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  • FIRST POST
    • AlexLK
    • By AlexLK 8th Mar 15, 11:07 PM
    • 5,634Posts
    • 28,930Thanks
    AlexLK
    Renovations and Repayments.
    • #1
    • 8th Mar 15, 11:07 PM
    Renovations and Repayments. 8th Mar 15 at 11:07 PM
    Hello and welcome to visitors familiar with my journey thus far and are surprised to see me on such a sensible board and a further warm welcome to the new faces wondering what they've let themselves in for.

    Let me begin by clarifying a few points: the first one is I am not sure whether I'm actually serious or not about clearing my mortgage and the second is the fact my house needs quite a bit of work doing to it. This work I do myself and in the time my wife and I have lived in the house we've learnt all kinds of new skills. The current project involves renewing the windows and I am making the frames myself, two are done and I'm pleased to say look great.

    I plan to use this mortgage free (how very grown up) diary to document the renovations and my savings activities, out of which overpayments may or may not be made. However, I am fully committed to long term saving and making as much money as possible. A long term goal of mine is to add to the BTL portfolio I shall one day inherit and am already becoming more involved in which is perhaps a good reason to pay my mortgage off and make my current property into an investment.

    Aside from the recent interest in moneysaving I have a four year old son, run my own company, play and teach the violin and piano whilst studying for my own interest. Oh and don't mention the cars.

    Those familiar with my debt-free diary will know I'm not exactly great at record keeping but am trying to improve, so please don't expect the detailed financial updates others seem to put on here. To kick things off, I suppose I ought to confess the mortgage debt is a total of circa £185,000 and I have no real timescale or plan in mind to pay it off.

    Sorry if this is not a particularly articulate introduction, as I seem to be at a loss how to tailor it to both those who've read my debt free diary and to new readers frequenting mortgage free.
    Savings 2017: £2000. Overpayments 2017: £500.
    Saved £11,000 in 2015, £9,800 in 2016.
    From £32,000 in debt on 2/9/2013 to debt free on 12/1/2015.
Page 137
    • AlexLK
    • By AlexLK 10th Mar 17, 10:26 PM
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    AlexLK
    It is lovely to see you so positive Alex, long may it continue.

    Have a wonderful weekend with your wife and son.

    Take care.
    Originally posted by kelpie35
    Thank you.

    Not trying to put a dampner on any of your future plans but this is a thread that might interest you
    http://s.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5615153
    Originally posted by -taff
    Thanks, Taff.

    I've heard a lot of teaching horror stories. However, one thing I have promised myself is if it begins to adversely affect my mental health or leaves me with no time for my family, I will leave. I've left one career before and wouldn't be afraid to do it again.

    If I don't try it, I will never know. From the teaching I do, I am starting to realise that I can only have a limited amount of influence over pupils' educational outcomes; I can provide them with the tools but it is their choice as to whether they use them. That does not mean I won't do what I can but the days of spending a lot of money on pupils and time I do not have are over because there are only so many hours in one day and with a class of up to 30 pupils, I realise I could be in a position that I would be spending no time with my family. If I apply for a role in teaching after the training year and the school doesn't like the fact that there are things in my life that come before a career, I will move on.

    On another note, I was surprised to see two ex-engineers commenting on the thread.

    Hooray!

    All three of these are fantastic, really pleased for you.
    Originally posted by Red-Squirrel
    Thank you.
    Savings 2017: £2000. Overpayments 2017: £500.
    Saved £11,000 in 2015, £9,800 in 2016.
    From £32,000 in debt on 2/9/2013 to debt free on 12/1/2015.
    • AlexLK
    • By AlexLK 10th Mar 17, 10:37 PM
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    AlexLK
    And it has not put her off...
    Originally posted by Suffolk lass
    I think careers are something the individual needs to make their own mind up about, to be honest and the OP of that thread likely realises so.

    I found your response quite intriguing. My wife is a Structural Engineer and loves her job, though sometimes she wishes that she'd learnt to speak German at uni as she thinks the grass is rather greener over there for engineers.

    Just a heads up really.
    If stress is a factor in any mental health, it's as well to know beforehand this could be a posibility than after.
    Originally posted by -taff
    Thank you, Taff.

    I have done a lot of research but thank you for thinking of me.

    A teacher friend of mine has found her love of the profession again after dropping to two days a week and no extra responsibilities, just teaching. Full time with additional stuff on her plate, it was too much for any human and I did worry for her.

    Now, that's obviously not an option for everybody, but maybe it could be for you Alex? If you carry on doing some work for your parents' business but in a more formal way perhaps with fixed hours, set duties and a sensible wage?
    Originally posted by Red-Squirrel
    The plan (at the moment) is to probably work part time after completing the PGCE if I want to stay in teaching.

    I'm a Director and look after everything myself as my parents want to have a retirement (both worked well past 70, so it is fair, really). It's not really the kind of work to have set hours, duties etc. The wage issue is one I largely put upon myself.
    Savings 2017: £2000. Overpayments 2017: £500.
    Saved £11,000 in 2015, £9,800 in 2016.
    From £32,000 in debt on 2/9/2013 to debt free on 12/1/2015.
    • Red-Squirrel
    • By Red-Squirrel 11th Mar 17, 9:43 AM
    • 849 Posts
    • 1,923 Thanks
    Red-Squirrel

    I'm a Director and look after everything myself as my parents want to have a retirement (both worked well past 70, so it is fair, really). It's not really the kind of work to have set hours, duties etc. The wage issue is one I largely put upon myself.
    Originally posted by AlexLK
    Fair enough, but please remember that this is not an inevitability or compulsory. Your parents could sell or liquidate the business, or employ an unrelated person to be director, if you choose not to be involved. It is a choice, make sure that you're actually choosing it.
    • maman
    • By maman 11th Mar 17, 12:02 PM
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    maman
    I knew it was your intention to teach part time eventually but you might find it difficult (but not impossible) to do the NQT year part time. You may be lucky and find the government has addressed the workload issue by the time you qualify. New Ofsted chief is making some of the right noises.
    • smallholdingsister
    • By smallholdingsister 11th Mar 17, 6:00 PM
    • 3,055 Posts
    • 23,086 Thanks
    smallholdingsister
    My ex got one a while after we'd split up amicably and very proudly showed it to me - all I could think at the time was 'I wish I had a large magnet right now!'
    Originally posted by cazmanian_minx
    Brilliant.

    Why do they call it that?
    • cazmanian_minx
    • By cazmanian_minx 11th Mar 17, 9:46 PM
    • 3,982 Posts
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    cazmanian_minx
    Brilliant.

    Why do they call it that?
    Originally posted by smallholdingsister
    Because Prince Albert was reputed to have one for the purposes of strapping things down so he didn't have an unseemly bulge in the very flat-fronted tight white trousers he preferred to wear - which I think is about the most delicate way I can phrase that!!!
    Home: 06/08: £145,145.00 Currently: £114,855.17 Offset: £21,892.05 Amount paid off: £30,289.83 (20.7%) Paying interest on: £92,963.12
    Holiday let:
    02/17: £177,416.86 (Family loan: £129,146.86 + 0% cards £48,270.00) Currently: £176,206.86 Amount paid off: £1,210.00 (0.68%)
    Sugar days 2017: 10/26 Debt-free: 17/02/2017
    • AlexLK
    • By AlexLK 11th Mar 17, 9:57 PM
    • 5,634 Posts
    • 28,930 Thanks
    AlexLK
    March Targets:

    Total Grocery Spend: £92/>£450.
    Surplus Money: £0/£750.
    Going to bed at a reasonable time: 11/31.
    Meditation: 11/31. Only doing the one minute meditation as and when at the moment.
    One new recipe per week: 2/4.
    Read three books: 0/3. Not doing well with this.
    3 Things for Sunday (Same as yesterday's unsuccessful attempt : 1. Spend an hour doing something relaxing, 2. Find three things to smile about, 3. Try another youtube meditation.

    3 Things for Saturday: 1. Spend an hour doing something relaxing, 2. Find three things to smile about, 1. The cars are clean, 2. Had a nice drive out, 3. Son predicted (correctly) that the MGB would be quicker up the hill than the GT6. (Wife was in the GT6 and insists it needs setting up). 4. The GT6 has been out for the first time this year. 3. Try another youtube meditation.Not had chance to think let alone meditate for more than the one minute one.

    Fair enough, but please remember that this is not an inevitability or compulsory. Your parents could sell or liquidate the business, or employ an unrelated person to be director, if you choose not to be involved. It is a choice, make sure that you're actually choosing it.
    Originally posted by Red-Squirrel
    Thanks, Red Squirrel.

    I knew it was your intention to teach part time eventually but you might find it difficult (but not impossible) to do the NQT year part time. You may be lucky and find the government has addressed the workload issue by the time you qualify. New Ofsted chief is making some of the right noises.
    Originally posted by maman
    At the moment I know nothing other than I'm giving the course a go from September. I imagine I'll know if I'm interested in working full / part time for a school by this time next year and will perhaps start applying for some jobs at around this time to start the 2018/19 Michaelmas term. Whilst I have speculated about potential work beyond the coming course, I don't really know to what extent I wish to be involved with teaching. It seems expected I will get a job. Even during interviews for the course, I was asked about my stickability in the career. Fairly sure my honest answer stating I am serious about the course and if I enjoy that serious about some kind of post but I cannot stay that I will be teaching forever and nor, honestly, can anyone else at this stage was one of the reasons one course rejected my application post-interview. Not sure how anyone at this stage knows they will stay in teaching long-term; surely the PGCE year is as much to work out if teaching is something the student wants to do as it is to be trained to be able to do the job?

    I read an article re. some of the points the new Ofsted chief has made, seemed like a lot of sense.

    Brilliant.

    Why do they call it that?
    Originally posted by smallholdingsister
    Legend has it that Prince Albert had one.

    How do I know this? Schooldays.
    Savings 2017: £2000. Overpayments 2017: £500.
    Saved £11,000 in 2015, £9,800 in 2016.
    From £32,000 in debt on 2/9/2013 to debt free on 12/1/2015.
    • Suffolk lass
    • By Suffolk lass 12th Mar 17, 10:47 AM
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    Suffolk lass
    PGCE and NQT are the opportunity to lay down the bedrock of your lesson planning. You can then tweak and adapt that firm foundation to deal with different scenarios and will be clear what your objectives are and how to achieve them for each lesson.

    How do I know this as a non-teacher? I did my degree at a College where many of my fellow students were doing their B-Ed degrees and the tutors always hammered home the teaching points at the end of every class, for their benefit. And I am married to a mid-career convert to teaching. Only when the curriculum, criteria or exam board changes is there a wholesale re-plan, from what I see.
    MFiT T4 #2 update 25.95% after Q5
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    • maman
    • By maman 12th Mar 17, 10:58 AM
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    maman
    Only when the curriculum, criteria or exam board changes is there a wholesale re-plan, from what I see.
    Originally posted by Suffolk lass

    So that'll be most years then!
    • AlexLK
    • By AlexLK 12th Mar 17, 10:57 PM
    • 5,634 Posts
    • 28,930 Thanks
    AlexLK
    March Targets:

    Total Grocery Spend: £125/>£450.
    Surplus Money: £0/£750.
    Going to bed at a reasonable time: 12/31.
    Meditation: 12/31. Only doing the one minute meditation as and when at the moment.
    One new recipe per week: 2/4.
    Read three books: 0/3. Not doing well with this.
    3 Things for Monday: 1. Get up and ready for school / work without rushing around, 2. Find three things to smile about, 3. Try another youtube meditation (determined to do this at some point) .

    3 Things for Sunday: 1. Spend an hour doing something relaxing Didn't really happen. Did get a lot of car jobs done and I did sit down in front of the TV for 45 minutes with a cup of tea. Standards are slipping. , 2. Find three things to smile about, 1. Lots of car jobs done, 2. Things are going well with my marriage, 3. Son, wife, dog and I had a nice walk. 3. Try another youtube meditation. Still not done this.

    Struggling with the weekends being ridiculously busy at the moment and not getting any time to relax at all. We try to fit too much into the weekends but cannot move some of the things we do at the weekend into the week as my wife is at work and son at school.

    PGCE and NQT are the opportunity to lay down the bedrock of your lesson planning. You can then tweak and adapt that firm foundation to deal with different scenarios and will be clear what your objectives are and how to achieve them for each lesson.

    How do I know this as a non-teacher? I did my degree at a College where many of my fellow students were doing their B-Ed degrees and the tutors always hammered home the teaching points at the end of every class, for their benefit. And I am married to a mid-career convert to teaching. Only when the curriculum, criteria or exam board changes is there a wholesale re-plan, from what I see.
    Originally posted by Suffolk lass
    So that'll be most years then!
    Originally posted by maman
    Absolutely understand this is one of the objectives of PGCE / NQT, if not the bedrock of planning then the bedrock of practice. However, surely the main part of the PGCE year is working out if you want a teaching job? Am I missing something here?
    Savings 2017: £2000. Overpayments 2017: £500.
    Saved £11,000 in 2015, £9,800 in 2016.
    From £32,000 in debt on 2/9/2013 to debt free on 12/1/2015.
    • maman
    • By maman 13th Mar 17, 11:00 AM
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    • 95,358 Thanks
    maman
    Absolutely understand this is one of the objectives of PGCE / NQT, if not the bedrock of planning then the bedrock of practice. However, surely the main part of the PGCE year is working out if you want a teaching job? Am I missing something here?
    Originally posted by AlexLK

    I'd like to think the majority of students who start on PGCE (or any other route into teaching other than Teach First) have decided that teaching is something they can see themselves doing. If that wasn't the case then they'd be using their degree to do some other sort of graduate job or further training. Of course if the school experience during the year convinces you it's not for you then it's better to pull out then than further down the line.


    As a mature student, you're a bit different from many as you're looking for a career change. This can happen with parents who volunteer and sometimes go on to become paid teaching assistants before deciding to train as teachers.


    You are in a position financially to be able to 'suck it and see', many graduates (particularly recent ones) aren't so fortunate so a further year of fees and not earning isn't something they'd commit to unless they were confident it was a job they wanted to go into at least for a few years.
    • Red-Squirrel
    • By Red-Squirrel 13th Mar 17, 12:56 PM
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    Red-Squirrel
    However, surely the main part of the PGCE year is working out if you want a teaching job? Am I missing something here?
    by AlexLK
    I think you are Alex but it's not your fault, it's just the perspective you're coming from which is different to most potential PGCE entrants.

    Most of them can't afford to spend a year just trying something out like that, and they don't have the same level of 'fallback' that you do. Most people, if they are not completely sure they want to teach, will do as you've done, they'll volunteer, they'll tutor etc. but they will generally have made a firm decision before applying for the course that they do intend to teach afterwards.

    It's the same in my profession, nobody does a nursing degree to work out if they want to work in nursing! The tutors will expect you to be committed to teaching from day one, I expect, especially if it's a competitive course and they will have turned away other enthusiastic, dedicated applicants.

    That's not to say it's wrong to drop out if it turns out it's not for you, of course, just trying to explain why others might be a bit taken aback by your approach.
    • AlexLK
    • By AlexLK 13th Mar 17, 7:13 PM
    • 5,634 Posts
    • 28,930 Thanks
    AlexLK
    I'd like to think the majority of students who start on PGCE (or any other route into teaching other than Teach First) have decided that teaching is something they can see themselves doing. If that wasn't the case then they'd be using their degree to do some other sort of graduate job or further training. Of course if the school experience during the year convinces you it's not for you then it's better to pull out then than further down the line.

    As a mature student, you're a bit different from many as you're looking for a career change. This can happen with parents who volunteer and sometimes go on to become paid teaching assistants before deciding to train as teachers.

    You are in a position financially to be able to 'suck it and see', many graduates (particularly recent ones) aren't so fortunate so a further year of fees and not earning isn't something they'd commit to unless they were confident it was a job they wanted to go into at least for a few years.
    Originally posted by maman
    I think you are Alex but it's not your fault, it's just the perspective you're coming from which is different to most potential PGCE entrants.

    Most of them can't afford to spend a year just trying something out like that, and they don't have the same level of 'fallback' that you do. Most people, if they are not completely sure they want to teach, will do as you've done, they'll volunteer, they'll tutor etc. but they will generally have made a firm decision before applying for the course that they do intend to teach afterwards.

    It's the same in my profession, nobody does a nursing degree to work out if they want to work in nursing! The tutors will expect you to be committed to teaching from day one, I expect, especially if it's a competitive course and they will have turned away other enthusiastic, dedicated applicants.

    That's not to say it's wrong to drop out if it turns out it's not for you, of course, just trying to explain why others might be a bit taken aback by your approach.
    Originally posted by Red-Squirrel

    I can see myself becoming a teacher and am very committed to the year ahead (have already done a lot of prep work and am continuing to read, teach music, volunteer and be involved in school life). However, surely until trying (as I've already been told on here none of the things I've done so far can really compare) no one really knows if it is for them? My wife thinks I often appear to others in a manner that makes them think I'm trying things to amuse myself and not because I'm serious. I will be somewhat disappointed if I spend the £9,250 on fees and do not wish to enter the profession. Though I'm sure I will have learnt lots and also be in a more informed position regarding my son's education.

    There's not a chance I'm going to be damaging my relationship with my son or my mental health to teach, though. I have recently read a lot of very negative reports which have started to make me wonder if it is the right thing to do. Any expectation of the sort of hours that I used to work and I don't think it will be for me, to be honest.
    Savings 2017: £2000. Overpayments 2017: £500.
    Saved £11,000 in 2015, £9,800 in 2016.
    From £32,000 in debt on 2/9/2013 to debt free on 12/1/2015.
    • hiddenshadow
    • By hiddenshadow 13th Mar 17, 9:45 PM
    • 2,091 Posts
    • 9,255 Thanks
    hiddenshadow
    However, surely until trying (as I've already been told on here none of the things I've done so far can really compare) no one really knows if it is for them? My wife thinks I often appear to others in a manner that makes them think I'm trying things to amuse myself and not because I'm serious. I will be somewhat disappointed if I spend the £9,250 on fees and do not wish to enter the profession. Though I'm sure I will have learnt lots and also be in a more informed position regarding my son's education.
    Originally posted by AlexLK
    I think the point people were trying to make above is that while your logic makes sense and is completely appropriate for your own life, the "usual" PCGE student is more along the lines of: (massively generalising here)
    ...graduated uni, can't get a job, try teaching... (or)
    ...graduated uni, love teaching, jump straight into it...
    either way, post-course is
    ...need to make this teaching thing work because what do I do with my life post-teaching if it doesn't?...(and/or)
    ...oh man I now owe ££,£££+ in debt from taking that year to do this course, must get a teaching job ASAP to pay the bills and get rid of that debt...(and/or)
    ...love teaching, lifetime career, yay!...

    So yes, no one really knows if something is suitable for them until they try it, but most people don't have any other choice but to follow through with the direction they've chosen (at least for a few years to build up their CV and move out of teaching). You have the flexibility (and luxury) to know that you will only work part-time, you could spend £9,250 and a year of your life and chalk it up to an interesting experience/learning opportunity.

    No one's saying you're not approaching it seriously, or seriously intending to teach afterwards, but you are in a rather unique position compared to the average teaching student, your opportunity cost for doing the course is much lower and you have a lot more options available to you at the end of it.
    MFW: Dec '13 £197,100 / Dec '14 £180,691 / Dec '15 £161,669 / Dec '16 £119,669 / May '17 £105,084.91 (£6,000 offset)
    Payment 40/84 / 2017 MFW #56: £14,583/£20,000 72% / MFiT-T4 #15: £54,415/£90,000 60%
    • Dansmam
    • By Dansmam 13th Mar 17, 10:19 PM
    • 508 Posts
    • 1,742 Thanks
    Dansmam
    I think the point people were trying to make above is that while your logic makes sense and is completely appropriate for your own life, the "usual" PCGE student is more along the lines of: (massively generalising here)
    ...graduated uni, can't get a job, try teaching... (or)
    ...graduated uni, love teaching, jump straight into it...
    either way, post-course is
    ...need to make this teaching thing work because what do I do with my life post-teaching if it doesn't?...(and/or)
    ...oh man I now owe ££,£££+ in debt from taking that year to do this course, must get a teaching job ASAP to pay the bills and get rid of that debt...(and/or)
    ...love teaching, lifetime career, yay!...

    So yes, no one really knows if something is suitable for them until they try it, but most people don't have any other choice but to follow through with the direction they've chosen (at least for a few years to build up their CV and move out of teaching). You have the flexibility (and luxury) to know that you will only work part-time, you could spend £9,250 and a year of your life and chalk it up to an interesting experience/learning opportunity.

    No one's saying you're not approaching it seriously, or seriously intending to teach afterwards, but you are in a rather unique position compared to the average teaching student, your opportunity cost for doing the course is much lower and you have a lot more options available to you at the end of it.
    Originally posted by hiddenshadow
    Alex hope you don't mind me commenting but I'm finding this really interesting because your attitude to trying out teaching and the explanations on here about how other trainee teachers are likely to be thinking point to a phenomenon I've worried about for a while. It's all about feeling secure enough to fail and I think you may be surprised to find that's how you are approaching this. Logically you are (cough) a bit older than your average graduate looking for a way in life. So logically they have more time to try it for size, decide not for them and move on to find another way to pay off the fees. But there aren't many people who know they can clear debt the way you did through your business and then move on to other interests and passions- thinking music, teaching, managing your folks business, plus of course mrs k and little k here. You have talent and ability and what flummoxes me is why other talented able people wouldn't happily take the risk of trying out a year's pgce on the basis they'll just walk on if they find it's not for them.
    There's a thing called a poverty mentality that stops people taking chances. I've followed your story and your parents have pulled you down in many ways (due to their own struggles and regrets it seems to me) but they've not stopped you believing you can try out new things and survive whether or not they work out for you. That says a lot about you, and a bit about how you've learned resilience which is a lot of you and also partly from them I guess. The rest I think probably comes from you and mrs K learning people can think differently while being great people who can get along fine. So it's complicated. Sorry, that went on a bit. Wishing you joy and fun times even if you decide you're not a teacher at heart (though suspect you may be)
    Last edited by Dansmam; 13-03-2017 at 11:45 PM.
    • misscousinitt
    • By misscousinitt 14th Mar 17, 2:49 PM
    • 3,513 Posts
    • 20,163 Thanks
    misscousinitt
    Thank you Dansman for mentioning the Poverty Mentality thing - it's very interesting...

    MCI
    Mortgage Free x 1 03.11.2012 - House rented out Feb 2016
    Mortgage No 2: £95843.15 (09.05.2017)
    OP's to Date £3500

    Renovation Fund:£944.75; Kitchen Fund (including re-wiring): £notalotleft; Roof Fund £0 - all done
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    • AlexLK
    • By AlexLK 14th Mar 17, 5:50 PM
    • 5,634 Posts
    • 28,930 Thanks
    AlexLK
    March Targets:

    Total Grocery Spend: £155/>£450.
    Surplus Money: £0/£750. Mrs K and I need to discuss.
    Going to bed at a reasonable time: 12/31. Last night was a disaster.
    Meditation: 12/31. Only doing the one minute meditation as and when at the moment.
    One new recipe per week: 2/4.
    Read three books: 0/3. Not doing well with this.
    3 Things for Wednesday: 1. Get up and ready for school / work without rushing around, 2. Find three things to smile about, 3. Try another youtube meditation (determined to do this at some point). Same as Monday as I've not really got anywhere with any of the targets as I've been really busy. Plus, I need to send some documents.

    I think the point people were trying to make above is that while your logic makes sense and is completely appropriate for your own life, the "usual" PCGE student is more along the lines of: (massively generalising here)
    ...graduated uni, can't get a job, try teaching... (or)
    ...graduated uni, love teaching, jump straight into it...
    either way, post-course is
    ...need to make this teaching thing work because what do I do with my life post-teaching if it doesn't?...(and/or)
    ...oh man I now owe ££,£££+ in debt from taking that year to do this course, must get a teaching job ASAP to pay the bills and get rid of that debt...(and/or)
    ...love teaching, lifetime career, yay!...

    So yes, no one really knows if something is suitable for them until they try it, but most people don't have any other choice but to follow through with the direction they've chosen (at least for a few years to build up their CV and move out of teaching). You have the flexibility (and luxury) to know that you will only work part-time, you could spend £9,250 and a year of your life and chalk it up to an interesting experience/learning opportunity.

    No one's saying you're not approaching it seriously, or seriously intending to teach afterwards, but you are in a rather unique position compared to the average teaching student, your opportunity cost for doing the course is much lower and you have a lot more options available to you at the end of it.
    Originally posted by hiddenshadow
    Thanks, HS. I hadn't really considered others viewing in that way. Don't think it's really very good for someone's own mental health to NEED to teach even if they don't want to. I also think it wouldn't be good for the class and school either.

    Alex hope you don't mind me commenting but I'm finding this really interesting because your attitude to trying out teaching and the explanations on here about how other trainee teachers are likely to be thinking point to a phenomenon I've worried about for a while. It's all about feeling secure enough to fail and I think you may be surprised to find that's how you are approaching this. Logically you are (cough) a bit older than your average graduate looking for a way in life. So logically they have more time to try it for size, decide not for them and move on to find another way to pay off the fees. But there aren't many people who know they can clear debt the way you did through your business and then move on to other interests and passions- thinking music, teaching, managing your folks business, plus of course mrs k and little k here. You have talent and ability and what flummoxes me is why other talented able people wouldn't happily take the risk of trying out a year's pgce on the basis they'll just walk on if they find it's not for them.
    There's a thing called a poverty mentality that stops people taking chances. I've followed your story and your parents have pulled you down in many ways (due to their own struggles and regrets it seems to me) but they've not stopped you believing you can try out new things and survive whether or not they work out for you. That says a lot about you, and a bit about how you've learned resilience which is a lot of you and also partly from them I guess. The rest I think probably comes from you and mrs K learning people can think differently while being great people who can get along fine. So it's complicated. Sorry, that went on a bit. Wishing you joy and fun times even if you decide you're not a teacher at heart (though suspect you may be)
    Originally posted by Dansmam
    I don't really see not gaining a new career from the PGCE a failure, to be honest. If I do, it will be because I particularly want a career in teaching. At the moment, I think I do to some extent but cannot be sure until I've tried as I understand I can only gain so much of an idea from volunteering etc.

    I did think I'd be the oldest one applying but that wasn't the case. As for the fees, I won't be getting into any sort of debt to pay them, though I think the savings / overpayments are going to be very low that year.

    Trying things is not an issue for me, I'll try most things if I have an interest / curiosity.

    My parents are pleased about the coming year ahead for me. I think they see it as a sign that my mental health is getting better. However, they are somewhat annoyed I won't be able to cook lunch and dinner for them in term time. Funny you should mention my parents; father is coming into sports car boy's school tomorrow to talk about the old days. The current topic is related and I happened to say that I know just the person who'd be delighted to come in to talk about life in the old days, so my father and I have been working on this. We're going to take in quite a few items from the 30's-70's that some of the children may not have seen (I get the collecting from my parents ) and have put together a book of photos / newsclippings to pass around and a set of music that would have been popular. Father is really looking forward to speaking to someone other than I about the old days tomorrow.

    Thank you Dansman for mentioning the Poverty Mentality thing - it's very interesting...

    MCI
    Originally posted by misscousinitt
    Not heard of poverty mentality before, I will have a look into what it is.
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    • edinburgher
    • By edinburgher 14th Mar 17, 5:55 PM
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    edinburgher
    My stepfather (aka Dad) retrained as a teacher just a few years before our current ages Alex. Not only was he the oldest student, but he was the only man. 25 years later and he's a highly regarded headmaster. I'm sure he had his doubts, his first job was in a legal firm!
    • hiddenshadow
    • By hiddenshadow 14th Mar 17, 10:07 PM
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    hiddenshadow
    Don't think it's really very good for someone's own mental health to NEED to teach even if they don't want to. I also think it wouldn't be good for the class and school either.
    Originally posted by AlexLK
    Hopefully (usually?) it's more "better make the best of this, because this is the way it is for now". Though there are a lot of people who just view work as something to be endured, not something to enjoy necessarily. Certainly I think it's a development of the last century or so to be able to seek out something you enjoy doing, rather than having to work the factory/mine/wherever just to put food on the table.

    Hope the day at school with your dad goes well, sounds like it's right up his alley.
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    • AlexLK
    • By AlexLK 14th Mar 17, 11:16 PM
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    AlexLK
    My stepfather (aka Dad) retrained as a teacher just a few years before our current ages Alex. Not only was he the oldest student, but he was the only man. 25 years later and he's a highly regarded headmaster. I'm sure he had his doubts, his first job was in a legal firm!
    Originally posted by edinburgher
    Snap! I trained as a solicitor after completing my MA in Music. Kind of fell into that as a now ex-schoolfriend's father was a partner and my parents refused to fund a PhD after I wasted a large amount of money that should have more than funded it.

    I suppose I already know the course is going to be dominated by 21 year old girls (I'm training in primary).

    I greatly enjoy the work I do in schools as well as teaching music pupils and my own son. Therefore, I am hoping this will become a fulfilling career for the long term.

    Hopefully (usually?) it's more "better make the best of this, because this is the way it is for now". Though there are a lot of people who just view work as something to be endured, not something to enjoy necessarily. Certainly I think it's a development of the last century or so to be able to seek out something you enjoy doing, rather than having to work the factory/mine/wherever just to put food on the table.

    Hope the day at school with your dad goes well, sounds like it's right up his alley.
    Originally posted by hiddenshadow
    I think you're likely right re. work. I see it as something to occupy myself as my son is now at school himself and will start to want an independent life of his own as he grows. My wife is out for c.12 hours everyday and my directorship is not particularly consuming or fulfilling. I want to have a purpose to get up in the morning.

    Father will be on his best behaviour, I'm sure! Already he's thanked me for the opportunity to talk to others about the old days and has made me promise to invite him to speak about the old days to a class of my own one day if his health doesn't deteriorate. He has a lot of respect for teachers.
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