Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • stillinamess
    • By stillinamess 17th Oct 16, 11:42 AM
    • 3Posts
    • 0Thanks
    stillinamess
    Help with Trustee & creditors
    • #1
    • 17th Oct 16, 11:42 AM
    Help with Trustee & creditors 17th Oct 16 at 11:42 AM
    Hi, I wonder if anyone has any expert knowledge in dealing with a Trustee & trying to make a deal with HMRC?
    Long story short...
    Both husband and I made bankrupt by HMRC in March 2015 , unpaid VAT & PAYE debts due to failing (now failed) retail business. We were a partnership, not LLP or Ltd so debts are joint & several.
    Met OR who appointed Trustee in Bankruptcy as we own a (mortgaged) property.
    Buried head in sand for a year or so.
    Trustee wished to know if we have a third party to purchase her interest in our property.
    Finally pull fingers out & submit corrected figures to HMRC as we were made bankrupt on estimated figures.
    The actual amount is less than half of the estimated.
    Statement of liabilities show various other creditors.
    Really unsure how to proceed from here. Have written to HMRC for a revised proof of debt. Does anyone know if they will cut a deal?
    Any advice gratefully received.
    By the way, my credit report shows that I am discharged from bankruptcy though have no proof of this.
    Thanks in advance
Page 1
    • silvercar
    • By silvercar 17th Oct 16, 12:06 PM
    • 34,033 Posts
    • 142,220 Thanks
    silvercar
    • #2
    • 17th Oct 16, 12:06 PM
    • #2
    • 17th Oct 16, 12:06 PM
    What is the property?

    Assuming it is your main residence, it is the amount of equity in the property that you now need to consider.
    • stillinamess
    • By stillinamess 17th Oct 16, 12:14 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    stillinamess
    • #3
    • 17th Oct 16, 12:14 PM
    • #3
    • 17th Oct 16, 12:14 PM
    The property is our house. Approx £200k equity.
    • Brock_and_Roll
    • By Brock_and_Roll 17th Oct 16, 12:55 PM
    • 696 Posts
    • 658 Thanks
    Brock_and_Roll
    • #4
    • 17th Oct 16, 12:55 PM
    • #4
    • 17th Oct 16, 12:55 PM
    HMRC have a reputation as just about the most hard-nosed of creditors - which is fair enough as they are protecting the general taxpayer.


    I cant see why it would be in their interests to cut a deal in relation to selling the beneficial interest for anything significantly less than the amount of equity available.
    • luvchocolate
    • By luvchocolate 17th Oct 16, 4:36 PM
    • 1,136 Posts
    • 969 Thanks
    luvchocolate
    • #5
    • 17th Oct 16, 4:36 PM
    • #5
    • 17th Oct 16, 4:36 PM
    You would have been discharged 1 year from declaring B.R, you get no notification of this.
  • National Debtline
    • #6
    • 17th Oct 16, 4:50 PM
    • #6
    • 17th Oct 16, 4:50 PM
    Hi there, I am sorry to be the bearer of bad news......


    I am afraid it is more complicated than 'making a deal' with the HMRC now. Because you have been declared bankrupt, the only way to undo this is to apply to annul the bankruptcy. This would require very specialist legal advice (which can be pricey), plus full repayment of all of the debts that went into the bankruptcy and the Trustee fees, which I am sorry to say, can be extremely high. It is my understanding that this has to be done as a lump sum in order for the annulment to be considered, and can't be a payment plan.


    If the debt was joint, and the property is joint, with substantial equity I am afraid you are going to be in a very difficult position. Unless someone can approach the Trustee to purchase both of your interests back, it will be extremely difficult to save the property.


    The Trustee has 3 years to deal with the property (from the date of the bankruptcy order), so they may not take action in the immediate future, however, don't ignore this. Talk to family and friends, and see if they can help, I appreciate it is a lot of money, but someone would need to approach the Trustee with an offer, similar to the equity they will get from a sale, to try and save it. Give any free charity a call for your next steps,


    Laura
    @natdebtline
    We work as money advisers for National Debtline and have specific permission from MSE to post to try to help those in debt. Read more information on National Debtline in MSE's Debt Problems: What to do and where to get help guide. If you find you're struggling with debt and need further help try our online advice tool My Money Steps
    • silvercar
    • By silvercar 17th Oct 16, 5:04 PM
    • 34,033 Posts
    • 142,220 Thanks
    silvercar
    • #7
    • 17th Oct 16, 5:04 PM
    • #7
    • 17th Oct 16, 5:04 PM
    The property is our house. Approx £200k equity.
    Originally posted by stillinamess
    So which is lower, 200k for the equity in your house or the sum total of all your debts plus the fees for dealing with the bankruptcy?

    If all your debts + trustee fees are lower and you could find someway of finding this money, then it would be worth while trying to annul the bankruptcy. If not, then it is a question of working out if you can raise money to buy the beneficial interest off the Official receiver.

    If the totals are about the same then you may have more of a chance negotiating with the OR on the value needed to buy back the equity.
    • stillinamess
    • By stillinamess 20th Oct 16, 12:48 AM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    stillinamess
    • #8
    • 20th Oct 16, 12:48 AM
    • #8
    • 20th Oct 16, 12:48 AM
    Equity is greater than debt so hopefully Trustee will adjust beneficial interest since actual debt is lower than originally stated. Thanks for your reply.
    • silvercar
    • By silvercar 20th Oct 16, 8:19 AM
    • 34,033 Posts
    • 142,220 Thanks
    silvercar
    • #9
    • 20th Oct 16, 8:19 AM
    • #9
    • 20th Oct 16, 8:19 AM
    Equity is greater than debt so hopefully Trustee will adjust beneficial interest since actual debt is lower than originally stated. Thanks for your reply.
    Originally posted by stillinamess
    So it is really in your interest to get the hmrc to agree an accurate figure. You will get a hefty charge for the trustee bankruptcy costs.
    • luvchocolate
    • By luvchocolate 20th Oct 16, 11:35 AM
    • 1,136 Posts
    • 969 Thanks
    luvchocolate
    My trustees fees were just over £21,000 my B.R involved 3 properties but only 5 creditors.
    • TimeToDoIt
    • By TimeToDoIt 21st Oct 16, 6:33 AM
    • 211 Posts
    • 472 Thanks
    TimeToDoIt
    Unfortunately as someone has already said, the fees that will be included in any annulment will be hefty. It isn't unusual for debtors to end up paying double what their debts were to have the BK annulled.

    I wish you luck, whatever you do.
    ~~I am debt free~~
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

2,034Posts Today

5,681Users online

Martin's Twitter