Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@. Skimlinks & other affiliated links are turned on

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • pontiac custom catalina
    • By pontiac custom catalina 14th Oct 16, 6:55 AM
    • 4Posts
    • 1Thanks
    pontiac custom catalina
    Nationwide Loan on Mortgage Calculator ' Not Fit for Purpose ' !
    • #1
    • 14th Oct 16, 6:55 AM
    Nationwide Loan on Mortgage Calculator ' Not Fit for Purpose ' ! 14th Oct 16 at 6:55 AM
    Earlier this year I changed my Nationwide mortgage product to another of theirs and saved £114 per month by switching.
    Now planning some home improvements, so I rang Nationwide to borrow £18,000 over the remaining 18 years of mortgage which would equate to less than £100 per month - less than my mortgage before - and I failed the affordability test !
    I have a 100% payment record, was paying it comfortably before the reduction and nothing else has changed. Nationwide could offer no explanation other than ' computer says no ! '
Page 1
    • zx81
    • By zx81 14th Oct 16, 7:01 AM
    • 9,371 Posts
    • 9,208 Thanks
    zx81
    • #2
    • 14th Oct 16, 7:01 AM
    • #2
    • 14th Oct 16, 7:01 AM
    Affordability measures have changed in recent years. Lenders are not as loose with borrowing as previously.
    • GingerBob
    • By GingerBob 14th Oct 16, 10:14 AM
    • 3,046 Posts
    • 1,288 Thanks
    GingerBob
    • #3
    • 14th Oct 16, 10:14 AM
    • #3
    • 14th Oct 16, 10:14 AM
    Earlier this year I changed my Nationwide mortgage product to another of theirs and saved £114 per month by switching.
    Now planning some home improvements, so I rang Nationwide to borrow £18,000 over the remaining 18 years of mortgage which would equate to less than £100 per month - less than my mortgage before - and I failed the affordability test !
    I have a 100% payment record, was paying it comfortably before the reduction and nothing else has changed. Nationwide could offer no explanation other than ' computer says no ! '
    Originally posted by pontiac custom catalina

    Not fit for purpose is indeed the correct way to describe the current situation regarding so-called "affordability". At least, it would appear so from what we read here and in the press. Nationwide's computer system - or the people who designed the application - appear to be particularly stupid.
    • ReadingTim
    • By ReadingTim 14th Oct 16, 2:15 PM
    • 1,083 Posts
    • 1,434 Thanks
    ReadingTim
    • #4
    • 14th Oct 16, 2:15 PM
    • #4
    • 14th Oct 16, 2:15 PM
    Not fit for purpose is indeed the correct way to describe the current situation regarding so-called "affordability". At least, it would appear so from what we read here and in the press. Nationwide's computer system - or the people who designed the application - appear to be particularly stupid.
    Originally posted by GingerBob
    Well, given the Nationwide didn't collapse or require taxpayer bailout after the financial crisis of 2008, nor has it gone out of business in the years since because it's too tight with its money, they can't be that stupid.

    The OP's remortgaged once recently. He's now looking to do so again, and borrow another £18k - if he's such a good financial prospect he wouldn't need to resort to secured borrowing over such an extended period of time to be able to get hold of this sort of sum. Yes, this may be the actions of someone looking to save as much interest as they can. It could also be the actions of someone who's up to their neck in it and is looking for a consolidation loan by any means possible.
    • GingerBob
    • By GingerBob 14th Oct 16, 3:29 PM
    • 3,046 Posts
    • 1,288 Thanks
    GingerBob
    • #5
    • 14th Oct 16, 3:29 PM
    • #5
    • 14th Oct 16, 3:29 PM
    Well, given the Nationwide didn't collapse or require taxpayer bailout after the financial crisis of 2008, nor has it gone out of business in the years since because it's too tight with its money, they can't be that stupid.

    The OP's remortgaged once recently. He's now looking to do so again, and borrow another £18k - if he's such a good financial prospect he wouldn't need to resort to secured borrowing over such an extended period of time to be able to get hold of this sort of sum. Yes, this may be the actions of someone looking to save as much interest as they can. It could also be the actions of someone who's up to their neck in it and is looking for a consolidation loan by any means possible.
    Originally posted by ReadingTim

    Missing the point completely.
    • ReadingTim
    • By ReadingTim 14th Oct 16, 4:24 PM
    • 1,083 Posts
    • 1,434 Thanks
    ReadingTim
    • #6
    • 14th Oct 16, 4:24 PM
    • #6
    • 14th Oct 16, 4:24 PM
    Missing the point completely.
    Originally posted by GingerBob
    Yes, you have.
    • Pixie5740
    • By Pixie5740 14th Oct 16, 4:30 PM
    • 8,862 Posts
    • 11,882 Thanks
    Pixie5740
    • #7
    • 14th Oct 16, 4:30 PM
    • #7
    • 14th Oct 16, 4:30 PM
    GingerBob what is wrong with the way that Nationwide, or any other mortgage lender for that matter, decide upon the affordability for potential borrowers? Lenders were a bit too free and easy with mortgage lending pre-2008 (and there were some very stupid borrowers taking silly risks) and look how that ended up.

    Mortgage Market Review rules were introduced in April 2014 so now lenders have to ensure that borrowers can afford the mortgage in all circumstances such as if interest rates were 7%. That's quite possibly why the OP cannot borrow the additional £18k.
    Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen pounds nineteen and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds nought and six, result misery.
    • GingerBob
    • By GingerBob 14th Oct 16, 4:39 PM
    • 3,046 Posts
    • 1,288 Thanks
    GingerBob
    • #8
    • 14th Oct 16, 4:39 PM
    • #8
    • 14th Oct 16, 4:39 PM
    Yes, you have.
    Originally posted by ReadingTim

    No. You have. You went off at a tangent in your argument.
    • GingerBob
    • By GingerBob 14th Oct 16, 4:42 PM
    • 3,046 Posts
    • 1,288 Thanks
    GingerBob
    • #9
    • 14th Oct 16, 4:42 PM
    • #9
    • 14th Oct 16, 4:42 PM
    GingerBob what is wrong with the way that Nationwide, or any other mortgage lender for that matter, decide upon the affordability for potential borrowers? Lenders were a bit too free and easy with mortgage lending pre-2008 (and there were some very stupid borrowers taking silly risks) and look how that ended up.

    Mortgage Market Review rules were introduced in April 2014 so now lenders have to ensure that borrowers can afford the mortgage in all circumstances such as if interest rates were 7%. That's quite possibly why the OP cannot borrow the additional £18k.
    Originally posted by Pixie5740

    Common sense no longer prevails in some cases (like this one). That is the problem. We hear all the time of mortgage providers refusing a new deal on the grounds of affordability even when it would result in lower payments. Plain stupidity and incompetence on the part of the lenders.
    • BrassicWoman
    • By BrassicWoman 14th Oct 16, 5:09 PM
    • 1,040 Posts
    • 4,283 Thanks
    BrassicWoman
    Hi,

    if you can only afford £100 a month, which is what the 18 years to pay it back implies, then you would be unaffordable if there were an interest rate rise.

    Can you afford a higher repayment and a shorter term? An unsecured loan with a different lender may then be an option.
    May GC £215/£50 (oops)
    April 2016 GC: £24.09/ £20
    • pontiac custom catalina
    • By pontiac custom catalina 14th Oct 16, 10:24 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    pontiac custom catalina
    As I said, I was paying the higher amount off comfortably and no, I'm not in debt up to the eyeballs.......quite the opposite as I'm old school and don't even have a credit card ! Luckily the mortgage is the only loan / debt I have. What irks me is that no one at Nationwide can offer an explanation as to why ? Is the ' affordability calculator ' some kind of secret ? I'd just like to know the reason !!
    • zx81
    • By zx81 14th Oct 16, 10:28 PM
    • 9,371 Posts
    • 9,208 Thanks
    zx81
    The Nationwide call centre won't be able to tell you anything specific.

    Lending is simply more cautious now than it used to be - so a mortgage you may have got some years ago may not be achieveable now.
    • boo_star
    • By boo_star 14th Oct 16, 11:51 PM
    • 1,112 Posts
    • 528 Thanks
    boo_star
    As I said, I was paying the higher amount off comfortably and no, I'm not in debt up to the eyeballs.......quite the opposite as I'm old school and don't even have a credit card ! Luckily the mortgage is the only loan / debt I have. What irks me is that no one at Nationwide can offer an explanation as to why ? Is the ' affordability calculator ' some kind of secret ? I'd just like to know the reason !!
    Originally posted by pontiac custom catalina
    Martin made a post and a partial campaign out of it.

    Yes, it is stupid that people remortgaging can be and are refused because their remortgage is considered "unaffordable" even when the payments are less.

    It's a silly EU rule that wasn't thought through before it was implemented, but in the short term there's not a lot you can do about it.
    • pontiac custom catalina
    • By pontiac custom catalina 15th Oct 16, 5:51 AM
    • 4 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    pontiac custom catalina
    There was me thinking that over 6 years of loyalty to Nationwide with a 100% track record might actually mean something !
    • Pixie5740
    • By Pixie5740 15th Oct 16, 7:51 AM
    • 8,862 Posts
    • 11,882 Thanks
    Pixie5740
    There was me thinking that over 6 years of loyalty to Nationwide with a 100% track record might actually mean something !
    Originally posted by pontiac custom catalina
    Not if you can't meet affordability with the new MMR regulations.
    Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen pounds nineteen and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds nought and six, result misery.
    • Pixie5740
    • By Pixie5740 15th Oct 16, 7:55 AM
    • 8,862 Posts
    • 11,882 Thanks
    Pixie5740
    Common sense no longer prevails in some cases (like this one). That is the problem. We hear all the time of mortgage providers refusing a new deal on the grounds of affordability even when it would result in lower payments. Plain stupidity and incompetence on the part of the lenders.
    Originally posted by GingerBob
    You do realise that no one has a god given right to credit....

    Mortgage lenders have to play by the rules and one of those rules is ensuring borrowers can afford the repayments if interest rates were to rise.

    Imagine the furore if the BoE base rate went up to 5% and borrowers could no longer keep up repayments. It would all be the lender's fault. They can't win.
    Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen pounds nineteen and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds nought and six, result misery.
    • GingerBob
    • By GingerBob 15th Oct 16, 4:32 PM
    • 3,046 Posts
    • 1,288 Thanks
    GingerBob
    You do realise that no one has a god given right to credit....

    Mortgage lenders have to play by the rules and one of those rules is ensuring borrowers can afford the repayments if interest rates were to rise.

    Imagine the furore if the BoE base rate went up to 5% and borrowers could no longer keep up repayments. It would all be the lender's fault. They can't win.
    Originally posted by Pixie5740

    So you think refusing a re-mortgage on the grounds of 'affordability' even when it would result is lower payments makes sense, do you?
    • Thrugelmir
    • By Thrugelmir 15th Oct 16, 5:09 PM
    • 51,277 Posts
    • 43,081 Thanks
    Thrugelmir
    Earlier this year I changed my Nationwide mortgage product to another of theirs and saved £114 per month by switching.
    Now planning some home improvements, so I rang Nationwide to borrow £18,000 over the remaining 18 years of mortgage which would equate to less than £100 per month - less than my mortgage before - and I failed the affordability test !
    I have a 100% payment record, was paying it comfortably before the reduction and nothing else has changed. Nationwide could offer no explanation other than ' computer says no ! '
    Originally posted by pontiac custom catalina
    Switching product requires no affordability checks. An increase in the amount borrowed will do. So far more involved than the computer simply saying no. The Mortgage Market Review changed the landscape permanently. I suspect you are basing affordability at current low interest rates not what they might be.
    “A man is rich who lives upon what he has. A man is poor who lives upon what is coming. A prudent man lives within his income, and saves against ‘a rainy day’.”
    • Thrugelmir
    • By Thrugelmir 15th Oct 16, 5:10 PM
    • 51,277 Posts
    • 43,081 Thanks
    Thrugelmir
    There was me thinking that over 6 years of loyalty to Nationwide with a 100% track record might actually mean something !
    Originally posted by pontiac custom catalina
    Absolutely nothing. I've shopped in Tesco's for over 40 years. Still don't give me any more discount.
    “A man is rich who lives upon what he has. A man is poor who lives upon what is coming. A prudent man lives within his income, and saves against ‘a rainy day’.”
    • pontiac custom catalina
    • By pontiac custom catalina 15th Oct 16, 9:50 PM
    • 4 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    pontiac custom catalina
    As I said before, what I don't get is the lack of explanation when you don't ' pass ' their test ? Why not say it's a, b, c, etc ? They just leave you clueless . And as the mortgage makes up less than 25% of income and it's well within their LTV range ....... I'm at a loss. If the mortgage doubled I would still be able to afford it !
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

431Posts Today

1,798Users online

Martin's Twitter