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  • FIRST POST
    • dranzer01
    • By dranzer01 8th Oct 16, 4:58 PM
    • 172Posts
    • 32Thanks
    dranzer01
    Termination Of A Contractor
    • #1
    • 8th Oct 16, 4:58 PM
    Termination Of A Contractor 8th Oct 16 at 4:58 PM
    If you are on a 12 month contract, and the company terminates it early, are they liable to pay you the remaining months or weeks left on the contract?
Page 2
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 11th Oct 16, 5:34 PM
    • 13,841 Posts
    • 7,346 Thanks
    motorguy
    If you are a contractor, then you don't have employment rights.
    Originally posted by prowla
    Given how often this OP seems to be dismissed, they'd never accrue any anyway!

    I suspect that instead of addressing whatever it is that led to them keep getting dismissed in the past, the OP thought that agency working would be easier and the bar wouldn't be as high. In fact, the opposite is often true - replacing an agency worker means nothing more than a phone call.
    Originally posted by sangie595
    Sangie - please dont confuse agency workers with contractors.

    Very different scenarios.
    Last edited by motorguy; 11-10-2016 at 5:40 PM.
    Regards

    Paul
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 11th Oct 16, 8:25 PM
    • 2,735 Posts
    • 4,278 Thanks
    sangie595
    Sangie - please dont confuse agency workers with contractors.

    Very different scenarios.
    Originally posted by motorguy
    I am aware of that. But they are depending on an agency to process the payment and the agency controls the contract. So actually, not all that different at all. And certainly not in the context of my comments, which relate to how one manages to continue to generate work when one cannot retain work for more than a few months.

    The OP is not an independent contractor with a direct relationship with the employer.

    Please don't confuse how agencies get around the employment rights now conferred on agency workers by calling people contractors with the problem of keep getting sacked.
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 11th Oct 16, 10:48 PM
    • 13,841 Posts
    • 7,346 Thanks
    motorguy

    I am aware of that. But they are depending on an agency to process the payment and the agency controls the contract. So actually, not all that different at all. And certainly not in the context of my comments, which relate to how one manages to continue to generate work when one cannot retain work for more than a few months.
    Originally posted by sangie595
    I pulled you on the fact that you were confusing an agency worker with a contractor. Very very different things.

    By replacing "contractor" with "agency worker" you concluded that a contractor could be replaced by simply phoning the agency.

    That is not the case. An agency worker will work for an agency who have a contract to supply X workers to a company - for example admin staff, thus agency workers tend to be replaceable quickly. A contractor will have been specifically interviewed and chosen for their skillset and many agencies will typically have submitted many CVs to the company, of which they will interview several. This process usually takes several weeks, minimum. Hope that helps you understand the difference.

    The agency does NOT control the contract. If the contractor walks or gets terminated, then the company will go back to the open market again, speak to whatever agencies have suitable candidates and start the process again. There is rarely an onus on the company to deal with one agency.


    The OP is not an independent contractor with a direct relationship with the employer.
    Originally posted by sangie595
    Yes, he IS. He has already told us that he has his own limited company. HE manages the relationship with the company (perhaps badly in this case) and HE has the direct relationship as its him there on site. The agency merely perform a middle man role and take a percentage.


    Please don't confuse how agencies get around the employment rights now conferred on agency workers by calling people contractors with the problem of keep getting sacked.
    Originally posted by sangie595
    There is absolutely no confusion on my part as the O/P is clearly a contractor.
    Last edited by motorguy; 11-10-2016 at 11:13 PM.
    Regards

    Paul
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 12th Oct 16, 8:06 AM
    • 2,735 Posts
    • 4,278 Thanks
    sangie595

    The agency does NOT control the contract. If the contractor walks or gets terminated, then the company will go back to the open market again, speak to whatever agencies have suitable candidates and start the process again. There is rarely an onus on the company to deal with one agency..
    Originally posted by motorguy
    There is no evidence to support this statement at all. The pseudo-contractor status is now commonplace in the agency sector. And if the OP controlled his relationship with the client, then he would have a contract with them and KNOW what his contractual terms with them are. Something he clearly does not. You are assuming something that is nowhere in evidence.

    However, I am not interested in pursuing a pointless discussion. He has been dismissed. Again. Contractor, agency worker or employee (or worker) doesn't matter. Piling up dismissals is not a way forward, however you are employed. What the OP needs is to be able to retain employment, for their own sake. And that isn't happening.
    • dlmcr
    • By dlmcr 12th Oct 16, 10:57 AM
    • 48 Posts
    • 46 Thanks
    dlmcr
    From what has been posted in this case I would say OP is a contractor. Whether or not he is a competent contractor or whether he is managing his limited company and administrative affairs well is another story but the definition of the nature of the way he is / was working with the client and how he is raising invoices fits that of a contractor.
    This is opposed to an "agency" worker eg someone on minimum / low wage doing a relatively menial role, whose payroll is dealt with in house by the agency together with other features such as a quick bulk hire and fire and placements without interviews.

    So, now that we have defined that he is a contractor, we can determine that he is not "employed" - it is not a job, there is no "line manager", there is no "dismissal" or getting sacked. It is a business to business relationship where the client has decided to terminate the contract.
    Unless explicitly indicate in the contract there is no payment due from the client for time not worked. If you have evidence that you have done th work then submit your timesheet and you will be paid for that time. You would not be paid for "notice period" if you as a contractor have already left, because the period has not actually physically been spent at the client site performing work.

    Clients can generally terminate contractors with no notice. That is the nature of the relationship. There is almost always no further payment due after the contractor finished working, unless specicifally stated in the contract with words to the effect of "the contractor will be paid for their services at the agreed rate during the entire duration of this contract regardless of whether the client requires their services or not"

    So my answer to the original question would be no you don't get paid for the remaining time on the contract because you physically haven't been on the client site performing work for them during that remaining time.

    OP performance during his various contracts would perhaps a seperate subject.
    • dranzer01
    • By dranzer01 12th Oct 16, 11:25 AM
    • 172 Posts
    • 32 Thanks
    dranzer01
    I will be getting paid my seven days notice this friday
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 12th Oct 16, 9:05 PM
    • 13,841 Posts
    • 7,346 Thanks
    motorguy
    Setting up a limited company does not in itself make you a contractor.

    OP sees himself as a contractor, that doesn't mean he is. A previous thread suggests he is in a relatively junior role in insurance. He ain't a contractor!
    Originally posted by Bogalot
    Hes billing the agency through his limited company, for his day rate. He is an employee of his limited company.

    Therefore he is a contractor.

    End of.
    Regards

    Paul
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 12th Oct 16, 9:08 PM
    • 13,841 Posts
    • 7,346 Thanks
    motorguy

    There is no evidence to support this statement at all. The pseudo-contractor status is now commonplace in the agency sector. And if the OP controlled his relationship with the client, then he would have a contract with them and KNOW what his contractual terms with them are. Something he clearly does not. You are assuming something that is nowhere in evidence.
    Originally posted by sangie595
    Hes got his own limited company, hes billing the agency for a day rate.

    Hes a contractor.

    Hes not an agency worker.

    I've no doubt he has a contract, he just needs to read it.


    However, I am not interested in pursuing a pointless discussion.
    Originally posted by sangie595
    There was every point. You were grouping contractors with agency workers. Very different. And its important that people who may be reading this and thinking of becoming contractors / agency workers know the difference.

    However, i've made my point clear, and am happy to draw a line now.
    Regards

    Paul
    • motorguy
    • By motorguy 12th Oct 16, 9:09 PM
    • 13,841 Posts
    • 7,346 Thanks
    motorguy
    I will be getting paid my seven days notice this friday
    Originally posted by dranzer01
    Fair enough then.
    Regards

    Paul
    • dranzer01
    • By dranzer01 13th Oct 16, 11:14 AM
    • 172 Posts
    • 32 Thanks
    dranzer01
    think all this agency worker talk is people who are on their AGENCIES PAYROLL... they wanted me to be, but i told them to hold on till i set up my OWN company - Which I bill them in turn.... with timesheets & an invoice every month and get paid up to 10 days after that
    • JP1978
    • By JP1978 23rd Oct 16, 11:48 AM
    • 62 Posts
    • 30 Thanks
    JP1978
    If you are a contractor, your client can just not give you work.

    You either leave or wait it out until they give you work.

    A 'contract' with a contractor on a day rate isnt really worth the paper its written on.....

    Tax man would be very interested in any clauses that force them to pay you as that would be akin to been a permmy.
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