Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • dazibest79
    • By dazibest79 30th Aug 16, 5:21 PM
    • 11Posts
    • 3Thanks
    dazibest79
    Theft!
    • #1
    • 30th Aug 16, 5:21 PM
    Theft! 30th Aug 16 at 5:21 PM
    I was in the process of buying a new build from Persimmon Homes and we were having issues with getting our mortgage finalised but were told on several occasions that we could have the mortgage. At the last minute the mortgage fell through and we lost out £250 of the £500 deposit we put down which I can fully accept. What I cant accept is that we have also lost £1275 we paid for an upgraded kitchen which according to persimmon now belongs to them. I wasn't expecting the mortgage to fall through therefore I went ahead and paid extra for the kitchen of our dreams. I wasn't told at any point by the sales people that I wouldn't get this money back if anything was to happen as neither of us were expecting it. How am I now left with no money and nothing to show for it? Persimmon are a multi million pound company that are making growth despite the Brexit whereas I am a hard working man that is now £1275 out of pocket due to no fault of my own. Do I not legally own part of that kitchen? Have I not added value to the house I was supposed to be buying? How have i ended up out of pocket here? And before you pipe up with well you signed the paperwork I am well aware of that I am asking on a morally correct basis how big companies can get away with this. I would like any advice on how to try and recoup my money if at all possible or is the fact that I signed the piece of paper the be all and end all? Do I have any rights as a little man taking on a big company? Also I have evidence that I was messed around by the mortgage company (Precise Mortgages) as well as support from the mortgage broker (RSC New Homes) that Persimmon suggested we use. Is it just me that thinks this is wrong? I cant be!
Page 2
    • dazibest79
    • By dazibest79 31st Aug 16, 10:46 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    dazibest79
    You're the one who's not completing the contract, why should you get out of it without any penalties? Surely this was covered in your contract.
    Originally posted by Fat Walt
    But this is through no fault of my own. This is my point. If I hadn't been messed around by Precise and RSC and given false information I would be moving into my dream home anytime soon. Why am I at fault here? I was going along with advice from experts! I didn't pull out at the last minute I had every intention of purchasing the house and the kitchen. I was told I could get a mortgage more than once then at the very last minute was told no from Precise even though their Director of finance had already said we could re submit based on false information. Why aren't they held to blame? Why is it alway the little man that has to foot the bill? Why do they have the right to keep my money? Why is this even a legal possibility? They are still going to sell that house for £236,000 with an upgraded kitchen they are in no way going to suffer from me not getting my mortgage. I'm the only one here who loses!
    • Fat Walt
    • By Fat Walt 31st Aug 16, 11:07 AM
    • 602 Posts
    • 327 Thanks
    Fat Walt
    But this is through no fault of my own. This is my point. If I hadn't been messed around by Precise and RSC and given false information I would be moving into my dream home anytime soon. Why am I at fault here? I was going along with advice from experts! I didn't pull out at the last minute I had every intention of purchasing the house and the kitchen. I was told I could get a mortgage more than once then at the very last minute was told no from Precise even though their Director of finance had already said we could re submit based on false information. Why aren't they held to blame? Why is it alway the little man that has to foot the bill? Why do they have the right to keep my money? Why is this even a legal possibility? They are still going to sell that house for £236,000 with an upgraded kitchen they are in no way going to suffer from me not getting my mortgage. I'm the only one here who loses!
    Originally posted by dazibest79
    Who's fault is it you can't get a mortgage?

    You agreed to buy a house without the funds secured.

    You chose the upgrade on the kitchen.

    You failed the credit check.

    You pulled out of the deal.

    It's not Persimmons fault, the blame lies with you.
    • Alice Walker
    • By Alice Walker 31st Aug 16, 11:13 AM
    • 539 Posts
    • 1,223 Thanks
    Alice Walker
    Can we be clear that you have not exchanged contracts yet, is that correct?

    At what point was the build at when you withdrew, did you have a move in date?

    I don't think this is as clearcut as others are stating, it depends on how much work the builder has done and their costs incurred. This post would be a good starting point for you.
    • dazibest79
    • By dazibest79 31st Aug 16, 11:23 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    dazibest79
    Who's fault is it you can't get a mortgage?

    You agreed to buy a house without the funds secured.

    You chose the upgrade on the kitchen.

    You failed the credit check.

    You pulled out of the deal.

    It's not Persimmons fault, the blame lies with you.
    Originally posted by Fat Walt
    Cheers for that useless bit of information! Does the blame not lie with the useless !!!!! at Precise? or the useless !!!!! at RSC? No just me. It may be "my fault" I cant get a mortgage which is all well and good and if the people at both RSC and Precise had said this at the very beginning and not 5 months down the line I wouldn't have even bothered. It was the fact I was told that I wouldn't have any problems to start with that it even got to this situation. I chose the upgrade on the kitchen due to the fact that we were told we could have the mortgage I used people that were recommended to us by Persimmon to make the process run smoothly. Maybe Persimmon aren't to blame but the people who double checked our credit file and said everything looked fine after being given all the information and the people that advised us to pursue a mortgage from Precise maybe they are to be held just a tiny bit responsible? And Precise themselves who's Director of Finance doesn't even know how his own business works! I didn't pull out! I didn't wake up one morning and think !!!! it I don't want this house anymore. I had every intention of seeing this through right to the very end.
    • photome
    • By photome 31st Aug 16, 11:29 AM
    • 12,000 Posts
    • 7,515 Thanks
    photome
    Cheers for that useless bit of information! Does the blame not lie with the useless !!!!! at Precise? or the useless !!!!! at RSC? No just me. It may be "my fault" I cant get a mortgage which is all well and good and if the people at both RSC and Precise had said this at the very beginning and not 5 months down the line I wouldn't have even bothered. It was the fact I was told that I wouldn't have any problems to start with that it even got to this situation. I chose the upgrade on the kitchen due to the fact that we were told we could have the mortgage I used people that were recommended to us by Persimmon to make the process run smoothly. Maybe Persimmon aren't to blame but the people who double checked our credit file and said everything looked fine after being given all the information and the people that advised us to pursue a mortgage from Precise maybe they are to be held just a tiny bit responsible? And Precise themselves who's Director of Finance doesn't even know how his own business works! I didn't pull out! I didn't wake up one morning and think !!!! it I don't want this house anymore. I had every intention of seeing this through right to the very end.
    Originally posted by dazibest79
    I get all of that and you may feel like blaming Precise and RSC but Persimmon have a contract with you. the fault doesnt lie with Persimmon but you are accusing them of theft

    as pointed out by a few others there may be other avenues to explore
    • dazibest79
    • By dazibest79 31st Aug 16, 11:56 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    dazibest79
    Alice_Walker
    We had potential move in date of August/November nothing concrete. The house at this stage is a lower ground shell. No where near finishing touches being installed it doesn't even have an upstairs yet.
    • dazibest79
    • By dazibest79 31st Aug 16, 12:12 PM
    • 11 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    dazibest79
    Why did your application fail?
    Originally posted by Fat Walt
    If it was as black and white as you are making out I would 100% accept it but I was advised to pursue a mortgage that they should have know I couldn't get. If I had applied and not given the information to them and kept it a secret I would be 100% in the wrong but I didn't I laid it all out on the table and was still told I could have a mortgage or that it shouldn't be a problem getting one. We even used a company that dealt with people with poor credit. What more do I have to do. We simply enquired if it would be possible given our credit file and we were to YES! If an expert in their field tells you yes then you tend to believe them. Don't you?
    • Moneyineptitude
    • By Moneyineptitude 31st Aug 16, 12:22 PM
    • 17,231 Posts
    • 7,773 Thanks
    Moneyineptitude
    There was an issue with my credit file.. The reason for the defaults was I was made redundant and couldn't keep up with payments on a loan as well as pay for my mortgage so I set up a payment plan with the loan company.
    Originally posted by dazibest79
    We even used a company that dealt with people with poor credit. What more do I have to do. We simply enquired if it would be possible given our credit file and we were to YES! If an expert in their field tells you yes then you tend to believe them. Don't you?
    Originally posted by dazibest79
    There is "poor credit"(history) and then there are defaults.

    Did you actually end up paying off all the debt you owed or was interest and/or other monies written off as part of your payment plan?
    If the latter is the case, I'd be surprised if you get a mortgage from anyone other than lenders who offer punitive interest rates.

    In your situation, you might be better off posting on the Bankruptcy board
    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/forumdisplay.php?f=159

    While not bankrupt yourself, posters over there may have had similar experiences and be willing to share how they overcame the resultant problems.
    • naedanger
    • By naedanger 31st Aug 16, 12:38 PM
    • 1,791 Posts
    • 1,383 Thanks
    naedanger
    We had potential move in date of August/November nothing concrete. The house at this stage is a lower ground shell. No where near finishing touches being installed it doesn't even have an upstairs yet.
    Originally posted by dazibest79
    So if they have not started on installing the upgraded kitchen then I would ask them why they are deducting £1275 if that amount has not yet been spent.

    I also suggest you take a copy of all the paperwork to Citizen's Advice and ask for their view on the matter. (I am not sure if they will help but it seems to me to be at least worth asking them.)
    • dazibest79
    • By dazibest79 31st Aug 16, 12:43 PM
    • 11 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    dazibest79
    They said that they have already ordered the kitchen. Surely they can return said kitchen or fit it in another of their hundreds of houses. The only reason I can see as to why they are keeping the kitchen and my money is that it adds value to the house and makes it more desirable for the next buyer.
    • naedanger
    • By naedanger 31st Aug 16, 12:47 PM
    • 1,791 Posts
    • 1,383 Thanks
    naedanger
    They said that they have already ordered the kitchen. Surely they can return said kitchen or fit it in another of their hundreds of houses. The only reason I can see as to why they are keeping the kitchen and my money is that it adds value to the house and makes it more desirable for the next buyer.
    Originally posted by dazibest79
    I would ask them to answer in writing two points:
    1) Are they unable to cancel their order, or change it back to their own specification, without losing the £1275?
    2) Is the kitchen you ordered definitely going to be installed in the house you reserved?
    • pinkshoes
    • By pinkshoes 31st Aug 16, 1:27 PM
    • 14,609 Posts
    • 19,650 Thanks
    pinkshoes
    If the house isnt even built yet, and no way near fitting a kitchen stage, then it is highly unlikely they have ordered the kitchen, or are at least able to change their order given how much they will he spending with this kitchen company!!

    I would insist on seeing the order receipt, and if they cannot produce this showing it was ordered ages ago (and PHONE the company to check the order...) then insist on a refund.

    What does your contract actually state about exchange.

    We nearly pulled out of a new-build purchase, and the builder wanted to keep our £2000 deposit. We discovered that there was no mention of an exchange date on our contract, so the £2000 just reserved the property for us, and they could not therefore sell to someone else.
    Should've = Should HAVE (not 'of')
    Would've = Would HAVE (not 'of')

    No, I am not perfect, but yes I do judge people on their use of basic English language. If you didn't know the above, then learn it! (If English is your second language, then you are forgiven!)
    • Le_Kirk
    • By Le_Kirk 31st Aug 16, 1:45 PM
    • 1,407 Posts
    • 683 Thanks
    Le_Kirk
    I'm not quite sure what you mean by this. I have paid out £500 to secure the house so that nobody else could pursue it which I will only get £250 back and I have paid £1275 for the upgraded kitchen which hasn't even been installed in the house yet as the house isn't no where near finished. How have I not "lost" any money here? I am out of pocket with nothing to show for it.
    Originally posted by dazibest79
    When you put a deposit on a house to secure it, it is normally "subject to contract" hence my question "Have you exchanged contracts?" If you have not exchanged then there is no contract in place and apart from keeping half your deposit which is annoying but was probably in the T&C's, you should be able to walk away owing nothing. I am not sure what you mean by having "paid" £1,275 for the kitchen. You might have agreed to add it to the purchase price and it would be due upon completion but if you have no contract nobody can chase you for it .......... unless of course you have already handed over the money. What does your solicitor/conveyancer say?
    • dazibest79
    • By dazibest79 31st Aug 16, 2:22 PM
    • 11 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    dazibest79
    When you put a deposit on a house to secure it, it is normally "subject to contract" hence my question "Have you exchanged contracts?" If you have not exchanged then there is no contract in place and apart from keeping half your deposit which is annoying but was probably in the T&C's, you should be able to walk away owing nothing. I am not sure what you mean by having "paid" £1,275 for the kitchen. You might have agreed to add it to the purchase price and it would be due upon completion but if you have no contract nobody can chase you for it .......... unless of course you have already handed over the money. What does your solicitor/conveyancer say?
    Originally posted by Le_Kirk

    We hadn't even paid a deposit on the house apart from to secure it. However I have signed a piece of paper saying that any upgrades cannot be refunded which I didn't realise at the time. I have already paid the money to persimmon for the kitchen. If I have to bite the bullet and right it off then thats fine but something doesn't sit right with me.
    • Browntoa
    • By Browntoa 31st Aug 16, 2:26 PM
    • 30,253 Posts
    • 35,815 Thanks
    Browntoa
    If it's bespoke and built to order then there is little you can do , if you could prove that they have reused your kitchen in another unit then you may have a case
    I'm the Board Guide of the Referrers ,Telephones, Pensions , Shop Don't drop and Discount Code boards which means I'm a volunteer to help them run smoothly and I can move and merge posts there. However, please remember, board guides don't read every post. If you spot an inappropriate or illegal post please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.
    • unholyangel
    • By unholyangel 31st Aug 16, 2:34 PM
    • 10,198 Posts
    • 7,357 Thanks
    unholyangel
    OP if you have legal cover on your home insurance, get advice from them.

    It sounds as if you possibly made a conditional offer - ie that the offer was conditional upon you getting a mortgage. If that is the case, they most definitely should be refunding the money for the upgrade.
    Money doesn't solve poverty.....it creates it.
    • dazibest79
    • By dazibest79 11th Oct 16, 11:57 AM
    • 11 Posts
    • 3 Thanks
    dazibest79
    Just a little update to those who were adamant that I was to blame for this. I have be told by the Sales Director at Persimmon Homes that I will be receiving a full refund for the kitchen that was ordered. Thanks to those who advised me to pursue it.
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

4,082Posts Today

8,474Users online

Martin's Twitter
  • RT @itvMLshow: Tonight #MartinLewis looks into our family finances; Marriage tax allowance, student loans and child tax credit, 8pm on @ITV?

  • Don't forget 8pm tonight ITV - should be a good show. As always my aim is to, in effect, pay you to watch #martinlewis money show

  • RT @bbc5live: After midday, money-saving @MartinSLewis will be here to answer your financial questions ????https://t.co/UQMSd5TKbb https://t.?

  • Follow Martin