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  • FIRST POST
    • Merlin139
    • By Merlin139 26th Apr 16, 8:03 PM
    • 4,332Posts
    • 18,211Thanks
    Merlin139
    PV+ Grid Voltage Monitor
    • #1
    • 26th Apr 16, 8:03 PM
    PV+ Grid Voltage Monitor 26th Apr 16 at 8:03 PM
    Today I received a call from my Solar panel installers asking if I was intrested in getting a quote for one of the new Solar PV Batteries and also something called PV+. They claim it can increase PV energy production by upto 20% by cutting out voltage outages!

    http://matt-e.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/PV-v1-Installation-Manual-v6.pdf

    The link shows a PDF which explains what it does. Anybody know anything about them and if so do you think it makes any sense?

    I have someone coming to see me tomorrow morning.
Page 3
    • Gadget_Dave
    • By Gadget_Dave 12th Sep 17, 3:15 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gadget_Dave
    PV Plus
    I was contacted November 2016 about having PV Plus installed on my system by the original supplier. I've had my PV system installed since 2012. I listened to the salesman and what he had to say which made sense at the time and I agreed to give this a free trial, which he said if I am not totally satisfied after the 12 month trial they would remove it. The cost to have it installed was £1250.00 and I filled out a loan form for this underwritten by Ikano Bank. I was going to pay for this in cash but now looking at the data I've generated I've asked them to remove it and put my system back to how it was before. I am a saddo in the fact that since installation of my PV system I've methodically recorded daily figures for generation and was pleased to show this to the sales rep at the onset of the PV Plus upgrade discussions, basically saying i'll have the data to prove or not any potential improvements in generation. I have now produced a graph showing this data over the last 4 years, and includes the data after the PV Plus installation, the graph clearly shows no improvement whatsoever and therefore I will not be paying the fee.
    • Gadget_Dave
    • By Gadget_Dave 12th Sep 17, 3:17 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gadget_Dave
    Graph available on request couldn't get it in the box !!!!
    • pinnks
    • By pinnks 13th Sep 17, 4:12 PM
    • 535 Posts
    • 1,187 Thanks
    pinnks
    Interesting. Can you pop the graph into Dropbox or a similar cloud storage and post a link to it?
    Wiltshire - 5.25kWp
    3.5kWp: 14 x Phono Solar 250 Onyx, Sunny Boy 4000TL, WSW 40 degrees, June 2013
    1.75kWp: 7 x Phono Solar 250 Onyx, Sunny Boy 1600TL, SSE 45 degrees, March 2014
    • Gadget_Dave
    • By Gadget_Dave 21st Sep 17, 1:29 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gadget_Dave
    I've now contacted the supplier GEP Solutions to remove the PV Plus, who are now basically saying the switch is mine paid for by the Ikano bank loan (which I didn't want at the onset!!) and they will not be removing it... Mis-selling and aggressive sales techniques springs to mind as the switch clearly doesn't work. I've now reported them to Trading Standards via CAB. I'm not very happy as you would expect. What redress do I have now? Up the creak without a paddle is suspect. What are my rights?
    • Gadget_Dave
    • By Gadget_Dave 21st Sep 17, 1:52 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gadget_Dave
    PV Plus Graph
    not sure how this works, it wont let me post a link to dropbox file.
    • pinnks
    • By pinnks 21st Sep 17, 7:45 PM
    • 535 Posts
    • 1,187 Thanks
    pinnks
    Hi Gadget_Dave.

    Your PM arrived so re-posting your dropbox link https://www.dropbox.com/s/4r9z4oznoly8jrd/solar%20switch%20data.xlsx?dl=0

    Can't remember what you were seeking to show but at least the data is visible now...
    Wiltshire - 5.25kWp
    3.5kWp: 14 x Phono Solar 250 Onyx, Sunny Boy 4000TL, WSW 40 degrees, June 2013
    1.75kWp: 7 x Phono Solar 250 Onyx, Sunny Boy 1600TL, SSE 45 degrees, March 2014
    • Gadget_Dave
    • By Gadget_Dave 23rd Sep 17, 8:54 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gadget_Dave
    Hi Ive posted a comment on the graph, what I really want to do is stop anyone else from buying the PV Plus optimiser as it clearly doesn't work....I've been grossly mis-sold it by Green Energy Power Solutions and not very happy.
    • Gadget_Dave
    • By Gadget_Dave 23rd Sep 17, 9:10 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gadget_Dave
    I've been had too, hook line and sinker. It doesn't improve generation at all. The data I've generated from my system confirms this unequivocally. I've recorded all generated data since install over 5 years now and the last year with PV Plus fitted is no better than any other year taken in isolation and near the worse performer of the data I have.
    • Merlin139
    • By Merlin139 25th Sep 17, 7:19 AM
    • 4,332 Posts
    • 18,211 Thanks
    Merlin139
    Hi Ive posted a comment on the graph, what I really want to do is stop anyone else from buying the PV Plus optimiser as it clearly doesn't work....I've been grossly mis-sold it by Green Energy Power Solutions and not very happy.
    Originally posted by Gadget_Dave
    Do you have anything in writing to back up that they would remove the system? If so take them down the small claims route. Try contacting BBC Watchdog. It maybe that their are lots of people in the same situation.

    As I said since the start of this thread if the system worked they could show you proof with 2 systems next to one another. one with and one without! As we know, no one will do it!
    • Gadget_Dave
    • By Gadget_Dave 11th Oct 17, 2:53 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gadget_Dave
    PV Plus (missold)
    Unfortunately I have nothing in writing, I have raised a complaint with them and reported to trading standards. A meeting is to take place shortly to progress the issue. Iíve been mis-sold this on a grand scale. Iím now stuck with something that doesnít produce what they claim. Iíve downloaded sunshine data from met office website too which will counteract their claim it works on certain dates. More sunshine more generation but not due to PV Plus due to the system working normally with more sun.
    • Gadget_Dave
    • By Gadget_Dave 12th Oct 17, 7:07 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gadget_Dave
    I've tried contacting BBC Watchdog with no luck so far, also wrote my story to RIP Off Britain in the hope that they will follow it up.. Were stuck now to be honest with a PV Plus inverter that is clearly not generating the extra 20%-25% promised by the salesman. The buy now pay later loan kicks in soon and first payment due on or around 16th November. We've complained to the bank also as they should not be financing the PV Plus as it doesn't work, surely they are partly responsible now under the financial conduct authority? Average annual and monthly sunshine data is available at the met office website. I've downloaded this and plotted the data alongside my generation data, the data sets coincide month by month as you would expect and clearly show no improvement from PV Plus data versus original system PV data.
    • Gadget_Dave
    • By Gadget_Dave 12th Oct 17, 7:34 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gadget_Dave
    Generation Data
    I obtained a spreadsheet from Scottish Power with whom my PV System is registered with and who pay my FIT payments. It took them a few days to provide the data but none the less a complete data set was obtained, I also collated my own generation data everyday since installation and have this data written down on a notepad. I have used this data to generate annual graphs which is easy to compare the data sets year on year. Hence I can show unequivocally that PV Plus doesn't work to the levels stated in the sales pitch.
    Hopefully I have the data to show at a forthcoming meeting with GEP Solutions that the switch isn't doing what they claim and they will offer my money back or at least pay the bank back with the buy now pay later scheme they employ to sell these switches...

    Hi

    Information provided below is from PVOutput team 'United Kingdom' for the past 4 years. The team consists of 548 systems of which around 250 currently contribute on a daily basis therefore the sample size would prove statistically significant.

    Average Generation kWh/kWp per day - percentage is 2016 vs year
    2016 - 2.185
    2015 - 2.243 - 97.4%
    2014 - 2.276 - 96.0%
    2013 - 2.209 - 98.9%

    2016 when compared to the previous 3 year average resolves to a relative generation of 97.4% (2.185/((2.243+2.276+2.209)/3)), therefore a 'reasonable man' consideration would be that the reduction in generation due to irradiation conditions would be in the region of 2.6% which is certainly in line with the Met Office sunshine analytics figure provided by Martyn1981 in an earlier post.

    It is important that POLLY1133 accurately compares 12 month generation post-installation for the same periods pre-installation in energy terms (kWh) as opposed to FiT payments as this removes tariff variance.

    From information provided, annual payment reduced by £38 on a historical 'estimate' of £500. The annual uplift for FiT between 2015 & 2016 was 1.21%, therefore suggesting a 7.5% (38/(500*1.0121)) reduction in generation for this particular site which suggests that the FiT 'estimate' of £500 needs to be addressed urgently prior to any discussion with the vendor.

    Irrespective of the accuracy of the data, it is clear that the provision of technology claiming to benefit generation is not performing in line with any technical or financial claims made.

    Regarding 'bird muck' - considering that the generation periods being compared are annual, it is extremely unlikely (or even unreasonable) to assume or claim that a temporary reduction in output would resolve to anywhere near a 20.9% (1-((100*0.925)/((100x1.2)*0.974))) fall in annual generation against claims & expectations, this being due to the natural cleaning effect of rain combined with year on year long term averaging (birds tend to target panels on a regular basis!).

    Regarding shading - it would be unreasonable to assume that shading related to trees would seriously impact annual generation (in the region of 25%) between two consecutive years without the shading source being extremely close to the array in question and the shade being almost immediately obvious.

    It's no use in considering FiT income in any discussion unless claiming compensation for reduced generation. Accurate data on energy generation is needed to be gathered together urgently - this can either be from the quarterly submissions or downloaded directly from the inverter.

    HTH
    Z
    Originally posted by zeupater
    • Oscargrouch
    • By Oscargrouch 12th Oct 17, 7:46 PM
    • 2,798 Posts
    • 13,278 Thanks
    Oscargrouch
    This is taken from the information sent by Saveheatenergy.
    Originally posted by Merlin139
    Don't Faff around; just BIN em.
    2.5 kWp PV system, SSW facing, 45 Deg Roof. ABB Inverter, Monitor: 'Wattson'.
    Reg. for FIT Nov 2011. Northants. "It's not what you generate; it's how you use it that matters".

    Definition of 'O's = kWh/kWp (kWh = your daily & accurate Generation figure) (kWp = the rated output of your PV Panels).
    • Gadget_Dave
    • By Gadget_Dave 12th Oct 17, 7:55 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gadget_Dave
    I'm trying to bin em but need my system restoring back to how it was when they installed it. They can have their PV Plus Grid Monitor switch back as its crap.
    • Gadget_Dave
    • By Gadget_Dave 12th Oct 17, 8:03 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gadget_Dave
    Could I share my generation data with you? It seems your maths are better than mine. I have all data plotted and clearly shows PV Plus doesn't work.
    I have the file loaded in dropbox and could share the link to the file with you. please provide email address.

    Thanks
    • Gadget_Dave
    • By Gadget_Dave 12th Oct 17, 8:06 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gadget_Dave
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/4r9z4oznoly8jrd/solar%20switch%20data.xlsx?dl=0

    Let me know if this works.

    Thanks

    Gadget_Dave
    Last edited by Gadget_Dave; 12-10-2017 at 8:22 PM.
    • Gadget_Dave
    • By Gadget_Dave 12th Oct 17, 8:29 PM
    • 14 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    Gadget_Dave
    sheet 2 https://www.dropbox.com/s/4r9z4oznoly8jrd/solar%20switch%20data.xlsx?dl=0
    sheet 1 https://www.dropbox.com/s/4r9z4oznoly8jrd/solar%20switch%20data.xlsx?dl=0
    Link to my data on dropbox..
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