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  • FIRST POST
    • supersaverkerry
    • By supersaverkerry 22nd Sep 16, 8:52 PM
    • 292Posts
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    supersaverkerry
    Should landlord be requesting mutually convenient arrangements for entry?
    • #1
    • 22nd Sep 16, 8:52 PM
    Should landlord be requesting mutually convenient arrangements for entry? 22nd Sep 16 at 8:52 PM
    Hi

    I wonder does anyone know where we stand with granting landlord right to enter the property?

    Our landlords are very lovely people but on several occasions now we have had messages saying they are coming round on x date. No asking if that is suitable etc... just a statement of fact.

    We have in the past said no sorry that won't work if we have had guests etc... but it happens over and over to the point if we say sorry we are out, away etc... the landlord tries saying well they will enter in our absence as they have keys - he also wanted our security system alarm code. Luckily this hasn't happened as we always make alternative arrangements to ensure we are home when they want to come.

    A couple of weeks ago something broke (no fault on our part and not something urgent) and the landlord again said they would be over at on x day sometime in the morning, I was working nights and said it was not convenient as I would be asleep but they could come in the afternoon. Landlord pushed saying he would come anyway and let himself in, luckily my other half stood his ground and said no. I am a very light sleeper and to be honest the thought of someone coming into my home while I am sleeping creeps me out.

    Then we were due a gas inspection this weekend - again I just had a message saying they are coming at x date, between these hours. It annoyed me that yet again no asking if it was ok. So we rearranged our plans and let it slide.

    Tonight we get a message saying they are no longer coming at the weekend and it will be Monday. Again no is that ok etc... and I am actually on nights again next week so again an invasion into my life as I will come in from work at 8am and then have to wait around till around 11.30am for them to come before trying to get some sleep and leaving for work again at 5pm.

    Decided to say yes fine as I know gas inspection is important, but really was at the point where I have had enough. Replied saying yes that is fine but we have had to change plans, interferes with my night shift pattern etc... and politely said that we are more than happy to allow access but ask that in future can we please have contact to arrange mutually convenient times for any visits.

    The reply was it is cheaper for them to have all their properties services at the same time and its a legal requirement so they have to do it.

    Of course I know it has to be done and I feel we are very flexible if we are given notice for non-emergency access (clearly emergency would be different).

    Should the landlord not be asking us is it ok and trying to arrange something the suits all parties rather than dictating to us?

    After all we pay them to live in this house and it is our home and whilst they are very nice people I don't think it is unreasonable to a. want to be home when they come to do inspection/ non-emergency repairs etc... and b. to be consulted about suitable times so it it is mutually convenient and does not interrupt our other plans and home life.

    I'm not sure where we stand on this, is it reasonable in future to say we will not be able to change our existing plans and that they will need to find something that suits all of us? I feel as we pay them rent we are their customer so should not have keep fighting something which could so easily be sorted in a way which considers both parties needs.
Page 1
    • G_M
    • By G_M 22nd Sep 16, 9:23 PM
    • 35,911 Posts
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    G_M
    • #2
    • 22nd Sep 16, 9:23 PM
    • #2
    • 22nd Sep 16, 9:23 PM
    It depends to some extent what your tenancy agreement says - have you read it?

    The law further gives the LL right of access in emergency, and also generally right of access subject to 24 hours writen notice.

    Having said that, you also have a right to 'quiet enjoyment' of the property (nothing to do with noise!), and repeated access without consent clearly breaches that.

    You can do 2 things

    1) lay down some ground rules with the LL. Ideally do this amicably (over tea and cake next time they visit?), followed up with a friendly written confirmation of what you agree.

    Alternatively just write, politely, asking if in future they would mind agreeing convenient access dates with you in advance and only comng round on those agred dates/times.

    2) Change the lock. This ensures that 1 above is adherred to. The LL will only know if he comes round without first agreeing a time. Keep the original lock to replace at the end of the tenancy.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LA580cRHXDY

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1WP3o4jAFc
    Last edited by G_M; 22-09-2016 at 9:25 PM.
    • Lokolo
    • By Lokolo 22nd Sep 16, 9:26 PM
    • 19,538 Posts
    • 14,488 Thanks
    Lokolo
    • #3
    • 22nd Sep 16, 9:26 PM
    • #3
    • 22nd Sep 16, 9:26 PM
    The gas inspection is an annual requirement, so really has to be done. However when I was renting at university, the landlord arranged it with British Gas who then contacted us to arrange a suitable time for us.

    Have you asked them to provide the number of the company doing the inspection so you can arrange it yourselves, but have the certificate and invoice go to the landlord?
    • supersaverkerry
    • By supersaverkerry 22nd Sep 16, 9:38 PM
    • 292 Posts
    • 136 Thanks
    supersaverkerry
    • #4
    • 22nd Sep 16, 9:38 PM
    • #4
    • 22nd Sep 16, 9:38 PM
    It depends to some extent what your tenancy agreement says - have you read it?

    The law further gives the LL right of access in emergency, and also generally right of access subject to 24 hours writen notice.

    Having said that, you also have a right to 'quiet enjoyment' of the property (nothing to do with noise!), and repeated access without consent clearly breaches that.

    You can do 2 things

    1) lay down some ground rules with the LL. Ideally do this amicably (over tea and cake next time they visit?), followed up with a friendly written confirmation of what you agree.

    Alternatively just write, politely, asking if in future they would mind agreeing convenient access dates with you in advance and only comng round on those agred dates/times.

    2) Change the lock. This ensures that 1 above is adherred to. The LL will only know if he comes round without first agreeing a time. Keep the original lock to replace at the end of the tenancy.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LA580cRHXDY

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1WP3o4jAFc
    Originally posted by G_M
    Our tenancy agreement says we are not allowed to change our locks.

    It also says they can come with 24 hours notice, but surely it should still be reasonable because as you say we have the right to quiet enjoyment and having someone wandering around my flat when I am asleep doesn't give me quiet enjoyment.

    So does this mean even if we say no, they can enter anyway if they have given 24 hours notice?

    It is also annoying when we specifically changed plans so they could come when they wanted to and then a few days before they change them without even asking if it is ok. It feels unreasonable.

    We also have a security alarm and allowing them in when we are not there would mean giving them that code which we would not want to do.

    We have tried saying we would like to agree times that suit us both but the reply was it is cheaper for them to have the houses they have in the area all done on the same day.
    • supersaverkerry
    • By supersaverkerry 22nd Sep 16, 9:40 PM
    • 292 Posts
    • 136 Thanks
    supersaverkerry
    • #5
    • 22nd Sep 16, 9:40 PM
    • #5
    • 22nd Sep 16, 9:40 PM
    The gas inspection is an annual requirement, so really has to be done. However when I was renting at university, the landlord arranged it with British Gas who then contacted us to arrange a suitable time for us.

    Have you asked them to provide the number of the company doing the inspection so you can arrange it yourselves, but have the certificate and invoice go to the landlord?
    Originally posted by Lokolo
    Yes we understand it is a requirement and we are more than happy for it to be done, just like we are happy for them to come and do anything else they need to but I don't feel we should have to arrange our lives around it especially when I work 3 long shifts a week, meaning I have 4 days off a week so can offer 4 days in any given week when they can come at their leisure plus pretty much any weekend as my partner is home then, but there seems to be no compromise.

    We aren't allowed to arrange it ourselves as they want all their properties done on the same day to save them costs.
    • tacpot12
    • By tacpot12 22nd Sep 16, 11:24 PM
    • 237 Posts
    • 166 Thanks
    tacpot12
    • #6
    • 22nd Sep 16, 11:24 PM
    • #6
    • 22nd Sep 16, 11:24 PM
    If you say they cant't come in, they can't come in. If they have contacted you to arrange access it can't be an emergency.

    I do think the right answer has been given though. You need.to set some ground rules with the landlord. They are clearly a 'hands on' landlord which is actually better for you. You need to explain that some weeks you are asleep in the house and don't want them or any workman in the house those weeks. Your request is reasonable and as has been stated you are entitled to the quiet enjoyment if the property. If they want to do a gas inspection on a week your are at home, suggest they arrange all the inspections for the following week. Explain very politely that you don't have to allow access for routine maintenance when it is not convenient. If that cost them a little more every few years that is just a cost of being in business.

    In the case of a true emergency, (a gas or water leak, smoke seen coming from the property etc) ideally you want the landlord to have a working set of keys. On days you are at work, if you trust the landlord, you can give them permission to use their keys to come in and do maintenance and gas safety inspections. Just turn the alarm off on days when they gave arranged to come in. I was surprised to hear that you wanted to be at home for this.
    • FBaby
    • By FBaby 23rd Sep 16, 7:36 AM
    • 13,752 Posts
    • 35,349 Thanks
    FBaby
    • #7
    • 23rd Sep 16, 7:36 AM
    • #7
    • 23rd Sep 16, 7:36 AM
    It sounds like their issue is what they have highlighted. It sounds like they have a few properties and have arranged that all checks are done on the same day. It means that it is easier for them so they only have one date to remember, and indeed, they might get a better price if the gas company can do all on the same day.

    Maybe you could come up to a compromise. If gas certificate, you can ask they let you know more than a week in advance, after all, they should know long in advance which day this is going to be.

    If it is an inspection or need for repair, then you agree on a convenient time. With repairs, it is often easier if they contact you directly, although many companies don't give you much flexibility anyway, tenant or landlord.
    • PersianCatLady
    • By PersianCatLady 23rd Sep 16, 10:23 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    PersianCatLady
    • #8
    • 23rd Sep 16, 10:23 PM
    • #8
    • 23rd Sep 16, 10:23 PM
    When I used to rent a flat from a private LL the agent would send a letter whenever an inspection was arranged simply stating the date and time that it was going to take place.


    I had the option of either being there and letting the agent in or if I was not there it was made clear that they would use their own key to let themselves in.


    I know that it is frustrating but at the end of the day as long as the LL gives you notice of their visit you can't really expect them to arrange their business to suit your personal schedule.
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