the conditions as follows:

    (1) A notice which is to be relied on as a notice to keeper for the purposes of paragraph 6(1)(a) is given in accordance with this paragraph if the following requirements are met.

    (2) The notice must—

    (c) state that a notice to driver relating to the specified period of parking has been given and repeat the information in that notice as required by paragraph 7(2)(b), (c) and (f);

    The notice to keeper issued by UKPC is provided with a different parking charge reference number, and different vehicle registration to that provided in the notice to driver. This therefore fails to meet the condition in paragraph 8 (1) (c) as detailed above, as the information provided is different. UKPC have therefore also failed to meet this condition under paragraph 6 (1) (a), and therefore no keeper liability can be established by the operator under this point on notice to keeper.

    If the notice to keeper was issued as a condition detailed in paragraph 6 (1) (b);

    (b)has given a notice to keeper in accordance with paragraph 9.

    Paragraph 9 of Schedule 4 of the POFA clearly identifies the requirements of a notice to keeper:

    (1) A notice which is to be relied on as a notice to keeper for the purposes of paragraph 6(1)(b) is given in accordance with this paragraph if the following requirements are met.

    (4) The notice must be given by—

    (a) handing it to the keeper, or leaving it at a current address for service for the keeper, within the relevant period; or
    (b) sending it by post to a current address for service for the keeper so that it is delivered to that address within the relevant period.

    (5)The relevant period for the purposes of sub-paragraph (4) is the period of 14 days beginning with the day after that on which the specified period of parking ended.

    The operator, UKPC issued a notice to keeper on (date) for a parking charge on (date). This is 30 days after the alleged parking offence and does therefore not meet the strict requirements of Schedule 4 of the POFA under paragraph 9 (5). UKPC has therefore not met the condition stated in paragraph 6 (1) (b) for there to be keeper liability under POFA and therefore there can be no keeper liability established from the notice to keeper issued by UKPC.

    The operator, UKPC, has failed to meet the second condition as detailed in paragraph 6 (1) (a) and (b), and association paragraphs 7, 8 & 9. It is therefore not possible for there to be keeper liability for this charge under Schedule 4 of the POFA.

    Please see enclosed the following:
    Appendix 1 – Notice to Driver with incorrect vehicle registration, therefore failing to meet the conditions of paragraph 6 (1)(a) & 7 (2)(a).
    Appendix 2 – Notice to Keeper, with different details to notice to driver, failing the condition detailed in paragraph 6 (1)(a) & 8 (2)(c), and issued outside of the condition detailed in paragraph 6 (1)(b) & 9 (5).
    • Coupon-mad
    • By Coupon-mad 18th Mar 17, 10:51 PM
    • 44,071 Posts
    • 56,794 Thanks
    Coupon-mad
    Yes that's fine. Hopefully POPLA will get it.

    You will need to upload your appeal as a PDF (and personally I never attach appendices to POPLA appeals). I always embed pics and screenshots & scans into the actual word document to illustrate the point then and there, so the Assessor doesn't have to switch between attachments. Tell it like a story with pictures.

    One long PDF, uploaded under 'OTHER'.
    PRIVATE PCN in England/Wales? DON'T PAY BUT DO NOT IGNORE IT

    Click on the breadcrumb trail, top of page: Household & Travel > Motoring > Parking Tickets, Fines & Parking & READ THE 'NEWBIES' FAQS THREAD.
    DON'T read old advice to ignore, unless in Scotland/NI.

    • sods_law
    • By sods_law 18th Mar 17, 11:17 PM
    • 12 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    sods_law
    Thanks for the advice once again Coupon-mad, took your advice and embedded the evidence photos in a nice long PDF. All submitted.

    I hope they get it, if they read the POFA themselves it is pretty clear

    It will be interesting what evidence UKPC will provide. I use the car park almost daily, and they have been upgrading their signage recently (would still fail the test I think), but I wonder if they will try that one...
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

141Posts Today

1,284Users online

Martin's Twitter