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  • FIRST POST
    • Cem2016
    • By Cem2016 17th Oct 16, 11:54 AM
    • 10Posts
    • 1Thanks
    Cem2016
    Lloyds have frozen my account
    • #1
    • 17th Oct 16, 11:54 AM
    Lloyds have frozen my account 17th Oct 16 at 11:54 AM
    Last Wednesday I went o pay for my lunch and my card was declined. I knew I had funds in my account as I'd transferred some money from my ISA that morning.
    I then walked over to the bank and the cash point took my card. I went into the bank and they did not have any idea why it had happened and asked me to leave it with them.......
    So here I am 5 days later with no answers and no bank account!!
    I've rung them every day and all I am being told is that there is a "processing delay" with my account.
    I have asked each person I have spoken to what actually is a processing delay and they haven't got a clue.
    It's being dealt with by and internal department but they won't tell me who the internal department is.
    Had any one ever had this or could any one shed any light on what could be happening?

    I am actually on maternity leave and have been using my savings to live off of if that could make any impact at all?
Page 1
    • Ed-1
    • By Ed-1 17th Oct 16, 12:09 PM
    • 1,498 Posts
    • 810 Thanks
    Ed-1
    • #2
    • 17th Oct 16, 12:09 PM
    • #2
    • 17th Oct 16, 12:09 PM
    Last Wednesday I went o pay for my lunch and my card was declined. I knew I had funds in my account as I'd transferred some money from my ISA that morning.
    I then walked over to the bank and the cash point took my card. I went into the bank and they did not have any idea why it had happened and asked me to leave it with them.......
    So here I am 5 days later with no answers and no bank account!!
    I've rung them every day and all I am being told is that there is a "processing delay" with my account.
    I have asked each person I have spoken to what actually is a processing delay and they haven't got a clue.
    It's being dealt with by and internal department but they won't tell me who the internal department is.
    Had any one ever had this or could any one shed any light on what could be happening?

    I am actually on maternity leave and have been using my savings to live off of if that could make any impact at all?
    Originally posted by Cem2016
    When was the account opened? Recently?

    Ask them to check indicators and they'll probably tell you that it's got a '646' indicator on the account blocking transactions. Ask them to check the customer notes as there should be details there about which department put the indicator on it. If the account was opened recently it can be declined by credit decisioning subsequently.
    • Cem2016
    • By Cem2016 17th Oct 16, 1:00 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Cem2016
    • #3
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:00 PM
    • #3
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:00 PM
    No I've had my account with them for around 30 years
    • ratechaser
    • By ratechaser 17th Oct 16, 1:20 PM
    • 406 Posts
    • 311 Thanks
    ratechaser
    • #4
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:20 PM
    • #4
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:20 PM
    I hope that I'm wrong, but the vague/borderline obstructive responses from Lloyds could indicate that they are investigating your account for potential money laundering. In that case, they are actually not legally allowed to tell you that's what they are doing (that would be 'tipping off' - a criminal offence).

    There's quite a few threads on this board where banks appear to have taken this action pretty arbitrarily, and unfortunately there is not a lot you can do other than sit it out if that is the case.

    In theory at least, such an investigation would be triggered by unusual account activity causing suspicion at the bank. You mentioned being on maternity leave, and also having transferred funds in from an ISA. So does that mean that perhaps you have had recent changes to salary payments (e.g. decreased while on leave), and also was it a big transfer in from your ISA? That's the sort of thing that can make banks AML monitoring processes think that something is 'up' and needs investigating...

    And no, I don't think it's fair, but it is legal, and in fact required of the banks to act this way, although many of them seem to be overzealous here.

    Anyway, as I said, I hope that this isn't the case for you here, but you might want to look at similar threads to see how this plays out, just in case.

    Good luck.
    • Ed-1
    • By Ed-1 17th Oct 16, 1:22 PM
    • 1,498 Posts
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    Ed-1
    • #5
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:22 PM
    • #5
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:22 PM
    No I've had my account with them for around 30 years
    Originally posted by Cem2016
    Then it's not an application related decision.

    There's two reasons why they place a blocking indicator on an account. The first is if they have decided to withdraw that facility/all facilities as a result of a credit decision in which case the indicator is there pending account closure to prevent funds being deposited. They also sometimes make mistakes in blocking an existing account when only a newly opened account that is subsequently declined should've been blocked.

    The second (which is likely in your case) is a block that has either been automatically put on the account for security (e.g. if the system has detected unusual usage of debit card/internet banking etc.) or if the block has been placed manually as a result of an investigation into account transactions (AML) etc.

    In either case there should be a note in the customer notes saying why the indicator has been put there.
    • Ed-1
    • By Ed-1 17th Oct 16, 1:31 PM
    • 1,498 Posts
    • 810 Thanks
    Ed-1
    • #6
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:31 PM
    • #6
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:31 PM
    I hope that I'm wrong, but the vague/borderline obstructive responses from Lloyds could indicate that they are investigating your account for potential money laundering. In that case, they are actually not legally allowed to tell you that's what they are doing (that would be 'tipping off' - a criminal offence).
    Originally posted by ratechaser
    That's how ridiculous the legislation is. I know someone who had their account blocked for 3 months with no access to funds which caused missed mortgage payments. They had to prove their source of wealth to regain access. They complained to the bank and subsequently the FOS and was fobbed off with 'the bank has acted within their statutory duties so I cannot uphold the complaint and although the bank have found the account to be in order, I understand that the timescale of your lack of access to funds was frustrating and I have asked your mortgage provider to remove any missed payment markers from your credit reference files a result of this being outside of your control'.

    No financial compensation. Talk about 'guilty until proven innocent'.

    And it's only going got get even worse as more legislation comes in giving banks free will to report suspicions and share customer concerns through a secret gateway:

    https://www.gov.uk/government/consultations/anti-money-laundering-and-counter-terrorist-finance-legislative-proposals

    The proposals also introduce a power for funds to be swiftly ceased if an account holder does not prove their source of wealth upon request from the bank.
    Last edited by Ed-1; 17-10-2016 at 1:34 PM.
    • TheShape
    • By TheShape 17th Oct 16, 1:44 PM
    • 452 Posts
    • 229 Thanks
    TheShape
    • #7
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:44 PM
    • #7
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:44 PM
    I wonder what sort of transactions would trigger a AML investigation?

    I expect many people engaged in the 5% savings loophole have account transactions that look like my Nationwide account which shows 10s of thousands moving through it each month. I've not long set-up multiple accounts so this transactional activity will drop off.

    I expect that an account with large amounts of 'cash' being credited and/or withdrawn would be the number one indicator of money laundering.
    • ratechaser
    • By ratechaser 17th Oct 16, 1:47 PM
    • 406 Posts
    • 311 Thanks
    ratechaser
    • #8
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:47 PM
    • #8
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:47 PM
    Yep, along with 'credit clamping' (see the parking tickets board for more detail there...), this is one of the financial scandals of our age. Global banks happily launder money for drug cartels, arms runners and the like, then they get huge fines, and then they suddenly come over all draconian with internal policies meaning that everyday innocent customers regularly get caught up in Kafka-esque nightmares like we read on here.

    There's not one bank I know of that actually gets AML right at the moment, it's all far too reactive and crude. And I say that from the perspective of someone that's been very close to these processes in big banks all my working life. But right now it seems to keep the regulators happy, and avoiding fines is more important to the banks than inconveniencing customers.

    OP, apologies for the rant here, as I said, I hope that this isn't what's happened to you and this gets resolved quickly...
    • MARTYM8`
    • By MARTYM8` 17th Oct 16, 1:49 PM
    • 1,197 Posts
    • 853 Thanks
    MARTYM8`
    • #9
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:49 PM
    • #9
    • 17th Oct 16, 1:49 PM
    My advice is - open another bank account with another bank outside the Lloyds group (Halifax, BOS, Lloyds - TSB possibly too) asap!
    • Cem2016
    • By Cem2016 17th Oct 16, 1:50 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Cem2016
    My salary has decreased significantly whilst on maternity leave as I only get SMP.
    I have been using my savings to live off of and it has depleted over this year although there is still £10k in my ISA.
    I inherited £17k after the death of my grandfather which was in my ISA as well as some other savings but only a couple of thousand.
    It's a complete nightmare - having a baby and no money is just awful.
    I'm litterally rationing nappies as I don't have the funds to pay for more.
    They even have my child benefit payment. It is only £80 but I asked if they could just release that so I can feed and nappy my child and they still said no.
    Living nightmare
    • ratechaser
    • By ratechaser 17th Oct 16, 1:52 PM
    • 406 Posts
    • 311 Thanks
    ratechaser
    I wonder what sort of transactions would trigger a AML investigation?

    I expect many people engaged in the 5% savings loophole have account transactions that look like my Nationwide account which shows 10s of thousands moving through it each month. I've not long set-up multiple accounts so this transactional activity will drop off.

    I expect that an account with large amounts of 'cash' being credited and/or withdrawn would be the number one indicator of money laundering.
    Originally posted by TheShape
    Agreed, I'm frankly astonished that I've not been caught out yet. I think it was about 80k in and out of my flex account last month for various reasons. I can only assume it's because they have a record of my previous (erm, substantial ) salary on file which may put it into perspective.
    • Cem2016
    • By Cem2016 17th Oct 16, 1:53 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Cem2016
    I do have another account already with Barclays which is running perfectly fine but I don't have any savings or money in that account. As soon as this is resolved, which I hope it is soon, then I will be withdrawing everything and putting into my other account.
    • ratechaser
    • By ratechaser 17th Oct 16, 1:54 PM
    • 406 Posts
    • 311 Thanks
    ratechaser
    I truly hope that someone can provide some practical advice for you here OP - sounds awful for you. In the meantime, can you arrange to have child benefit or any other payments come into a different account, so that if this does go on for a long time, you can at least access new money? Set up a new account if needed - with a totally different bank of course!

    Edit -just seen your post re a Barclays account - suggest you have CB paid there from now on. Also, have you formally started the Lloyds complaint process that you can't access your own money.

    And one other suggestion if you want to stoke the flames a bit - maybe contact someone like Tony Hetherington at This is Money, or even your local paper. Banks aren't exactly popular right now, and 'my baby is starving because Lloyds won't give me my own money' is the sort of headline that tends to provoke a reaction...
    Last edited by ratechaser; 17-10-2016 at 2:00 PM.
    • Heng Leng
    • By Heng Leng 17th Oct 16, 1:55 PM
    • 3,501 Posts
    • 1,047 Thanks
    Heng Leng
    I'd also suggest this and ideally stop any further credits into the account.

    My advice is - open another bank account with another bank outside the Lloyds group (Halifax, BOS, Lloyds - TSB possibly too) asap!
    Originally posted by MARTYM8`
    • Ed-1
    • By Ed-1 17th Oct 16, 2:07 PM
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    Ed-1
    I'd also suggest this and ideally stop any further credits into the account.
    Originally posted by Heng Leng
    If there's a 646 blocking indicator on the account, any payments in will bounce straight back again, so get any CB payments redirected to another account.
    • Cem2016
    • By Cem2016 17th Oct 16, 3:00 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Cem2016
    What is a 646 indicator may I ask?
    They have told me that no payments will leave or enter the account.
    Living nightmare - I have made a complaint and they were less hen helpful and I have already made a case with the ombudsman but they said Lloyds have 8 weeks to resolve before they will get involved. 8 weeks......my baby and I will have starved to death by then
    • Ed-1
    • By Ed-1 17th Oct 16, 3:02 PM
    • 1,498 Posts
    • 810 Thanks
    Ed-1
    What is a 646 indicator may I ask?
    They have told me that no payments will leave or enter the account.
    Living nightmare - I have made a complaint and they were less hen helpful and I have already made a case with the ombudsman but they said Lloyds have 8 weeks to resolve before they will get involved. 8 weeks......my baby and I will have starved to death by then
    Originally posted by Cem2016
    A 646 indicator is Lloyds Banking Group specific jargon for "account block".
    • Cem2016
    • By Cem2016 17th Oct 16, 3:07 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Cem2016
    Have you ever come across the jargon "Processing delay"?? That's what they have told me on the phone.
    Sorry for all the questions
    • Ed-1
    • By Ed-1 17th Oct 16, 3:12 PM
    • 1,498 Posts
    • 810 Thanks
    Ed-1
    Have you ever come across the jargon "Processing delay"?? That's what they have told me on the phone.
    Sorry for all the questions
    Originally posted by Cem2016
    Nope. Have you tried to make any payments online recently and had payments held up for checks? Processing delay could mean anything.

    You could go into branch and ask to sit down with someone to see the notes, telling them you think you've got a 646 indicator (block) on the account and want to know why it's been put there.

    Have you not received any letters?
    • Cem2016
    • By Cem2016 17th Oct 16, 3:44 PM
    • 10 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    Cem2016
    No no letters at all.
    I was in the branch the day it happened and they were totally clueless.
    I guess it's a case of wait and see.
    I'm guessing if it was a CIFAS it would affect my other bank accounts.
    I've checked my credit file this morning and it's still good and there is nothing knew in there.
    I can only assume that transferring money from my savings to my current account trigured it as it was working fine up to that point.
    I'm happy that they do checks but not to the point of restricting your life so dramatically. I just asked them to release the child benefit payment so I can get nappies and milk for my baby but it was met with a resounding no. This is not a fair process at all.
    I've been given details of a local food bank by my local CAB - can't believe I'm going to have to use them when I have over £10k in my account.
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