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    • kaffenback
    • By kaffenback 13th Oct 15, 11:46 AM
    • 29Posts
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    kaffenback
    UKPC Scotland threat to RK
    • #1
    • 13th Oct 15, 11:46 AM
    UKPC Scotland threat to RK 13th Oct 15 at 11:46 AM
    Hi all, have a thread on Pepipoo re a PCN from UKPC for parking in Scotland, with me as RK resident in England (same username, title UKPC PCN/NTK Scotland-ignore?). All is going well with the planned ignoring but I am curious about the wording on the third letter from UKPC, their Final Reminder, which although not threatening to pursue the RK for the actual parking charge, states:

    "If necessary, UKPC may commence proceedings against you in a Sheriff Court for the outstanding interest and court costs."

    Could this have any theoretical legal legitimacy, notwithstanding the jurisdiction issues etc?
Page 1
    • Herzlos
    • By Herzlos 13th Oct 15, 11:49 AM
    • 5,976 Posts
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    Herzlos
    • #2
    • 13th Oct 15, 11:49 AM
    • #2
    • 13th Oct 15, 11:49 AM
    Not at all. You're not in jurisdiction for a Sheriff Court and UKPC can only make a claim against the driver, which you're not obligated to tell them. It's purely scare tactic to get people to give in, but you know better

    Continue to ignore everything from them.

    Did the letter mention POFA 2012?
    • HO87
    • By HO87 13th Oct 15, 11:57 AM
    • 4,192 Posts
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    HO87
    • #3
    • 13th Oct 15, 11:57 AM
    • #3
    • 13th Oct 15, 11:57 AM
    +1

    That said it is possible to apply to the Sheriff Court for permission to issue proceedings out-of-the-jurisdiction (much as can be done before the County Courts in England & Wales for service in Scotland). The costs involved would be significant and UKPC would have to ask for (and pay for) and attend at least one hearing in Scotland before they could do anything. Any self-respecting Sheriff is going to ask what the hell they think they are doing launching such a process to pursue £100.
    My very sincere apologies for those hoping to request off-board assistance but I am now so inundated with requests that in order to do justice to those "already in the system" I am no longer accepting PM's and am unlikely to do so for the foreseeable future (August 2016).

    For those seeking more detailed advice and guidance regarding small claims cases arising from private parking issues I recommend that you visit the Private Parking forum on PePiPoo.com
    • Herzlos
    • By Herzlos 13th Oct 15, 12:01 PM
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    Herzlos
    • #4
    • 13th Oct 15, 12:01 PM
    • #4
    • 13th Oct 15, 12:01 PM
    They'd presumably also have to convince the Sheriff at that point that the case has a reasonable chance of success.

    All in it's not really worth it for them when they can just send a few threats and give up.
    • kaffenback
    • By kaffenback 13th Oct 15, 12:03 PM
    • 29 Posts
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    kaffenback
    • #5
    • 13th Oct 15, 12:03 PM
    • #5
    • 13th Oct 15, 12:03 PM
    OK I am fairly comfortable re the risk of UKPC pursuing me via out-of-jurisdiction proceedings, but in theory could a threat to pursue an RK who was resident in Scotland for interest and court charges have any legal weight, without the driver being known?

    EDIT: @Herzlos no there is no mention of keeper liability, PoFA 2012 or even POLPA in any of their letters- they must have done their homework on this (possibly on seeing the deep water CEL are in) as the letters are clearly carefully reworded versions of the England & Wales versions as seen on the UKPC paper chain thread on Pepipoo.
    Last edited by kaffenback; 13-10-2015 at 12:10 PM.
    • bazster
    • By bazster 13th Oct 15, 12:04 PM
    • 7,326 Posts
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    bazster
    • #6
    • 13th Oct 15, 12:04 PM
    • #6
    • 13th Oct 15, 12:04 PM
    As stated, theoretically it's possible but the costs and legal hurdles would be significant. I'd suggest that it ain't going to happen.
    Je suis Charlie.
    • bazster
    • By bazster 13th Oct 15, 12:07 PM
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    bazster
    • #7
    • 13th Oct 15, 12:07 PM
    • #7
    • 13th Oct 15, 12:07 PM
    OK I am fairly comfortable re the risk of UKPC pursuing me via out-of-jurisdiction proceedings, but in theory could a threat to pursue an RK who was resident in Scotland for interest and court charges have any legal weight, without the driver being known?
    Originally posted by kaffenback
    I thought you said the RK was resident in England?

    Where the RK is in Scotland and the parking "event" was in Scotland I'd say they haven't a cat-in-hell's chance of getting anything out of the RK for any reason whatsoever.
    Je suis Charlie.
    • kaffenback
    • By kaffenback 13th Oct 15, 12:15 PM
    • 29 Posts
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    kaffenback
    • #8
    • 13th Oct 15, 12:15 PM
    • #8
    • 13th Oct 15, 12:15 PM
    I thought you said the RK was resident in England?

    Where the RK is in Scotland and the parking "event" was in Scotland I'd say they haven't a cat-in-hell's chance of getting anything out of the RK for any reason whatsoever.
    Originally posted by bazster
    Sorry yes I am resident in England, I was just curious re the legitimacy of the threat of pursuing an RK for interest and court charges in Scotland, regardless of RK's residency.
    • Herzlos
    • By Herzlos 13th Oct 15, 12:20 PM
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    Herzlos
    • #9
    • 13th Oct 15, 12:20 PM
    • #9
    • 13th Oct 15, 12:20 PM
    There have been no successful court claims in Scotland against the registered keeper.

    In fact, there have been very few successful claims in Scotland against the (identified) driver, either. Most of the time the parking companies drop it at the last minute.

    They won't touch keepers in Scotland, they definitely won't touch keepers in England. But they won't tell you that, obviously.
    • bazster
    • By bazster 13th Oct 15, 12:35 PM
    • 7,326 Posts
    • 9,448 Thanks
    bazster
    Sorry yes I am resident in England, I was just curious re the legitimacy of the threat of pursuing an RK for interest and court charges in Scotland, regardless of RK's residency.
    Originally posted by kaffenback
    OK, well as I said they haven't a chance. The law in Scotland is what it is, they can't touch the keeper for anything.
    Je suis Charlie.
    • kaffenback
    • By kaffenback 13th Oct 15, 12:37 PM
    • 29 Posts
    • 10 Thanks
    kaffenback
    Cool so it is just a bluff, whilst being careful not to fall foul of the the law in the way that CEL appear to have.

    I await various love letters from Debt Recovery Plus and Zenith
    • bod1467
    • By bod1467 13th Oct 15, 1:59 PM
    • 14,797 Posts
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    bod1467
    When did the first keeper notice arrive? Was it before or after DVLA said they cut UKPC's access to the database?
    • kaffenback
    • By kaffenback 13th Oct 15, 2:01 PM
    • 29 Posts
    • 10 Thanks
    kaffenback
    When did the first keeper notice arrive? Was it before or after DVLA said they cut UKPC's access to the database?
    Originally posted by bod1467
    Beginning of August, i.e. well before
    • Umkomaas
    • By Umkomaas 13th Oct 15, 5:28 PM
    • 15,495 Posts
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    Umkomaas
    The only court in which UKPC is likely to make an appearance in the near future is the High Court.

    Stop worrying about them - even if it were possible, this is all too close for comfort to their admitted fraudulent activity they have been conducting for them to be going to a court and trying to hold the moral high ground!
    We cannot provide you with a silver bullet to get you out of this. You have to be in for the long run, and need to involve yourself in research and work for you to get rid of this. It is not simple. We will help, but can't do it for you.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.
    • kaffenback
    • By kaffenback 10th Jul 17, 7:42 PM
    • 29 Posts
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    kaffenback
    Update: nearly two years since the original parking incident. After getting zero response from me, UKPC and their debt collector henchmen eventually gave up sending love letters in early 2016.
    • beamerguy
    • By beamerguy 10th Jul 17, 8:19 PM
    • 6,340 Posts
    • 8,149 Thanks
    beamerguy
    Update: nearly two years since the original parking incident. After getting zero response from me, UKPC and their debt collector henchmen eventually gave up sending love letters in early 2016.
    Originally posted by kaffenback
    Do not assume it's over, they can claim for up to 5 years in scotland but even
    then, they will struggle
    RBS - MNBA - CAPITAL ONE - LLOYDS

    DISGUSTING BEHAVIOUR
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