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  • FIRST POST
    • AdventureRocks
    • By AdventureRocks 18th Oct 16, 11:54 AM
    • 115Posts
    • 10Thanks
    AdventureRocks
    New driver questions on clutch help please don't want to burn it out..
    • #1
    • 18th Oct 16, 11:54 AM
    New driver questions on clutch help please don't want to burn it out.. 18th Oct 16 at 11:54 AM
    I don't want to burn out my clutch and I am a little rusty on driving.

    So at traffic lights when waiting can I leave it in first with clutch down with brake on or is that bad for clutch?

    When breaking is putting the clutch all the way down and breaking at the same time bad? Should I break then put clutch in at last minute?

    Also on hill starts does everyone roll a little bit backwards? I am putting handbrake on building up revs then relasing hand break..

    Appreciate your help
Page 5
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 18th Oct 16, 5:17 PM
    • 12,061 Posts
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    AdrianC
    I must be imagining the last pair on the penultimate line of the third page, then.
    (There's a clue there, btw, although the original intent of posting that image was the advisory text beneath the sign - I did somewhat take it for granted that you would understand the sign itself, although I realise I certainly shouldn't have...)

    Oh, and reading the note text at the bottom of the first page would help you, too.
    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/519129/know-your-traffic-signs.pdf
    Page 12 (page numbering, p13 of pdf)

    regardless I dont see why it matters given that, as I said, I'm well aware of going in lower gears when going up a hill...
    <gibber>
    Last edited by AdrianC; 18-10-2016 at 5:20 PM.
    • GwylimT
    • By GwylimT 18th Oct 16, 5:21 PM
    • 5,437 Posts
    • 10,123 Thanks
    GwylimT
    This is the Highway Code. That sign is not there.

    https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/57f76409ed915d06fd000027/the-highway-code-traffic-signs.pdf

    regardless I dont see why it matters given that, as I said, I'm well aware of going in lower gears when going up a hill...
    Originally posted by kmb500
    So you still don't know what the sign says, a sign you need to know to pass your theory test and so you drive to the roads condition correctly as sadly some people don't know how to use gears.
    • kmb500
    • By kmb500 18th Oct 16, 5:30 PM
    • 75 Posts
    • 11 Thanks
    kmb500
    Clue: The sign tells you which direction the hill is. Now, why do you think I might have shown you that to explain what engine braking is?
    Originally posted by AdrianC
    If youre trying to tell me to go in lower gears down hill, yes, I know that, how many times do I have to say this?
    if you go in a lower gear down a hill it limits how fast you go and stops you from naturally accelerating from gravity and momentum...
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 18th Oct 16, 5:40 PM
    • 12,061 Posts
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    AdrianC
    If youre trying to tell me to go in lower gears down hill, yes, I know that, how many times do I have to say this?
    Originally posted by kmb500
    Well, up until now, you've been saying UP...

    if you go in a lower gear down a hill it limits how fast you go and stops you from naturally accelerating from gravity and momentum...
    Yep. Congratulations. That's engine braking. It slows you down on the flat, too.
    • Car 54
    • By Car 54 18th Oct 16, 5:50 PM
    • 1,402 Posts
    • 869 Thanks
    Car 54
    You've just confirmed that you don't know what the sign above means by saying you go up hill in a low gear! Which again confirms you don't know you're highway code.
    Originally posted by GwylimT
    That sign is not in the HC!
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 18th Oct 16, 5:52 PM
    • 12,061 Posts
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    AdrianC
    That sign is not in the HC!
    Originally posted by Car 54
    <gently points upwards to post 81>
    • Car 54
    • By Car 54 18th Oct 16, 6:03 PM
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    Car 54
    Drivers are still taught to slow down using gears, but are now taught its okay to skip gears as you go down. When you slow down using the brake you brake until the clutch needs to to down then change gear, otherwise you are coasting which definitely shouldn't be taught by instructors. Coasting should lead to minors on the practical test.
    Originally posted by GwylimT
    If you mean "changing down through the gears" it is not taught by any competent.instructor.

    At least 40 years ago the police realised that this was superfluous with modern cars, and that it is much cheaper to replace brakes than clutches and gearboxes. Police methods quickly became mainstream, and recommended by DVSA etc.

    The correct technique is to slow down to the desired speed using the brakes as necessary, and then to change into the appropriate gear.
    • BeenThroughItAll
    • By BeenThroughItAll 18th Oct 16, 6:42 PM
    • 3,463 Posts
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    BeenThroughItAll
    If you mean "changing down through the gears" it is not taught by any competent.instructor.

    At least 40 years ago the police realised that this was superfluous with modern cars, and that it is much cheaper to replace brakes than clutches and gearboxes. Police methods quickly became mainstream, and recommended by DVSA etc.

    The correct technique is to slow down to the desired speed using the brakes as necessary, and then to change into the appropriate gear.
    Originally posted by Car 54
    Regardless, that's moot considering our mate with the pram says that they decelerate using the brakes with the clutch also depressed, thereby negating any engine braking effect.
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 18th Oct 16, 6:54 PM
    • 12,061 Posts
    • 10,448 Thanks
    AdrianC
    Regardless, that's moot considering our mate with the pram says that they decelerate using the brakes with the clutch also depressed, thereby negating any engine braking effect.
    Originally posted by BeenThroughItAll
    Even more worrying, they always have either the accelerator or the clutch depressed, apparently.
    • BeenThroughItAll
    • By BeenThroughItAll 18th Oct 16, 6:55 PM
    • 3,463 Posts
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    BeenThroughItAll
    Even more worrying, they always have either the accelerator or the clutch depressed, apparently.
    Originally posted by AdrianC
    Mm, yes - I forgot that little gem.
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 18th Oct 16, 7:02 PM
    • 12,061 Posts
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    AdrianC
    I wonder if their Yaris has rear brakes? It's not quite the usual pattern...
    • daveyjp
    • By daveyjp 18th Oct 16, 7:22 PM
    • 6,519 Posts
    • 4,873 Thanks
    daveyjp
    Hmm. I use the clutch all the time, when I accelerate I balance it out with the clutch, and when I brake I have the clutch fully down. I worry that the car will stall. Like I said, if you're in first and you just take your foot off the clutch too quickly doesn't it stall?


    I have always driven like this. My instructor never said I had a problem with it. I can drive perfectly competently. I guess it's just a different style of driving.
    I'm gonna pop out in my car now for a few mins just to see what you mean.
    Originally posted by kmb500
    Sounds like a family friend who used to de clutch when going round corners, scared the hell out of everyone who was ever with her as she grappled to keep the car on the road.

    "Gears to go, brakes to slow" has worked for me for 500,000 miles or so.

    Only ever had one clutch replaced, on a car which had done 90,000 when I bought it so no idea how it had been treat before that.

    My dad was a driving instructor for 25 years. He had 7-8 cars which all did 100,000+ miles and none of them ever had a new clutch. I took one car from him and took it to close on 200,000 on the original clutch.
    • Paradigm
    • By Paradigm 18th Oct 16, 7:25 PM
    • 3,304 Posts
    • 4,208 Thanks
    Paradigm
    Drivers are still taught to slow down using gears, but are now taught its okay to skip gears as you go down. When you slow down using the brake you brake until the clutch needs to to down then change gear, otherwise you are coasting which definitely shouldn't be taught by instructors. Coasting should lead to minors on the practical test.
    Originally posted by GwylimT

    My boy passed his test 3 & a bit years ago, he was never taught to slow the car using the gears.
    Instead, if making a turn for example, the procedure was to slow the car to the correct speed using the brakes then block change 5th (4th) to 2nd & drive around the turn.
    When stopping there was no need to use the gears, he could if he wanted too (as long as the clutch was released after the change) or he could stop in 4th or 5th.


    That's how he drove when he passed.
    Always try to be at least half the person your dog thinks you are!
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 18th Oct 16, 7:37 PM
    • 12,061 Posts
    • 10,448 Thanks
    AdrianC
    Most instructors will teach to pass the test, and no more. Test-pass standard is absolute bare minimum on the day of the check, just like an MOT. But, just like an MOT, many seem to regard it as some horrific nightmare highpoint...

    As for our friend here... <shudder>
    • BeenThroughItAll
    • By BeenThroughItAll 18th Oct 16, 7:56 PM
    • 3,463 Posts
    • 2,773 Thanks
    BeenThroughItAll
    I wonder if their Yaris has rear brakes? It's not quite the usual pattern...
    Originally posted by AdrianC
    Mm, I'm not so sure. Some threads with unlikely tales about finance, then some contributions to the motoring forum with a professed lack of knowledge interspersed with definitive statements from the standpoint of an expert... I've been wondering for a while now.
    • diceydeb
    • By diceydeb 18th Oct 16, 8:13 PM
    • 139 Posts
    • 123 Thanks
    diceydeb
    Book a few refresher lessons if just to get your clutch control mastered . At least then you wont be damaging your own vehicle lol. Tutors are used to learners riding the clutch n stuff and once you have mastered this bit it will all seem so much easier. Trust me I only learnt to drive at 48 and now 2 yrs on I wonder why I never got the hang of the clutch bit sooner! Its second nature now 😊
    • Richard53
    • By Richard53 18th Oct 16, 8:36 PM
    • 2,217 Posts
    • 1,916 Thanks
    Richard53
    Here's a reason why engine braking is a Good Idea:


    When the car is in gear with the clutch up and the engine running, the wheels must be turning. If you then brake hard and meet a slippery patch on the road, the driving wheels cannot physically stop without stalling the engine. The car is therefore less likely to skid.


    If you try to drive a Land Rover down a steep muddy slope, first in neutral using the brakes, and then in a low gear with no brakes, you will see what I mean.


    But I am calling troll on the whole thread, to be honest.
    If all misfortunes were laid in one common heap whence everyone must take an equal portion, most people would be contented to take their own and depart. (Attrib. to Socrates)
    • EssexHebridean
    • By EssexHebridean 19th Oct 16, 1:04 PM
    • 6,327 Posts
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    EssexHebridean
    Sorry mate but I never do either.
    Originally posted by neilmcl
    I'll add to that 1%...which thankfully seems to be getting bigger!

    Why must I be trolling? I have seen very occasionally a gradient sign when I've been on holiday (not me driving), but never seen one that says "Low gear". I didn't realise that was a real picture when you posted it.

    I live in Cambridgeshire which is exceptionally flat and has no hills to speak of at all. Why would I have ever seen a sign like that? Because, last time I looked, driving tests were rather more general than just limited to a single county. Clue - if your driving license limits you to only driving in Cambridgeshire, it's probably not a real one...


    I'm not gonna change my driving style based on "what if someone rams into me", that's absurd. That is their problem not mine if they go into the back of me. It becomes your problem just the very second you then slam into the back of me. Trust me on this one.
    Originally posted by kmb500
    I dont see why it is such a big deal that I have never driven up a serious hill and never come across a sign that says Low Gear. I'm not blind, if I read it I would know what it meant.

    Why are you all treating me LIke im stupid.
    Originally posted by kmb500
    I'm not being drawn on that final point...

    Agree with those saying Troll - and that's without looking at this character's forum history!

    A note though - I passed my test (1st time) in 1991 - and even then "Skip changes" were taught as an accepted method of changing down the gears - I learned in a car with a 4-speed box and learned 4 > 2 and 3 > 1 as standard. It's far from being a recent thing.
    MORTGAGE FREE 30/09/2016
    • EssexHebridean
    • By EssexHebridean 19th Oct 16, 1:10 PM
    • 6,327 Posts
    • 35,065 Thanks
    EssexHebridean
    I don't want to burn out my clutch and I am a little rusty on driving.

    So at traffic lights when waiting can I leave it in first with clutch down with brake on or is that bad for clutch?

    When breaking is putting the clutch all the way down and breaking at the same time bad? Should I break then put clutch in at last minute?

    Also on hill starts does everyone roll a little bit backwards? I am putting handbrake on building up revs then relasing hand break..

    Appreciate your help
    Originally posted by AdventureRocks
    OP - getting back to your original point.

    When you arrive at a set of lights, apply the handbrake, take the car out of gear, release the clutch.
    When braking you depress the clutch when a gear change is required, whether that is to change down a gear or to put the car into neutral. In an emergency stop situation (which should be VERY rare indeed) you hit the brake first followed by the clutch - this prevents the wheels from locking up.
    Hill starts - take yourself right back to your lessons - remember when pulling away you were taught to find the "biting point" at which you felt the car pull slightly against the handbrake - THEN release the handbrake and pull away? Same principle on a hill start. Re-learn this properly before you ram back into someone and cost yourself money if I were you.
    MORTGAGE FREE 30/09/2016
    • bsod
    • By bsod 19th Oct 16, 1:13 PM
    • 1,062 Posts
    • 645 Thanks
    bsod
    In an emergency stop situation (which should be VERY rare indeed) you hit the brake first followed by the clutch - this prevents the wheels from locking up.
    Originally posted by EssexHebridean
    It prevents the engine stalling, abs prevents the wheels locking up
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