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  • FIRST POST
    • Trying to be sensible
    • By Trying to be sensible 19th Sep 16, 10:01 PM
    • 7Posts
    • 0Thanks
    Trying to be sensible
    Auris clutch problem
    • #1
    • 19th Sep 16, 10:01 PM
    Auris clutch problem 19th Sep 16 at 10:01 PM
    I purchased a Toyota Auris 1.6 manual from a national Toyota franchise dealer network in September 2015. I also bought 2 year service plan.
    The car was first registered in December 2013 with delivery date to its' one previous owner 200 miles away in January 2014. The mileage at purchase was 12.800 miles.
    The service book recorded that the car had a first service in December 2014 at the Toyota franchise where it was initially bought when mileage was 7,500. A subsequent service was carried out in July 2015 when mileage was 12,854. This service was carried out by Dealer network from whom I bought the car and I presume this was where first owner traded it in.
    This is my third Toyota car with previous one being Avensis. I found Auris seemed to have difficulty with hills and road bends as gear indicators did not keep up with changes being made. Also found petrol consumption poor. I drive in rural area with lot of hills as well as on longer journeys on motorways to major cities.
    I submitted car for service in December 2015 when a "combination meter ECU recall - toyota" was carried out. No service was done as said not to be due until July 2016. ( Mileage then 16,100)
    In February I had flat tyre and when this was replaced a 'Visual Safety Report" was done.
    In July 2016 the 30,000 mile service was done ( Mileage 21,761) Checklist shows no cause for concern.

    Last Friday I drove 50 + miles to spend day shopping with family members. When driving in town noticed burning smell but my passengers smelled nothing. On way home driving up hill car just lost all power and stopped. Had to be towed to National dealer's garage at 11 pm. 50 miles from my home. Has taken until today to get report from garage who say
    "we have carried out investigation & identified there
    is no "clutch",require gearbox removed for further checks..
    labour cost is £252.00...when fault is fully diagnosed we will
    re inform you of further "parts" costs required" When I queried that this should be under warranty they replied
    "i do agree that your car is still within 3 years but we are unable to confirm fault until gearbox removed,
    if it is a component mechanical failure then should be warranty but if the clutch is worn/burnt then not warranty..we did detect a "burning" smell..
    we require your authorisation to remove gearbox to confirm fault.."
    I need advice from you experts as to how to proceed. Sorry this is so long, .
Page 1
    • jaydeeuk1
    • By jaydeeuk1 19th Sep 16, 10:28 PM
    • 7,372 Posts
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    jaydeeuk1
    • #2
    • 19th Sep 16, 10:28 PM
    • #2
    • 19th Sep 16, 10:28 PM
    They'll probably chuck the 'wear and tear' exemption at you, did the same to me when the air bag light came on on my 4 year old Toyota IQ with a £400 bill. Had to have a moan at Toyota HQ to get anything back from them as they're expected to last 10 years, and with 9 of the !!!!!!s it could have worked out quite expensive if they all went one day!

    Back then in 2009 they only gave a 3 year warranty, thought Toyota were all 5 years now as of 2011?
    If you've never had PPR, then people probably don't care about what you say.
    • Trying to be sensible
    • By Trying to be sensible 19th Sep 16, 10:45 PM
    • 7 Posts
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    Trying to be sensible
    • #3
    • 19th Sep 16, 10:45 PM
    • #3
    • 19th Sep 16, 10:45 PM
    That is what I am worried about. Despite driving for 40 + years with never any bother with clutches I am sure they will try to say it is my driving causing wear and tear. Like you I am sure I was repeatedly told Toyota had 5 year warranties I have just looked up Service and Warranty book to find there is no mention of more than 3 year or 60,000 mile comprehensive warranty but 12 years of corrosion perforation in bodywork.
    I also see that they mention Official Toyota Centre or Service Outlet. The dealer does not have Toyota franchise in city where car is now.
    I will have to check that out.
    • arcon5
    • By arcon5 20th Sep 16, 4:49 AM
    • 12,572 Posts
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    arcon5
    • #4
    • 20th Sep 16, 4:49 AM
    • #4
    • 20th Sep 16, 4:49 AM
    That was a long post for 'clutch went and they want paying to inspect'
    • Trying to be sensible
    • By Trying to be sensible 20th Sep 16, 7:14 AM
    • 7 Posts
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    Trying to be sensible
    • #5
    • 20th Sep 16, 7:14 AM
    • #5
    • 20th Sep 16, 7:14 AM
    Thank you for posting Arcon5 although I am not sure how helpful it is to state the obvious.
    • Nobbie1967
    • By Nobbie1967 20th Sep 16, 7:24 AM
    • 540 Posts
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    Nobbie1967
    • #6
    • 20th Sep 16, 7:24 AM
    • #6
    • 20th Sep 16, 7:24 AM
    It seems likely that Toyota will find that the fault is caused by wear and tear and you will be paying for the repair. With this in mind, it might be worth looking at how much an independent clutch place would charge for a new clutch as main dealer labour charges are very high. Get some quotes and ask Toyota for an estimate of their price to replace the clutch to help inform your decision.
    • Stevie Palimo
    • By Stevie Palimo 20th Sep 16, 7:37 AM
    • 2,525 Posts
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    Stevie Palimo
    • #7
    • 20th Sep 16, 7:37 AM
    • #7
    • 20th Sep 16, 7:37 AM
    It seems likely that Toyota will find that the fault is caused by wear and tear and you will be paying for the repair. With this in mind, it might be worth looking at how much an independent clutch place would charge for a new clutch as main dealer labour charges are very high. Get some quotes and ask Toyota for an estimate of their price to replace the clutch to help inform your decision.
    Originally posted by Nobbie1967
    Problem here is by not going to a main dealer the factory goodwill element for the cost of the part to be retracted will not likely be taken into account, I have had a few issues on cars that I purchased new and your choice here is main dealer and pay labour only or small garage and pay in full which works out more in most instances.
    " I refuse to censor myself because it may offend someone. If you don't like me that's ok, I don't need your approval. "
    • Trying to be sensible
    • By Trying to be sensible 20th Sep 16, 8:08 AM
    • 7 Posts
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    Trying to be sensible
    • #8
    • 20th Sep 16, 8:08 AM
    • #8
    • 20th Sep 16, 8:08 AM
    Thank you for posting Stevie P . I did wonder about that aspect. I am also limited by fact car is in garage 50 miles away and I do not know any reliable independent garages in that city. Also note car is not currently in 'Toyota' dealership garage. Will be asking for detailed information on that from Dealer (AC).
    Am also a bit worried that my research indicates that fact service book is stamped may not mean full Toyota Service carried out. Does a stamp mean particular garage can pick and chose level of Service?
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 20th Sep 16, 8:16 AM
    • 11,209 Posts
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    AdrianC
    • #9
    • 20th Sep 16, 8:16 AM
    • #9
    • 20th Sep 16, 8:16 AM
    Just because there's a full dealer history doesn't mean the previous owner didn't abuse the clutch...
    • oldagetraveller
    • By oldagetraveller 20th Sep 16, 11:39 AM
    • 2,809 Posts
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    oldagetraveller
    "Back then in 2009 they only gave a 3 year warranty, thought Toyota were all 5 years now as of 2011?"

    5 years in the U.K. from June 2010.
    The Conservative Party is a bit like double cream. Rich, thick and full of clots!
    • benten69
    • By benten69 20th Sep 16, 12:46 PM
    • 165 Posts
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    benten69
    Worn / burnt out clutch = wear & tear, simple. It will be neigh on impossible for you to claim the part was faulty as it lasted 3 years and 20,000+ miles. A faulty clutch would have failed long before then.

    Yes, I know a clutch with NORMAL use should last about 2-3x as long, However, it's likely the previous owner rode the clutch a lot and when you got the car it didn't have much life left in it, but that's not Toyotas fault and there is no reasonable way they could have known about it, as they can't be expected to remove gearboxes and check the clutch on every car they sell.

    Just a case of suck it up, or at best, try and get a goodwill gesture due to being a long standing Toyota customer, but they are in no way shape or form obliged to help out.

    Clutches will almost never be covered under warranty unless it's a brand new on that failed in say 500 miles, but that's not the case here. Also, when the gearbox is off, any burning will be obvious which will clearly indicate wear & tear / abuse of the clutch.
    Last edited by benten69; 20-09-2016 at 12:48 PM.
    SPC9 #408 - £142.48
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    • arcon5
    • By arcon5 21st Sep 16, 7:19 AM
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    arcon5
    Burning off a clutch isn't definitive proof the clutch has been abused of wear and tear. There are scenarios where faulty components can cause friction plate to burn out!
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 21st Sep 16, 8:04 AM
    • 11,209 Posts
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    AdrianC
    Burning off a clutch isn't definitive proof the clutch has been abused of wear and tear. There are scenarios where faulty components can cause friction plate to burn out!
    Originally posted by arcon5
    Ever heard of William of Ockham?
    • Trying to be sensible
    • By Trying to be sensible 21st Sep 16, 1:00 PM
    • 7 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Trying to be sensible
    Thank you to everyone who has posted.
    Have at last, through helpful staff member, arranged for car to be transferred to Toyotoa Service Centre today. ( That's what happens when you cannot make /receive voice telephone calls)
    Adrian C I was aware stamps on books do not say much about the service history really ( especially when they have a date of 27/7/30!). I have asked to see the so called 20,000 mile service report carried out by Dealer who sold car to me. Being 'put off' as saying do not have access to Report, and depending on what happens with Toyota workshop, will consider challenging why they do not have records of their own Services when car was in their ownership.
    Benten69, I acknowledge that it is highly probable that previous owner damaged clutch but what is point of A) Services on a new car that do not identify this ? and B) Manufacturer's Warranty's that is supposed to be for 5 years (and has 3 on Service and Warranty Book) and yet does not reflect such Services? ( I know I know I am being naive to think dealers are honest). How do I go about getting a ' good will gesture'? Car not in Sellers Workshop. Am I likely another Centre will be better? worse?
    Arcon 5 you give me hope. Can you expand my knowledge of how to deal with this possibility. Is it linked to oil over clutch?
    Adrian c. No I have never heard of William of Ockham. Who is he? history figure/ - another poster?
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 21st Sep 16, 1:23 PM
    • 11,209 Posts
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    AdrianC
    Adrian C I was aware stamps on books do not say much about the service history really ( especially when they have a date of 27/7/30!). I have asked to see the so called 20,000 mile service report carried out by Dealer who sold car to me. Being 'put off' as saying do not have access to Report, and depending on what happens with Toyota workshop, will consider challenging why they do not have records of their own Services when car was in their ownership.
    Originally posted by Trying to be sensible
    You miss my point. The service history will tell you nothing about how the previous owner drove the car. THAT is what may have caused the rapid wear on the clutch.

    Adrian c. No I have never heard of William of Ockham. Who is he? history figure/ - another poster?
    That was a reply to arcon's point.
    • arcon5
    • By arcon5 21st Sep 16, 3:33 PM
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    arcon5
    Ever heard of William of Ockham?
    Originally posted by AdrianC
    Go on then, elaborate...
    I suspect it's an insult of some sort and your out trolling but do prove me wrong..
    • AdrianC
    • By AdrianC 21st Sep 16, 3:39 PM
    • 11,209 Posts
    • 9,497 Thanks
    AdrianC
    Go on then, elaborate...
    I suspect it's an insult of some sort and your out trolling but do prove me wrong..
    Originally posted by arcon5
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor
    • bigadaj
    • By bigadaj 21st Sep 16, 8:41 PM
    • 7,380 Posts
    • 4,419 Thanks
    bigadaj
    Go on then, elaborate...
    I suspect it's an insult of some sort and your out trolling but do prove me wrong..
    Originally posted by arcon5
    Well it's shown you're not the sharpest tool in the box.
    • arcon5
    • By arcon5 22nd Sep 16, 5:18 AM
    • 12,572 Posts
    • 7,878 Thanks
    arcon5
    Well it's shown you're not the sharpest tool in the box.
    Originally posted by bigadaj

    Obviously not, because I've never heard of this philosopher.

    Interestingly enough though I'm betting half you lot giving advice on cars have barely even touched a spanner, let alone had the pleasure to be diagnosing faults.


    But the real question is when did this forum become so abusive and patronising?

    My point of course was very valid. A burnt out clutch doesn't automatically mean op is at fault in any way and doesn't necessarily prove wear and tear. Anybody that's actually worked in this industry would have seen this time and time again. And worked being the key word not translating to once read a text book or an article on Wikipedia title how clutches work.

    You lot can abuse me all you like but it says a lot more about you than it does me. +1 well done chaps.
    • BeenThroughItAll
    • By BeenThroughItAll 22nd Sep 16, 8:08 AM
    • 3,236 Posts
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    BeenThroughItAll
    Obviously not, because I've never heard of this philosopher.

    Interestingly enough though I'm betting half you lot giving advice on cars have barely even touched a spanner, let alone had the pleasure to be diagnosing faults.


    But the real question is when did this forum become so abusive and patronising?

    My point of course was very valid. A burnt out clutch doesn't automatically mean op is at fault in any way and doesn't necessarily prove wear and tear. Anybody that's actually worked in this industry would have seen this time and time again. And worked being the key word not translating to once read a text book or an article on Wikipedia title how clutches work.

    You lot can abuse me all you like but it says a lot more about you than it does me. +1 well done chaps.
    Originally posted by arcon5
    Pot, kettle, black?

    Maybe you'd care to review some of your posting history on this board?
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