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  • FIRST POST
    • battyboimatt
    • By battyboimatt 13th Oct 16, 12:29 PM
    • 580Posts
    • 231Thanks
    battyboimatt
    Pip
    • #1
    • 13th Oct 16, 12:29 PM
    Pip 13th Oct 16 at 12:29 PM
    Pip tribuneral

    I am just after some advice, I helped my sister by doing a letter for a mandatory reconsidern for her PIP, she was 2 points short on care and a couple on moblity. The mandatory reconsidertaion was declined so we put in an appeal for the tribuneral, we ticked that she wanted a oral hearing and put me as a representative, as the months have gone on we recived a letter to sign for her medical records, then we got a copy of the medical records.

    Then on Saturday we had a letter from the tribuneral service saying they have done a paper assesment and that she lost her appeal, however no opportunaty was given for us to submit anything for a wirtten assessment other than the letter to sign for medical records, is this something new, especially as we asked for a oral hearing ?

    Thanks
Page 1
    • Diary
    • By Diary 13th Oct 16, 4:17 PM
    • 418 Posts
    • 461 Thanks
    Diary
    • #2
    • 13th Oct 16, 4:17 PM
    • #2
    • 13th Oct 16, 4:17 PM
    Pip tribuneral

    I am just after some advice, I helped my sister by doing a letter for a mandatory reconsidern for her PIP, she was 2 points short on care and a couple on moblity. The mandatory reconsidertaion was declined so we put in an appeal for the tribuneral, we ticked that she wanted a oral hearing and put me as a representative, as the months have gone on we recived a letter to sign for her medical records, then we got a copy of the medical records.

    Then on Saturday we had a letter from the tribuneral service saying they have done a paper assesment and that she lost her appeal, however no opportunaty was given for us to submit anything for a wirtten assessment other than the letter to sign for medical records, is this something new, especially as we asked for a oral hearing ?

    Thanks
    Originally posted by battyboimatt
    No its not a new thing.

    You imply you would have sent written submissions if you'd known it was a written assessment and not oral -- why didn't you send the written evidence you had anyway? You can submit anything you like at anytime before the hearing. Were you told this in your letters from the court?

    Your only route now is a second tier tribunal on an error of law by the court or error of procedure by the court, you need specialist face to face advise from a benefits tribunal specialist, preferably a benefits solicitor.
    Master Apothecary Faranell replied, “I assure you, overseer, the Royal Apothecary Society dearly wishes to make up for the tragic misguidance which ended so many lives. We will cause you no trouble. We seek only to continue our research in peace".
    • densol
    • By densol 13th Oct 16, 8:42 PM
    • 1,112 Posts
    • 991 Thanks
    densol
    • #3
    • 13th Oct 16, 8:42 PM
    • #3
    • 13th Oct 16, 8:42 PM
    I would write an urgent letter to the Tribunal, point out that you have requested an oral hearing and not paper and ask for the decision to be set aside due to the error. This request needs to be done within 28 days of the decision.
    Stuck on the carousel in Disneyland's Fantasyland

    I live under a bridge in England
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    Retired in 2015 ( ill health ) Actuary for legal services.
    • Alice Holt
    • By Alice Holt 14th Oct 16, 7:15 PM
    • 578 Posts
    • 522 Thanks
    Alice Holt
    • #4
    • 14th Oct 16, 7:15 PM
    • #4
    • 14th Oct 16, 7:15 PM
    Firstly you need to request a Statement of Reasons from the tribunal (you need to do this within a month of the tribunal decision letter).
    Read the Tribunal Decision notice for more info.

    You could then ask the Upper Tribunal to set aside the decision, and to schedule your appeal for a re-hearing. I would suggest that you base your request on the argument that there has been an error in law for the breach of natural justice in not allowing you to present oral evidence at the appeal.


    "If you have an Employment Support Allowance decision at the First Tier tribunal which
    you are not happy with then you can appeal to the Upper Tribunal. Please note the
    procedure below and, importantly, the timeframes. One of the main problems with this is
    that you generally cannot submit additional evidence. The question that the Upper
    Tribunal must face is whether the first tier tribunal made an error in law when
    considering the documents and testimony that they had on the day. This is another
    reason why it is important to make sure that enough evidence is sent in for the original
    first tier tribunal appeal.
    The process
    a. You must ask the tribunal which you have been dealing for a statement of
    reasons and a record of proceedings. You must ask for this for within one month
    of the tribunal decision. It can sometimes take a while for it to be sent to you, in
    some cases this can be a number of months.
    b. When you receive the statement of reasons then it must be compared to the
    documents that were available on the day to see if there are any arguable points
    which may be considered errors of law.
    c. You then must apply for permission to appeal to the upper tribunal by writing to
    the original tribunal. This must be done again within one month of the statement
    of reasons. You must include a copy of the original decision you are appealing
    against. You should also include the issues which you think are errors in law.
    When you apply for permission you can also request that the judge set aside the
    decision and start a new tribunal.
    d. If the Judge refuses these requests then you can apply directly to the Upper
    Tribunal. You must apply directly to the Upper Tribunal within one month of
    receiving the decision. You must apply using the UT1 form which is available on
    the Upper tribunal website: http://www.justice.gov.uk/guidance/courts-andtribunals/tribunals/aa/form/index.htm.

    The question of whether you appeal or not is based on whether the tribunal have made
    an error of law. It does not matter if you did not have the best evidence with you. Nor
    does it matter if you have better evidence now. The Upper tribunal will only look at the
    decision the tribunal made on the day with the evidence they had in front of them at the
    time.
    What is an error of law?
    a. The tribunal were wrong in there application of the law, i.e. it misinterpreted a
    previous decision or a statute.
    b. There was no evidence to support the decision that the tribunal came to.
    c. The tribunal made decisions after getting the facts wrong in the case.
    d. A breach of procedure/breach of natural justice, for example: irrationally not
    allowing an adjournment; not allowing you to call witnesses; no interpreter or bad
    interpretation; you did not get notice of the hearing; you did not receive the
    Department of Work and Pensions’ submission; you asked for an oral hearing but
    one did not take place.

    e. The tribunal did not give adequate reasons for its decision.
    f. The Tribunal accept a government Medical Report such as one performed by
    ATOS Healthcare over your GP’s medical report without giving good reason of
    choosing one over the other.

    Not an error of law
    It is not an error of law if a different tribunal would have come to a different conclusion
    but the original tribunal did not make any of the above mistakes."

    You may wish to get help from your local CAB / advice centre.
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