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  • FIRST POST
    • safp888
    • By safp888 10th Oct 16, 12:07 AM
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    safp888
    MOT Advisory Notes
    • #1
    • 10th Oct 16, 12:07 AM
    MOT Advisory Notes 10th Oct 16 at 12:07 AM
    Hey all,

    My 09 Ford Fiesta (65k miles on the clock) has passed the MOT. However, there are quite a few advisory checks. Most of them are cosmetic and self-explanatory, but I need someone to clarify a couple of them:

    • Both lower arm ball joint boot splitting £445
    • Slight play in o, s, f rack drumstick £247

    Please can someone explain in lame terms what that means? Are they urgent and are the price quotes fair?

    Thanks!
Page 1
    • Richard53
    • By Richard53 10th Oct 16, 1:03 AM
    • 2,221 Posts
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    Richard53
    • #2
    • 10th Oct 16, 1:03 AM
    • #2
    • 10th Oct 16, 1:03 AM
    The MoT doesn't cover cosmetic items, so please explain what you mean there.


    The items are both suspension/steering issues. An advisory is a way of drawing your attention to something which does not fail on the day of inspection, but which will need looking at in the future. Replacing the ball joint boot sooner rather than later might save the ball joint itself (it stops water getting in). I'm not in the motor trade, but those prices seem high. Perhaps keep an eye on things (and an ear for knocks and bangs underneath) and get a couple of quotes before committing yourself.
    If all misfortunes were laid in one common heap whence everyone must take an equal portion, most people would be contented to take their own and depart. (Attrib. to Socrates)
    • Strider590
    • By Strider590 10th Oct 16, 1:19 AM
    • 10,457 Posts
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    Strider590
    • #3
    • 10th Oct 16, 1:19 AM
    • #3
    • 10th Oct 16, 1:19 AM
    Quite ridiculous pricing.

    The ball joints for a start, are each around £20 + labour and i'm pretty certain they won't be that hard or time consuming to change.
    Last edited by Strider590; 10-10-2016 at 1:22 AM.
    Having the last word isn't the same as being right.......

    "Never confuse education with intelligence"
    • bartelbe
    • By bartelbe 10th Oct 16, 10:52 AM
    • 352 Posts
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    bartelbe
    • #4
    • 10th Oct 16, 10:52 AM
    • #4
    • 10th Oct 16, 10:52 AM
    Quite ridiculous pricing.

    The ball joints for a start, are each around £20 + labour and i'm pretty certain they won't be that hard or time consuming to change.
    They are ridiculous prices, but to be fair on some modern cars you can't just change the ball joint. You have to change the whole suspension arm.
    • =rizla=
    • By =rizla= 10th Oct 16, 5:38 PM
    • 219 Posts
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    =rizla=
    • #5
    • 10th Oct 16, 5:38 PM
    • #5
    • 10th Oct 16, 5:38 PM
    I had an older fiesta and had to change the lower arm, it was quite an easy job to do (I was lucky the last person to change them used copper slip, so only took me 30 mins), 3 bolts to replace, looking on the internet you're looking at £30(ebay)-£70(eurocarparts) per side for the parts.
    • patman99
    • By patman99 10th Oct 16, 5:39 PM
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    patman99
    • #6
    • 10th Oct 16, 5:39 PM
    • #6
    • 10th Oct 16, 5:39 PM
    If you read the post, it's the ball joint boot that needs replacing, not the ball joint.

    Not sure if they are still available, but you used to be able to get 2-part boots for various joints. No need to remove any part of the suspension.
    Never Knowingly Understood.

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    • flashg67
    • By flashg67 10th Oct 16, 7:31 PM
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    flashg67
    • #7
    • 10th Oct 16, 7:31 PM
    • #7
    • 10th Oct 16, 7:31 PM
    I'll second that the prices seem silly - get a quote at a good independent if you don't fancy it yourself.
    I've messed around doing ball joint in the past - slightly more cost but do the whole arm is my choice
    • nickcc
    • By nickcc 10th Oct 16, 7:31 PM
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    nickcc
    • #8
    • 10th Oct 16, 7:31 PM
    • #8
    • 10th Oct 16, 7:31 PM
    I've been in the motor trade over 50 years and I've never seen two part boots on ball joints. If the boots split then water/dirt will have entered the ball joint which cannot be removed as modern ball joints don't strip down so new joints will be required.
    • BeenThroughItAll
    • By BeenThroughItAll 10th Oct 16, 7:50 PM
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    BeenThroughItAll
    • #9
    • 10th Oct 16, 7:50 PM
    • #9
    • 10th Oct 16, 7:50 PM
    I've been in the motor trade over 50 years and I've never seen two part boots on ball joints. If the boots split then water/dirt will have entered the ball joint which cannot be removed as modern ball joints don't strip down so new joints will be required.
    Originally posted by nickcc
    How you've missed them I wouldn't know, they've been the bodge of choice in certain circles for years:

    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNIVERSAL-SPLIT-BALL-JOINT-TRACK-ROD-END-RUBBER-BOOT-GAITER-KIT-FITS-ALL-CARS-/171851510749
    • nickcc
    • By nickcc 10th Oct 16, 7:53 PM
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    nickcc
    How you've missed them I wouldn't know, they've been the bodge of choice in certain circles for years:

    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNIVERSAL-SPLIT-BALL-JOINT-TRACK-ROD-END-RUBBER-BOOT-GAITER-KIT-FITS-ALL-CARS-/171851510749
    Originally posted by BeenThroughItAll
    Probably because I don't work with dodgy motors.
    • BeenThroughItAll
    • By BeenThroughItAll 10th Oct 16, 7:57 PM
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    BeenThroughItAll
    Probably because I don't work with dodgy motors.
    Originally posted by nickcc
    You mean in 50 years you've not once seen a car owned, maintained, borrowed, hired or sold by someone dodgy?

    You must be the only one.

    BTW, before anyone takes the link I posted as evidence of my own dodgy antics, don't bother. Split boots are !!!! and I would not recommend wasting money even trying them.
    • Joe Horner
    • By Joe Horner 10th Oct 16, 8:46 PM
    • 3,661 Posts
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    Joe Horner
    If you're determined to glue a joint boot you may as well just glue the original if there's no bits missing - actually works quite well on simple splits as a stop-gap.
    • salubrious
    • By salubrious 10th Oct 16, 9:51 PM
    • 198 Posts
    • 82 Thanks
    salubrious
    I can tell you this much, the prices are ridiculous.
    • Robisere
    • By Robisere 10th Oct 16, 9:55 PM
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    Robisere
    I was also in the trade a long time nickcc, and I remember seeing a few of those boots. They were split and intended to be glued together. I never saw one that lasted more than a few miles. The old boot had to be cut off and the old grease removed, boot folded around the joint, new grease inserted, boot superglued. Problem was, the surfaces of the new boot had to be completely grease-free for the glue to work. Practically impossible!

    BeenThroughIt All, you obviously share the prevalent attitude that all mechanics and all garages wear a stetson hat and ride to work on a mustang pony. No, we're not all the same, no more than in any other job. However, I met a few customers in my time who could fit that description.
    There may be more than one way to skin a cat.
    But the result is always inedible.

    • EdGasket
    • By EdGasket 11th Oct 16, 10:00 AM
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    EdGasket
    You mean in 50 years you've not once seen a car owned, maintained, borrowed, hired or sold by someone dodgy?

    You must be the only one.

    BTW, before anyone takes the link I posted as evidence of my own dodgy antics, don't bother. Split boots are !!!! and I would not recommend wasting money even trying them.
    Originally posted by BeenThroughItAll
    There were some split boots available once that actually zipped together; not seen them for years now though. The stretch boots aren't bad if you are strong enough to fit them over the cone! Otherwise if the shaft is off, you may just as well knock off the joint and fit a standard boot. This is of course, driveshaft boots; doesn't apply to ball joint boots which is what the OP needs.
    • BeenThroughItAll
    • By BeenThroughItAll 11th Oct 16, 10:53 AM
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    BeenThroughItAll
    I was also in the trade a long time nickcc, and I remember seeing a few of those boots. They were split and intended to be glued together. I never saw one that lasted more than a few miles. The old boot had to be cut off and the old grease removed, boot folded around the joint, new grease inserted, boot superglued. Problem was, the surfaces of the new boot had to be completely grease-free for the glue to work. Practically impossible!

    BeenThroughIt All, you obviously share the prevalent attitude that all mechanics and all garages wear a stetson hat and ride to work on a mustang pony. No, we're not all the same, no more than in any other job. However, I met a few customers in my time who could fit that description.
    Originally posted by Robisere
    I don't know what flawed logic process has led you to that conclusion, but if you read my posts again nowhere will you find any statement implying that all mechanics and garages are cowboys. I deal with plenty of perfectly honest and trustworthy people in the motor trade on a weekly basis. Nor am I a dodgy customer.

    I was making the point that I found it hard to believe that after a claimed 50 years in the trade a person would not once have come across a split boot. Let's just do the maths:

    Assume 50 years at 200 working days a year = 10,000 days.

    Assume 1 car seen every two days (conservative) = 5000 cars.

    I posit that it is incredibly, vanishingly unlikely that out of 5000 cars not one would have been placed in front of a person that would have had the attention of a dodgy person; and I further suggest, as I did in my post, that if one was to go 50 years without seeing such, one would likely be the only person lucky enough to do so.

    Oh, the irony of being accused of tarring all mechanics with the same brush, by a mechanic keen to tar me with the brush of a prevailing attitude which I do not, contrary to accusation, share.
    • BeenThroughItAll
    • By BeenThroughItAll 11th Oct 16, 10:56 AM
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    BeenThroughItAll
    There were some split boots available once that actually zipped together; not seen them for years now though. The stretch boots aren't bad if you are strong enough to fit them over the cone! Otherwise if the shaft is off, you may just as well knock off the joint and fit a standard boot. This is of course, driveshaft boots; doesn't apply to ball joint boots which is what the OP needs.
    Originally posted by EdGasket
    Mm, I've seen the odd zipper boot. Equally !!!!. I've used stretch boots as temporary repairs on a couple of occasions (I used to carry a manual cone and stretchy boot in my toolkit). Much easier with an air driven stretcher, and only worth doing if you can't easily or quickly remove the driveshaft or joint.

    Mind, for a ball joint I can't understand the logic of not just splitting the joint and replacing the boot properly, or whole joint if it's damaged. Not a big job just to split a joint.
    • King_Nothing
    • By King_Nothing 11th Oct 16, 12:07 PM
    • 731 Posts
    • 934 Thanks
    King_Nothing
    Ball joint price sounds like cost for replacement arms, if they're similar to my focus; the ball joints will be riveted into the ends of the arms so the only option is to replace the whole arm... or drill out the rivets and replace with £20 ball joints that just bolt back in place + labour costs, for what it's worth I wouldn't be replacing the ball joint boots and just replace the whole joints instead.
    • BeenThroughItAll
    • By BeenThroughItAll 11th Oct 16, 12:14 PM
    • 3,465 Posts
    • 2,774 Thanks
    BeenThroughItAll
    Ball joint price sounds like cost for replacement arms, if they're similar to my focus; the ball joints will be riveted into the ends of the arms so the only option is to replace the whole arm... or drill out the rivets and replace with £20 ball joints that just bolt back in place + labour costs, for what it's worth I wouldn't be replacing the ball joint boots and just replace the whole joints instead.
    Originally posted by King_Nothing
    At that price, they must be quoting for gold plated arms. As mentioned above, Mk7 arms are available from 30quid upwards, and they're a doddle to change, perhaps half an hour a side. Two bolts, one pinch bolt on the ball joint. Job done.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFtzedpr-AI
    • safp888
    • By safp888 14th Oct 16, 10:25 AM
    • 8 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    safp888
    Thanks for your replies. What about the other issue (Slight play in o, s, f rack drumstick)? Is it worth doing? Is the price fair? Could it last me for another year until the next mot?

    My plan was to leave the car as it is until July-August time, and then sell the car and get a new one. I don't want to invest all this money into an old car. Cam belt is up for renewal next year too, so not sure if it's worth fixing it.

    There are other issues as well, like the wing mirrors (case is broken) and other bits and bobs. The total advisory bill is £1.1k. Obviously it's over priced, but keep in mind that I need to change the cam belt too. So is it worth investing £1k in a car that's worth less than £2k?

    It's got 65,000 miles on the clock - base model 09 Ford Fiesta.

    Thanks.
    Last edited by safp888; 14-10-2016 at 10:27 AM.
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