Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@. Skimlinks & other affiliated links are turned on

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • richardw
    • By richardw 29th Sep 16, 10:22 AM
    • 17,133Posts
    • 6,888Thanks
    richardw
    0 WOW
    BA going Buy on Board refreshments for short haul...
    • #1
    • 29th Sep 16, 10:22 AM
    0 WOW
    BA going Buy on Board refreshments for short haul... 29th Sep 16 at 10:22 AM
    ....with M&S

    http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/british-airways-to-charge-for-inflight-food-and-drink-qa-for-passengers-a7336811.html
    Posts are not advice and must not be relied upon.
Page 4
    • richardw
    • By richardw 7th Oct 16, 10:34 AM
    • 17,133 Posts
    • 6,888 Thanks
    richardw
    Try this http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/british-airways-executive-club/1793630-confirmed-buy-board-f-b-coming-ba-short-haul-89.html
    Posts are not advice and must not be relied upon.
    • pelirocco
    • By pelirocco 7th Oct 16, 11:45 AM
    • 7,453 Posts
    • 8,239 Thanks
    pelirocco
    I realise this is what BA want to do and they are well within their rights to do it and as customers we have a right to go elsewhere for our travel.

    However is it actually legal that they can change the terms of a previously booked flight such as this? If it is legal it actually shows no level of customer service whatsoever and a total neglect for what people may think
    Originally posted by DanB77

    I would guess so , we had a 'worse' experience with Easyjet when they started charging extra for hold baggage . I had booked and paid for 2 tickets including baggage , when we got to the airport we went sent away to pay for the hold baggage ( I paid under protest ) .On our return journey we were told we had only paid for baggage for the outward journey!!!
    Vuja De - the feeling you'll be here later
    • RHemmings
    • By RHemmings 7th Oct 16, 12:40 PM
    • 1,926 Posts
    • 1,219 Thanks
    RHemmings
    Thing is, they are offering full refund, or compensation to affected passengers, so you don't really have much of a point beyond that. Your claim that rebooking elsewhere at a greater cost won't hold any water.

    You cannot force someone to provide a service they no longer offer.
    Originally posted by malkie76
    In general, you can. It's called breach of contract. If someone sells you a service to be fulfilled in the future, then withdraws that service, it's up to them to make good the consumer's loss.

    In terms of rebooking elsewhere, then if a passenger was forced to rebook elsewhere they could sue for loss of bargain. (Except, I don't believe this applies in this case. See later.)

    In this specific case, it would depend on whether or not food formed part of the contract formed when someone bought a ticket. That probably depends on fine print.

    I'm not suggesting that anyone would sue for lack of food when the loss is probably the cost of bringing sandwiches on board. As the consumer would be expected to ameliorate their losses. Or perhaps buying similar food onboard would make their loss. Cancelling the flight and booking a more expensive one wouldn't be grounds for a large loss that can be sued for as by not just paying for food (brought onto the plane or bought on the plane) would create a smaller loss, and in breach of contract cases people are expected to ameliorate their losses.

    Speaking from a customer relations, not legal, standpoint, I believe that the airlines are silly not to offer food vouchers to those passengers who have already bought tickets, but will no longer be given a free snack.
    Last edited by RHemmings; 07-10-2016 at 12:45 PM.
    • shaun from Africa
    • By shaun from Africa 7th Oct 16, 12:49 PM
    • 8,708 Posts
    • 9,765 Thanks
    shaun from Africa
    As the food provided by BA was complimentary, (and this was made clear on their website before they changed it to show the new policy) I can't see any court case succeeding as the passenger hasn't suffered any financial loss due to not being provided with something that they had paid for.
    • RHemmings
    • By RHemmings 7th Oct 16, 1:28 PM
    • 1,926 Posts
    • 1,219 Thanks
    RHemmings
    As the food provided by BA was complimentary, (and this was made clear on their website before they changed it to show the new policy) I can't see any court case succeeding as the passenger hasn't suffered any financial loss due to not being provided with something that they had paid for.
    Originally posted by shaun from Africa
    I was arguing the general case due to a statement that stated a generality. "You cannot force someone to provide a service that they no longer provide."

    I had a quick look, and describing items as 'complimentary' or 'free' cannot be used to avoid legal responsibility if the price of the overall contract has been inflated to cover the 'free' items. Otherwise people could charge £100 for a paper bag into which some 'free' consumer electronics had been inserted. I believe that wouldn't work in a court of law even if this was hidden in the fine print. (Barring judges who are working out their notice.)

    In the specific case of airline food, the argument would have to be whether the contract covered the items or not. I hate to think how anyone would be argue either way given that ticket prices vary wildly on the same plane depending on the time of day they were booked etc.

    But, the legal argument is pretty senseless really as even if someone could successfully argue that the food was part of the contract, no-one's going to sue for the price of a snack bought from Aldi on the way to the airport.

    What's more important IMHO is the bad reviews British Airlines are going to get because they took away a snack that probably cost them £1.
    • shaun from Africa
    • By shaun from Africa 7th Oct 16, 1:37 PM
    • 8,708 Posts
    • 9,765 Thanks
    shaun from Africa
    no-one's going to sue for the price of a snack bought from Aldi on the way to the airport.
    Originally posted by RHemmings
    Maybe not in the UK but in the US, all bets are off!

    http://www.nj.com/essex/index.ssf/2015/05/nj_woman_suing_airline_for_5m_after_her_in-flight_video_didnt_work_report_says.html
    • magyar
    • By magyar 7th Oct 16, 6:12 PM
    • 18,338 Posts
    • 30,435 Thanks
    magyar
    I was arguing the general case due to a statement that stated a generality. "You cannot force someone to provide a service that they no longer provide."

    I had a quick look, and describing items as 'complimentary' or 'free' cannot be used to avoid legal responsibility if the price of the overall contract has been inflated to cover the 'free' items. Otherwise people could charge £100 for a paper bag into which some 'free' consumer electronics had been inserted. I believe that wouldn't work in a court of law even if this was hidden in the fine print. (Barring judges who are working out their notice.)

    In the specific case of airline food, the argument would have to be whether the contract covered the items or not. I hate to think how anyone would be argue either way given that ticket prices vary wildly on the same plane depending on the time of day they were booked etc.

    But, the legal argument is pretty senseless really as even if someone could successfully argue that the food was part of the contract, no-one's going to sue for the price of a snack bought from Aldi on the way to the airport.

    What's more important IMHO is the bad reviews British Airlines are going to get because they took away a snack that probably cost them £1.
    Originally posted by RHemmings
    Your post is spot on.

    Only thing to add is I am fairly sure the Consumer Rights Act makes the food part of the contract irrespective of what their actual contract says: it was a clear advertised benefit.

    Obviously no-one will sue them but what gets me is the brazen way they claim what they are doing is fine when as you say for a modest cost they could send people a voucher and be done with.
    Says James, in my opinion, there's nothing in this world
    Beats a '52 Vincent and a red headed girl
    • magyar
    • By magyar 9th Oct 16, 7:57 PM
    • 18,338 Posts
    • 30,435 Thanks
    magyar
    This was an interesting link...

    http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/travel/2016/10/refunds-for-packed-trains-and-broken-toilets-now-a-possibility-following-legal-extension---what-you-need-to-know

    I wasn't aware the Consumer Rights Act *didn't* apply to transport, but it clearly does now. What is not obvious is whether the fact that the flights (i.e. contract) was made before 1 Oct is important - I would assume the important date is when the service was provided.
    Says James, in my opinion, there's nothing in this world
    Beats a '52 Vincent and a red headed girl
    • George Michael
    • By George Michael 9th Oct 16, 9:58 PM
    • 2,583 Posts
    • 3,450 Thanks
    George Michael
    What is not obvious is whether the fact that the flights (i.e. contract) was made before 1 Oct is important - I would assume the important date is when the service was provided.
    Originally posted by magyar
    The relevant date would be when the booking was made as that is when the contract would be formed.
    For bookings made prior to the 1st October, section 50 of the CRA (Information about the trader or service to be binding) wouldn't apply as the law can't be made retroactive so as to cover contracts already in place.
    • MiraculousM
    • By MiraculousM 12th Oct 16, 8:32 PM
    • 201 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    MiraculousM
    Its really really sad to see how BA have declined.

    I have 2 more seperate flights coming up, but it is very apparent that they really could not give less of a turd about economy passengers.. and whilst i am not buying a ton of flights or paying business class prices, i spend about the cost of a business class return flight on the number of BA flights a year. the following changes have narked me greatly: I mean, i get that the guy now running it is a former low cost airline ceo but lets be real. I have never gone NEAR air lingus because i have never heard anything good about them and unless BA are going to charge the same prices as easyjet, then i will be picking the latter for what is essentially the same service on 1-3 hour flights. .. and how is a short haul 5 hours? thats a long haul for me. I am thoroughly disppointed by the airline and i am now going to jump to Delta who have started serving my preferred destination at a lower price.

    The following in the past year have annoyed me:

    1. The changing of avios points. Oh, so because i am not spending as much my loyalty will be rewarded only 1/9th of what it was rewarded before?
    2. The fact that when i got on my long haul flight last month, i was told that the toothbrushes and toothpaste that i previously used before i disembarked the plane were no longer being given. How weird. Virgin atlantic give you a whole pack in economy when you are flying to the east coast. This was removal of the last little luxury.
    3. Now this. It used to be a sandwich and drink on a short haul. Then that got changed to the crappy tiny bags of crisps. Now i have to pay for my tiny can of coke? are you joking?

    Nope.. i would pay the slight extra usually to go on BA. never again.
    • isplumm
    • By isplumm 12th Oct 16, 8:59 PM
    • 1,730 Posts
    • 722 Thanks
    isplumm
    Its really really sad to see how BA have declined.

    The following in the past year have annoyed me:

    1. The changing of avios points. Oh, so because i am not spending as much my loyalty will be rewarded only 1/9th of what it was rewarded before?
    Originally posted by MiraculousM
    But that has been like that for ages - they should reward those people who fly with them more - they want to encourage others to fly more with them - I am sure that other airlines do the same?

    2. The fact that when i got on my long haul flight last month, i was told that the toothbrushes and toothpaste that i previously used before i disembarked the plane were no longer being given. How weird. Virgin atlantic give you a whole pack in economy when you are flying to the east coast. This was removal of the last little luxury.
    Originally posted by MiraculousM
    I have to be honest choosing Virgin over BA because of some toothpaste seems nuts to me - especially in economy - the products are very similar, so I would have thought the main selling point would be price?

    3. Now this. It used to be a sandwich and drink on a short haul. Then that got changed to the crappy tiny bags of crisps. Now i have to pay for my tiny can of coke? are you joking?
    Originally posted by MiraculousM
    Can understand that - but again you need to factor food costs into your flight. Especially if other airlines do exactly same on the routes that BA fly.

    Nope.. i would pay the slight extra usually to go on BA. never again.
    Originally posted by MiraculousM
    I can understand not flying BA, but your reasons seem minor.

    Mark
    We’ve had to remove your signature. Please check the Forum Rules if you’re unsure why it’s been removed and, if still unsure, email forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com
    • MiraculousM
    • By MiraculousM 13th Oct 16, 12:28 AM
    • 201 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    MiraculousM
    Minor reasons are enough to not warrant me paying £40+ more to fly over other airlines where all these factors were things that made me stay with them..

    There were other things... the size of the my personal laptop bag (my backpack is too big now) which has been reduced.

    The service isnt as great. Things are taken away but the prices are not going down?
    • bigadaj
    • By bigadaj 13th Oct 16, 6:55 AM
    • 7,841 Posts
    • 4,780 Thanks
    bigadaj
    Minor reasons are enough to not warrant me paying £40+ more to fly over other airlines where all these factors were things that made me stay with them..

    There were other things... the size of the my personal laptop bag (my backpack is too big now) which has been reduced.

    The service isnt as great. Things are taken away but the prices are not going down?
    Originally posted by MiraculousM
    Prices are fluid, it's not as though every time you fly ba you are paying £40 more than easy jet or Ryanair or any other airline.

    I can't see the addition of a snack or free drink being a major deciding factor, price primarily and also airport location and flights times will be far more important for most people.
    • magyar
    • By magyar 13th Oct 16, 7:18 AM
    • 18,338 Posts
    • 30,435 Thanks
    magyar
    Prices are fluid, it's not as though every time you fly ba you are paying £40 more than easy jet or Ryanair or any other airline.

    I can't see the addition of a snack or free drink being a major deciding factor, price primarily and also airport location and flights times will be far more important for most people.
    Originally posted by bigadaj
    Naturally price, time and location are primary for almost everyone. And no-one would pay £40 for a 'free' snack. But some people are prepared to pay more for a slightly more premium 'feeling' product.

    Most of my travel is on business. So for example I do actually value the food slightly more highly because paying for it myself also means a few minutes making an expense claim. I also value free seat selection so I can sit close to the front - an extra 10 minutes or so getting off makes a big difference. Decent lounges, fast track security etc make a big difference if you fly weekly.

    You also have the fact that the customer service used to be excellent - I would regularly get rebooked onto flights that strictly speaking my ticket didn't allow, for example. No chance of that now.

    And so that's why it annoys when BA penny-pinch. It seems a trivial matter, but paying for food feels like the thin end of a wedge.
    Says James, in my opinion, there's nothing in this world
    Beats a '52 Vincent and a red headed girl
    • dickydonkin
    • By dickydonkin 13th Oct 16, 9:08 AM
    • 2,791 Posts
    • 2,811 Thanks
    dickydonkin
    I can't see the addition of a snack or free drink being a major deciding factor, price primarily and also airport location and flights times will be far more important for most people.
    Originally posted by bigadaj
    It is the other cuts that have been implemented over the years along with the recent food 'upgrade' that have made many frequent flyers to say enough is enough. Loyalty has its limits.

    We humans are strange - if price and location were a major deciding factor in how we spend our cash for a service or product, many will ask shoppers why they will travel miles to shop at Waitrose when they have an Asda or Tesco on their doorstep.
    • Doshwaster
    • By Doshwaster 13th Oct 16, 11:07 AM
    • 4,425 Posts
    • 3,541 Thanks
    Doshwaster
    Minor reasons are enough to not warrant me paying £40+ more to fly over other airlines where all these factors were things that made me stay with them..

    There were other things... the size of the my personal laptop bag (my backpack is too big now) which has been reduced.

    The service isnt as great. Things are taken away but the prices are not going down?
    Originally posted by MiraculousM
    Given all of the other financial pressures on running an airline it's remarkable that prices haven't really risen in real terms over the last 10 years. Indeed some fares are now cheaper than they were last century.

    I've never considered a toothbrush and paste as a "luxury". If you really care about cleaning your teeth before landing then take your own. I suspect that most just got thrown away.
    • MiraculousM
    • By MiraculousM 13th Oct 16, 5:02 PM
    • 201 Posts
    • 41 Thanks
    MiraculousM
    its little things though. I already try and make it as comfortable as possible for myself and now having to take on that added thing is going to add weight to my bag and mean im taking more "stuff".

    when you are flying economy there are few luxuries.
    • davetrousers
    • By davetrousers 21st Oct 16, 1:40 PM
    • 5,496 Posts
    • 4,656 Thanks
    davetrousers
    I have just returned from Malta (flying with BA) the free food and drink that was provided was pretty acceptable, it consisted of a sandwich, some cheese and 2 crackers, a small chocolate sultana crispy thing and a Lily O'Brian chocolate dessert, in additional to a drink (I had white whine on the outbound and a vodka and coke on the return). To be honest you'd struggle to have moaned about it.

    It was far more than just a small snack that some people seem to be referring to.
    .....

    • magyar
    • By magyar 21st Oct 16, 1:52 PM
    • 18,338 Posts
    • 30,435 Thanks
    magyar
    I have just returned from Malta (flying with BA) the free food and drink that was provided was pretty acceptable, it consisted of a sandwich, some cheese and 2 crackers, a small chocolate sultana crispy thing and a Lily O'Brian chocolate dessert, in additional to a drink (I had white whine on the outbound and a vodka and coke on the return). To be honest you'd struggle to have moaned about it.

    It was far more than just a small snack that some people seem to be referring to.
    Originally posted by davetrousers
    Exactly, and I do get a bit annoyed about this assumption that everyone is moaning about a 'tiny snack'. Yes, if you fly to Amsterdam, Brussels etc. you basically get a biscuit or crisps - fine, its <1hr flight. But if you fly to Istanbul, Athens etc., it's a 4hr+ flight and you got a proper (albeit cold) meal / packed lunch.

    And that is easily enough of a journey, especially if over a lunchtime, that you need to eat. So I find it ridiculous that BA are saying that even though they advertised a meal that comes with catering, they can get away with simply now saying it isn't.
    Says James, in my opinion, there's nothing in this world
    Beats a '52 Vincent and a red headed girl
    • Doshwaster
    • By Doshwaster 21st Oct 16, 1:59 PM
    • 4,425 Posts
    • 3,541 Thanks
    Doshwaster
    I have just returned from Malta (flying with BA) the free food and drink that was provided was pretty acceptable, it consisted of a sandwich, some cheese and 2 crackers, a small chocolate sultana crispy thing and a Lily O'Brian chocolate dessert, in additional to a drink (I had white whine on the outbound and a vodka and coke on the return). To be honest you'd struggle to have moaned about it.

    It was far more than just a small snack that some people seem to be referring to.
    Originally posted by davetrousers
    That's because Malta is a "Band 4" short haul destination so it gets a decent catering service in Economy

    More info here: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/british-airways-executive-club/1540396-short-haul-catering-guide.html
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

227Posts Today

2,472Users online

Martin's Twitter