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  • FIRST POST
    • tg99
    • By tg99 6th Feb 16, 2:38 PM
    • 409Posts
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    tg99
    Halifax and BOS closing my accounts
    • #1
    • 6th Feb 16, 2:38 PM
    Halifax and BOS closing my accounts 6th Feb 16 at 2:38 PM
    Received two letters this morning dated 2 Feb , one from Halifax and one from BOS, both stating that all my accounts with them will be closed on 4 April.

    Currently have three BOS Vantage with £5k in each purely for savings and have only used for such purposes since opening around mid last year. Plus the Monthly Saver.

    Halifax: opened Reward current account last Oct and switched into it for the incentive and have just keep a nominal balance ever since plus 2x DDs to get the monthly reward. Also opened two standard current accounts around same time, one I switched last Dec, the other I have just initiated a switch to M&S current account.

    Phoned them and they insisted (as expected) that they could not tell me any reason why over the phone and that I would need to go into branch if I wanted to find out more. When I speculated that it was unlikely to be a coincidence that they have written to me on the exact day / day after M&S would have informed them of the switch, she stated that it would definitely not be for that reason as "lots of people switch accounts away from us all the time but keep other accounts". However, it just seems too much of a coincidence to me; I don't have any issues with credit record, fraud, CIFAS etc and have not had any payments to or from people that could look fraudulent.

    Will try and pop into branch next week but in the meantime:

    - has anyone else had this or similar situation with Halifax or BOS and managed to find out reasons why ?

    - I guess I should expect a similar letter next week from Lloyds for my Lloyds account (the letters say I can use the switching service to move my accounts elsewhere before 4 April but not to any members of Lloyds Banking Group)?

    - Anyone got any idea if I am likely to be successful in opening new accounts if I wait say 12 months or something or do these things tend to be 'life bans'?

    Hopefully my iWeb share dealing account is not at risk given it is operated by Halifax Share Dealing!

    Thanks.
Page 5
    • Heng Leng
    • By Heng Leng 6th Jun 16, 2:46 PM
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    Heng Leng
    This definitely highlights the need to retain a (backup) bank account unconnected to a main account.

    Yes, I kept my money in there up until the day before the two months was up in order to maximise interest and then online transferred it out to my other non-LBG accounts and changed / cancelled my DD and SO. I tried logging in the day after closure and all the accounts had indeed been closed. I received the interest they owed me (as accounts were closed day before interest is paid) via cheque a few days later.
    Originally posted by tg99
    • adindas
    • By adindas 29th Jun 16, 11:04 AM
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    adindas
    In the past I have around £30,000 (?) money movement in a month in LBG. I am currently doing weekly movement from LBG + TSB to another UK banks worth more than £50.000 a month to maximise interest and some short of stoozing. All of that in a very short period, a few second up to 2-3 days.

    I have personal experience dealing with the incompetent staff when tried to open a new bank account in LBG. They keep asking me why you have so much money come in and out in your bank accounts every month. I keep telling her that to maximize interest, but she still could not understand might be due to her lacking of experience. Only with the intervention of her supervisor I could escape. The senior staff only asked one question to me how much money you have in total in UK bank account. When they know I have more than £50, 000,- spread among UK banks he said I could not see any problem at all.

    Sometimes it is a matter of luck, you get pick up by either of a picky staff, an inexperience staff, a lazy staff who does not want to investigate further and you are out of luck. You could call them an idiot who should never be working in the finance industry in the first instance. The problem here is that it is not in your control who you be dealing with.
    • tg99
    • By tg99 25th Aug 16, 3:43 PM
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    tg99
    So, I did DSAR for Lloyds and for HBOS, still awaiting receipt of HBOS data but now have the Lloyds stuff. Waded through it and notable findings as follows:

    - customer notes did not shed any further light on why accounts were closed. On 2.2.16 (the date of issue of my closure letters) there is an entry saying "all accounts pended for 60 days following a central review. Accounts to be closed on 4.4.16. Accounts to operate as normal until closure date therefore credits and debits as normal". Then entry for each account on 4.4.16 saying "account closed by ACU following central review of account. ACU / HR / SE".

    - under the list of enquiries for each of my accounts there are regular Enquiries under standard descriptions such as Full, Monthly Range Balances, Standing Order Summary, etc that all occur typically multiple times each month since account opening and I assume just part of the day to day account operating. However, there was one entry 'Enquiry name and address for account' that only appeared once and it was the day after my closure letters were issued.

    - under my personal details it incorrectly states that the date I moved to my current address was 2015 (which therefore contradicts the years at address entered under the account application data which was well over 5 years)...therefore not sure if this could have anything to do with the closure given the name and address enquiry noted above.

    - under Customer Groups I was entered into the Additional Monitoring Group (which falls under Know Your Customer Group Type) with effective date of 1.2.16 so the day before my closure letters were issued.

    - all the credit search information was fine
    • Thrugelmir
    • By Thrugelmir 25th Aug 16, 3:50 PM
    • 51,336 Posts
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    Thrugelmir
    Still going to complain further?

    I'm not surprised nothing interesting showed up.
    “A man is rich who lives upon what he has. A man is poor who lives upon what is coming. A prudent man lives within his income, and saves against ‘a rainy day’.”
    • tg99
    • By tg99 25th Aug 16, 3:55 PM
    • 409 Posts
    • 184 Thanks
    tg99
    Will wait for HBOS DSAR to come in and then complain to FOS given won't take v long so nothing to lose albeit minimal chance of it changing anything. Will probably give person at Lloyds who dealt with my complaint a quick call too to clarify this issue over address and check if that might have caused a problem (doubt it though).
    • Ed-1
    • By Ed-1 25th Aug 16, 4:00 PM
    • 1,498 Posts
    • 810 Thanks
    Ed-1
    So, I did DSAR for Lloyds and for HBOS, still awaiting receipt of HBOS data but now have the Lloyds stuff. Waded through it and notable findings as follows:

    - customer notes did not shed any further light on why accounts were closed. On 2.2.16 (the date of issue of my closure letters) there is an entry saying "all accounts pended for 60 days following a central review. Accounts to be closed on 4.4.16. Accounts to operate as normal until closure date therefore credits and debits as normal". Then entry for each account on 4.4.16 saying "account closed by ACU following central review of account. ACU / HR / SE".

    - under the list of enquiries for each of my accounts there are regular Enquiries under standard descriptions such as Full, Monthly Range Balances, Standing Order Summary, etc that all occur typically multiple times each month since account opening and I assume just part of the day to day account operating. However, there was one entry 'Enquiry name and address for account' that only appeared once and it was the day after my closure letters were issued.

    - under my personal details it incorrectly states that the date I moved to my current address was 2015 (which therefore contradicts the years at address entered under the account application data which was well over 5 years)...therefore not sure if this could have anything to do with the closure given the name and address enquiry noted above.

    - under Customer Groups I was entered into the Additional Monitoring Group (which falls under Know Your Customer Group Type) with effective date of 1.2.16 so the day before my closure letters were issued.

    - all the credit search information was fine
    Originally posted by tg99
    Interesting. Did you get printouts from the customer insight system? That would show which organisational unit put the note on and the time. You could then compare with the time of the note on the HBOS printouts which may indicate which bank initially made the decision (which then applied to the other automatically as it's LBG). Does it say anything in the note about 'Account Review Team'?
    Last edited by Ed-1; 25-08-2016 at 4:03 PM.
    • Heng Leng
    • By Heng Leng 25th Aug 16, 4:19 PM
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    Heng Leng
    It looks like the address date is where the issues sit and you have the right to have incorrect data corrected. Regardless, they still don't need to do business with you.
    Last edited by Heng Leng; 25-08-2016 at 4:21 PM.
    • tg99
    • By tg99 25th Aug 16, 4:20 PM
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    tg99
    Yeah the Customer Insights print outs don't show anything to do with the above though. The info re incorrect address time and Additional monitoring group is under Personal Banking System print outs and can't see any date and time stamp.
    • Ed-1
    • By Ed-1 25th Aug 16, 4:24 PM
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    Ed-1
    Yeah the Customer Insights print outs don't show anything to do with the above though. The info re incorrect address time and Additional monitoring group is under Personal Banking System print outs and can't see any date and time stamp.
    Originally posted by tg99
    When I did a DSAR the customer insight printouts basically showed each note from the customer contact notes separately in a box at the top of an A4 page together with the organisational unit that put the note on and the time.

    Is that all the note says? So it doesn't say ***ACCOUNT REVIEW TEAM*** at the start of the note?
    • tg99
    • By tg99 25th Aug 16, 4:36 PM
    • 409 Posts
    • 184 Thanks
    tg99
    When I did a DSAR the customer insight printouts basically showed each note from the customer contact notes separately in a box at the top of an A4 page together with the organisational unit that put the note on and the time.

    Is that all the note says? So it doesn't say ***ACCOUNT REVIEW TEAM*** at the start of the note?
    Originally posted by Ed-1
    Ok see what you are getting at now. On my summary page of my customer contact history it lists the various contacts/activity/date/Channel etc and I can see a 'Servicing' activity type on 2.2.16 when closure letters issued and Closures activity types on 4.4.16 along with other activity types such as complaints etc. However, not all of these individual contacts have their own A4 page with the box....only some do e.g. The complaints ones but the ones relating to my account closure above do not have their own page and box so I can't see any further info about them (whereas I can for example see date, time and department for my complaint). Wonder why they haven't provided compete info here.....
    • Ed-1
    • By Ed-1 25th Aug 16, 4:46 PM
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    Ed-1
    Ok see what you are getting at now. On my summary page of my customer contact history it lists the various contacts/activity/date/Channel etc and I can see a 'Servicing' activity type on 2.2.16 when closure letters issued and Closures activity types on 4.4.16 along with other activity types such as complaints etc. However, not all of these individual contacts have their own A4 page with the box....only some do e.g. The complaints ones but the ones relating to my account closure above do not have their own page and box so I can't see any further info about them (whereas I can for example see date, time and department for my complaint). Wonder why they haven't provided compete info here.....
    Originally posted by tg99
    The note on mine when they closed mine at the start of last year was put on by the account review team and it said that with three asterisks at each side at the start of the note. When I looked at the note in its box from the customer insight printouts I noticed the organisational unit that put the note on was Personal Lending Decisions. The account review team sits inside that department which told me my closures were to do with credit scoring criteria no longer being met putting me outside the risk etc. This was all down to opening over 40 accounts in the same month taking advantage of the Yorkshire Bank unlimited switching offer that backfired with LBG.

    So it definitely doesn't mention account review team? You could wait to see if HBOS provides this note from the customer insight system which should say the same thing as the Lloyds note to find out the organisational unit that put it on. If not then you could contact them and ask for it.
    • tg99
    • By tg99 25th Aug 16, 5:28 PM
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    tg99
    The note on mine when they closed mine at the start of last year was put on by the account review team and it said that with three asterisks at each side at the start of the note. When I looked at the note in its box from the customer insight printouts I noticed the organisational unit that put the note on was Personal Lending Decisions. The account review team sits inside that department which told me my closures were to do with credit scoring criteria no longer being met putting me outside the risk etc. This was all down to opening over 40 accounts in the same month taking advantage of the Yorkshire Bank unlimited switching offer that backfired with LBG.

    So it definitely doesn't mention account review team? You could wait to see if HBOS provides this note from the customer insight system which should say the same thing as the Lloyds note to find out the organisational unit that put it on. If not then you could contact them and ask for it.
    Originally posted by Ed-1
    Definitely nothing on account review team so will wait till HBOS stuff comes in and phone Lloyds as necessary. The only info re my account closures is the bit I put in my first post from today which was in the Customer Notes printouts.

    In the Customer insight prints, on the summary page there is a section saying 'customer consent' which says 'customer not given consent to view additional information'. Maybe if the reason for closing my accounts is say AML related - rather than say credit decision / risk - then legally they can't show me info / pages on Customer Insight that relate to my accounts being closed?
    • KJSmith
    • By KJSmith 25th Aug 16, 6:00 PM
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    KJSmith
    In the Customer insight prints, on the summary page there is a section saying 'customer consent' which says 'customer not given consent to view additional information'. Maybe if the reason for closing my accounts is say AML related - rather than say credit decision / risk - then legally they can't show me info / pages on Customer Insight that relate to my accounts being closed?
    Originally posted by tg99
    Nope. That consent relates to viewing data that is held under a different entity within Lloyds Banking Group under the Lloyds Bank brand e.g. Lloyds Bank International.
    • tg99
    • By tg99 10th Sep 16, 7:13 PM
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    tg99
    So now received the DSAR info from HBOS:

    - same incorrect date moved to address and entry into Additional Monitoring Group as for Lloyds DSAR noted above

    - this time under customer insights it does have the individual A4 pages for each contact including those on 2.2.16 when my accounts were put on notice for closure. These pages state:

    Organisational unit = Andover HBOS4 (119657)
    Medium = letter
    Direction = from customer/client (though I think this is an error as should be To customer/client)
    Description = not known

    Details= mail in cheque account enquiry. Account pended for 60 days following a central review. Account to be closed on 4/4/16. Account to operate as normal until closure date. Therefore credits and debits as normal. INTERNAL USE ONLY please email products AML & Sanctions Inbox for all forced account closure enquiries. REF ACU/HR/mw
    (Interestingly there was a summary page of the details from the contact notes and in this section the text following internal use only was blacked out but I could see from length of text etc that what was blacked out was the identical comment as above.)

    - same details as in Lloyds DSAR customer insight pages for the account closures on 4.4.16

    - more complete info on the log of my customer complaint re closures as it shows the email back from the person who appears to have taken decision to close it in response to the email she received from the complaints person asking if she was able to overturn it. Essentially email just a one liner saying won't overturn but it's come from an Assistant Manager in High Risk Decisioning department / Retail Fraud & Financial Crime / Retail Business Risk / LBG. As it gives her name perhaps I will call her but prob wouldn't get through and almost certainly would not tell me anything.

    - did not get pages on credit searches like I did with Lloyds DSAR and also nothing on BM Savings account was included

    - nothing particularly insightful from the Iweb Sharedealing section though confirmed all the AML checks fine and passed including those not long before and subsequent to 2.2.16 (the checks are done by a department in HBOS as listed on my Noddle credit report). In the Restrictions settings (account was restricted in May 2016 following LBG decision to close my bank accounts a few months earlier), it has two drop down menus, one for Restrictions Available and one for All Restrictions for this Account. Because it's only a print out I can only see the first few lines in each as you have to scroll down but in the second menu all the ones I can see are June 2016 and are code DNDF description HBOS DRIP payment failure refer to credit control Insert Narrative refer to financial crime. Not sure what this is related to as not had dividends set up to be reinvested (think this might be what the DRIP refers to ie dividend reinvestment plan) and haven't had any payment failures etc. All I have is just a range of standard unit trusts / OEICs with Iweb, nothing unusual or suspicious.
    • Chadsman
    • By Chadsman 10th Sep 16, 8:54 PM
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    Chadsman
    Has anyone ever had Birmingham Midshires accounts closed by HBOS at the same time?
    God save the Queen!
    I'll save Elizabeth Fry, Charles Darwin, Adam Smith, Matthew Boulton and James Watt.
    • tg99
    • By tg99 11th Sep 16, 5:18 PM
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    tg99
    Has anyone ever had Birmingham Midshires accounts closed by HBOS at the same time?
    Originally posted by Chadsman
    From the LBG account closures I've read about / experienced myself, when they close your Lloyds/Halifax/BOS account they also close all other accounts under LBG. Hence as Birm Mid is part of BOS then that will likely be closed albeit that they took another few months to issue me with my BM Savings and IWeb closure letters (which is why I do not think my blanket closure of all LBG products stemmed from these two brands).
    • Ed-1
    • By Ed-1 11th Sep 16, 7:42 PM
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    Ed-1
    From the LBG account closures I've read about / experienced myself, when they close your Lloyds/Halifax/BOS account they also close all other accounts under LBG. Hence as Birm Mid is part of BOS then that will likely be closed albeit that they took another few months to issue me with my BM Savings and IWeb closure letters (which is why I do not think my blanket closure of all LBG products stemmed from these two brands).
    Originally posted by tg99
    So are all accounts closed now with all LBG brands? When you mention the restrictions settings above is that for a particular account/brand that is closed or still open?
    • tg99
    • By tg99 11th Sep 16, 8:14 PM
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    tg99
    So are all accounts closed now with all LBG brands? When you mention the restrictions settings above is that for a particular account/brand that is closed or still open?
    Originally posted by Ed-1
    All closed except iWeb Sharedealing account as with that one they give you one months notice and say can either sell investments for cash or transfer to another provider but in reality they don't enforce the one month notice and essentially will remain open until I sell or transfer away my existing holdings (which in no rush / no intention to do as no platform fee!). So account is restricted which means can't buy anything new and can't deal online have to phone up. The restriction settings I noted above were for the iWeb account.
    • tg99
    • By tg99 9th Oct 16, 3:56 PM
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    tg99
    Did try and get through to the High Risk Decisioning department but could only get as far as leaving a message for the assistant manager person named in the DSAR info....and then within an hour got call from the complaints manager who dealt with my original complaint saying that (as I thought) they could not speak to me but in any case they are effectively a messenger for the decision and not the actual person who made it.

    Anyhow, now filed complaints with FOS but a pretty long estimated timescale of c8 months (not that it really matters given there is pretty much zero chance of me being successful).

    On the plus side, HBOS credited me £120 because their DSAR team missed out the Birmingham Midshires info when compiling my data pack such that is is now to follow but outside the 40 day deadline.
    • Heng Leng
    • By Heng Leng 11th Oct 16, 1:15 AM
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    Heng Leng
    Was it all worth it?
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