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  • FIRST POST
    • Bananas123
    • By Bananas123 11th Oct 16, 2:05 AM
    • 226Posts
    • 106Thanks
    Bananas123
    ESA WRAG job centre harassing" in the interim ?, allowed ? thanks for any help
    • #1
    • 11th Oct 16, 2:05 AM
    ESA WRAG job centre harassing" in the interim ?, allowed ? thanks for any help 11th Oct 16 at 2:05 AM
    hello,

    i am in the wrag group, thus having to goto to "work focused interviews".

    i am finding the process negative for health, but have been reluctantly agreeing to the activity (vs. being sanctioned...)

    last time, having agreed to carrears advice in november (having had the woman told me, she was going to upload my cv to the "job match website"...).

    she has now (approximately 1 month before agreead november appointment), starting ringing my family phone, leaving messages with my family to be passed on to me etc ("harrassing by proxy").

    please can anybody tell me if they are in their right to do this ? (away from designated / agreed times with no prior notification, leaving messages with people who are not me, when i have already agreed to something in the future)

    thanks for any help or advice.
Page 1
    • dippy3103
    • By dippy3103 11th Oct 16, 7:28 AM
    • 1,518 Posts
    • 2,326 Thanks
    dippy3103
    • #2
    • 11th Oct 16, 7:28 AM
    • #2
    • 11th Oct 16, 7:28 AM
    What are the messages?
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 11th Oct 16, 7:35 AM
    • 2,735 Posts
    • 4,277 Thanks
    sangie595
    • #3
    • 11th Oct 16, 7:35 AM
    • #3
    • 11th Oct 16, 7:35 AM
    How did she get the phone number?

    Did she agree that the only activity you have to do is attend a careers interview? Surely you would still have to do something else in the interim?
    • TELLIT01
    • By TELLIT01 11th Oct 16, 8:09 AM
    • 2,645 Posts
    • 2,551 Thanks
    TELLIT01
    • #4
    • 11th Oct 16, 8:09 AM
    • #4
    • 11th Oct 16, 8:09 AM
    Without knowing the actual content of the calls it's not possible to say whether it is harrassment or not. If they are calling either to provide or gather information prior to your appointment then I don't see the problem.
    You are in the Work Related Activity Group because you are expected to undertake activities related to preparing you for returning to work, the clue is in the name. The whole ethos behind ESA is to get people back into the workplace, not remaining forever on benefit.
    • Diary
    • By Diary 11th Oct 16, 5:08 PM
    • 417 Posts
    • 459 Thanks
    Diary
    • #5
    • 11th Oct 16, 5:08 PM
    • #5
    • 11th Oct 16, 5:08 PM
    hello,

    i am in the wrag group, thus having to goto to "work focused interviews".

    i am finding the process negative for health, but have been reluctantly agreeing to the activity (vs. being sanctioned...)

    last time, having agreed to carrears advice in november (having had the woman told me, she was going to upload my cv to the "job match website"...).

    she has now (approximately 1 month before agreead november appointment), starting ringing my family phone, leaving messages with my family to be passed on to me etc ("harrassing by proxy").

    please can anybody tell me if they are in their right to do this ? (away from designated / agreed times with no prior notification, leaving messages with people who are not me, when i have already agreed to something in the future)

    thanks for any help or advice.
    Originally posted by Bananas123
    Why give them a phone number lots of other people answer if you didnt want the job centre to contact you via the phone or leave messages?

    They are within their rights to phone on a number you've given and as you've given no details of the calls its not harassment.
    Master Apothecary Faranell replied, “I assure you, overseer, the Royal Apothecary Society dearly wishes to make up for the tragic misguidance which ended so many lives. We will cause you no trouble. We seek only to continue our research in peace".
    • TELLIT01
    • By TELLIT01 11th Oct 16, 8:31 PM
    • 2,645 Posts
    • 2,551 Thanks
    TELLIT01
    • #6
    • 11th Oct 16, 8:31 PM
    • #6
    • 11th Oct 16, 8:31 PM
    It could be argued that they shouldn't leave messages with a 3rd party. However, if the OP is never the person to answer the phone, they may believe they are being helpful by doing so. If the OP doesn't want messages left with other people he/she needs to let ESA know that.
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 11th Oct 16, 9:08 PM
    • 2,735 Posts
    • 4,277 Thanks
    sangie595
    • #7
    • 11th Oct 16, 9:08 PM
    • #7
    • 11th Oct 16, 9:08 PM
    The message could be as simple as "Please tell him I called and could he ring back". It's really hard to leave voicemail for someone if the phone gets answered!
    • Gpod
    • By Gpod 11th Oct 16, 9:58 PM
    • 25 Posts
    • 14 Thanks
    Gpod
    • #8
    • 11th Oct 16, 9:58 PM
    • #8
    • 11th Oct 16, 9:58 PM
    last time, having agreed to carrears advice in november (having had the woman told me, she was going to upload my cv to the "job match website"...).

    she has now (approximately 1 month before agreead november appointment), starting ringing my family phone, leaving messages with my family to be passed on to me etc ("harrassing by proxy").
    Originally posted by Bananas123
    Is the careers adviser a Jobcentre employee or employed as a DWP provider?

    Either way, you should write to the JC, or the provider, and state that you do not consent to being contacted by phone, and that you withdraw any implied consent to contact you by phone which may have been given when you provided your phone number. You could also add that you wish to be contacted by post only.
    • Adereterial
    • By Adereterial 11th Oct 16, 10:09 PM
    • 474 Posts
    • 644 Thanks
    Adereterial
    • #9
    • 11th Oct 16, 10:09 PM
    • #9
    • 11th Oct 16, 10:09 PM
    Unless you know what the calls are about, you cannot claim harassment. Could they, perhaps, be calling to rearrange or change the location?

    Simple resolution to this is to call them back, and find out what they want, and deal with it before hysterically accusing them of 'harassment' or 'harassment by proxy'.

    And yes - they have a right to call you. Multiple times if you don't have the courtesy to call them back.
    • dippy3103
    • By dippy3103 12th Oct 16, 9:42 AM
    • 1,518 Posts
    • 2,326 Thanks
    dippy3103
    Is the careers adviser a Jobcentre employee or employed as a DWP provider?

    Either way, you should write to the JC, or the provider, and state that you do not consent to being contacted by phone, and that you withdraw any implied consent to contact you by phone which may have been given when you provided your phone number. You could also add that you wish to be contacted by post only.
    Originally posted by Gpod
    Right... so if there was an issue with the payment of benefit then the o/p would be happy to wait for the post?
    • allison445
    • By allison445 12th Oct 16, 11:16 AM
    • 163 Posts
    • 150 Thanks
    allison445
    I think you maybe worded your title wrong from reading under the lines I think the problem is you feel you are being pressured to do things you aren't ready to do. I would explain to the adviser how this is effecting your health and the reasons why you don't feel ready yet. It seems to be a bit of hit and miss regarding how people on the wrag are treated and what they can and can't ask you to do. I have been really fortunate and had a great adviser at the job center who explained fully the ins and outs of what happens next. I Have never been contacted by phone it is always letter and a text message reminder. I attend workshops with an outside provider (ingeus) 2 - 3 times a week by choice not sure if this has any bearing on the fact there not constantly on my case plus I really do find it helpful.
    • TELLIT01
    • By TELLIT01 12th Oct 16, 1:40 PM
    • 2,645 Posts
    • 2,551 Thanks
    TELLIT01
    Right... so if there was an issue with the payment of benefit then the o/p would be happy to wait for the post?
    Originally posted by dippy3103
    You might be surprised at how many claimants are extremely nervous about using the phone and therefore prefer to complete the paper forms. They can become very flustered when being asked questions over the phone as they don't have time to properly formulate an answer. This is particularly true of those with mental health issues. Requesting all communication be done by post is perfectly acceptable to DWP, but there is the caveat that this will, by its very nature, delay things if there are any problems with the claim.
    Last edited by MSE ForumTeam5; 15-10-2016 at 12:26 PM. Reason: Quoting deleted post
    • dippy3103
    • By dippy3103 12th Oct 16, 1:45 PM
    • 1,518 Posts
    • 2,326 Thanks
    dippy3103
    You might be surprised at how many claimants are extremely nervous about using the phone and therefore prefer to complete the paper forms. They can become very flustered when being asked questions over the phone as they don't have time to properly formulate an answer. This is particularly true of those with mental health issues. Requesting all communication be done by post is perfectly acceptable to DWP, but there is the caveat that this will, by its very nature, delay things if there are any problems with the claim.
    Originally posted by TELLIT01
    In those instances it's fair enough.

    But the o/p is suggesting leaving telephone messages to be harassment which is a huge leap
    • Bananas123
    • By Bananas123 12th Oct 16, 6:18 PM
    • 226 Posts
    • 106 Thanks
    Bananas123
    hello,

    thanks for all replies, i think....

    "harassing" i just picked the word at random (was supposed to have another set of commas > typo)

    sorry to disapoint the resident psychics > wtf ?

    (they don't handout their internal (workstation) number, so you have to ring the job centre and await a call back > which for someone who is ill, with work-related activity, making them iller, who is being stressed by phone calls, away for arrangement.... is realllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllly (sarcasm) good advise ?)

    verb (used with object) 1. pester
    "harassing" "pestering" whatever....

    she rang 3 times, leaving a message with family that she would be ringing back (i was in bed sick)

    but then didn't bother...........

    --------------------------

    3 unwarranted phone messages, and a message to do something, that was obviously not THAT important (with harrassing being a synonym of pestering).

    thankyou, feeling much better after the bed rest....
    Last edited by Bananas123; 12-10-2016 at 6:24 PM.
    • TELLIT01
    • By TELLIT01 12th Oct 16, 6:54 PM
    • 2,645 Posts
    • 2,551 Thanks
    TELLIT01
    In those instances it's fair enough.

    But the o/p is suggesting leaving telephone messages to be harassment which is a huge leap
    Originally posted by dippy3103
    I agree with you dippy. I was just indicating that requesting contact by letter only is acceptable. I very much doubt that has been done in this case.
    • Bananas123
    • By Bananas123 12th Oct 16, 7:44 PM
    • 226 Posts
    • 106 Thanks
    Bananas123
    Harassment by proxy is a criminal offence, it's quite clear what you meant in your first post.

    How do you know the calls were unwarranted, have you bothered to call back? After the advisor had tried you three times I wouldn't expect her to waste any more time trying to help you.
    Originally posted by Bogalot
    well then please explain, why they left a message directly informing me they were rining back the very next day ?

    or have you now got a bee in your bonnet because you offered no help along with your psychic preminitions ?, only negativity.

    -----------------------

    thankyou, posts #4, #5, + for answering the question.

    "yes they are within their right to do so"

    thankyou.
    • KxMx
    • By KxMx 12th Oct 16, 8:28 PM
    • 6,733 Posts
    • 9,177 Thanks
    KxMx
    Have you asked your advisor for their direct dial number?

    My WRAG advisor didn't offer. I had to ask and it was given.
    Last edited by KxMx; 12-10-2016 at 8:31 PM.
    • Bananas123
    • By Bananas123 12th Oct 16, 8:41 PM
    • 226 Posts
    • 106 Thanks
    Bananas123
    thanks.

    no, i kind of want to keep contact to a minimum....

    last time i was on "work related activity" my appendix ruptured my diaphram (...against my wishes) directly because of the work related activity (i did tell them i was too ill to go)

    i don't mind doing the activity that i am capable of, but then they start ringing and ringing... when you are too ill to even get out of bed in your free time....

    kind of want to tell them to "!!!! off", hence questioning if it was allowed to be spamming my phone like that....

    but it is unfortunately what it is (thankyou for the people who answered).
    Last edited by Bananas123; 12-10-2016 at 8:44 PM.
    • TELLIT01
    • By TELLIT01 12th Oct 16, 9:11 PM
    • 2,645 Posts
    • 2,551 Thanks
    TELLIT01
    If they said they were going to call back at a certain time they should have done so but, in their defence, the workload on the advisors is being increases on an almost daily basis. Slightly different area, but speaking to people I used to work with on claims processing, they have recently had their workload increased by 20%. It was damn nigh impossible to hit the targets when I was there. Impossible that is if you wanted to do the job right. My team leader actually said to me that the only thing that mattered was the number of claims we processed. Any problems would be for another team to sort out!!
    • Bananas123
    • By Bananas123 12th Oct 16, 9:26 PM
    • 226 Posts
    • 106 Thanks
    Bananas123
    thanks!

    can anybody tell me / help

    if i get a sick note from the doctor, then can i tell them to proverbial off ? / will not have to engage in "work related activity" / yield phone calls for the duration ?.

    thanks for any help
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