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    • zeupater
    • By zeupater 21st Jul 13, 5:35 PM
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    zeupater
    Discussion ... ASHP(Air/Air) with Solar pv ....
    • #1
    • 21st Jul 13, 5:35 PM
    Discussion ... ASHP(Air/Air) with Solar pv .... 21st Jul 13 at 5:35 PM
    Hi All

    The combination of a small ASHP(Air/Air) with Solar pv seems to be a valid pairing of complementary technologies which has been raised a number of times on this forum.

    The idea of this thread is to encourage discussion of this combination in order to validate what an appropriate equipment specification would look like in order to maximise performance benefits in a typical domestic environment.

    Obviously, it is well understood that a typical domestic-scale solar pv system will not generate sufficient energy to provide winter heating, but should be considered as being a 'shoulder' months supplementary heat source for well insulated properties ... it is therefore best to concentrate on Spring & Autumn as being the target periods for heat provision, with an additional benefit of provision of cooling in heat-wave conditions such as we've been experiencing recently.

    HTH
    Z
    "We are what we repeatedly do, excellence then is not an act, but a habit. " ...... Aristotle
Page 9
    • ASavvyBuyer
    • By ASavvyBuyer 19th Jun 17, 7:31 AM
    • 554 Posts
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    ASavvyBuyer
    Hi

    Same here, had our running at 22C for a few hours and most of the time we were still exporting ~90% of generation.

    HTH
    Z
    Originally posted by zeupater
    Same here, running at 22C for the last two days (during the day) and still exporting loads as it hardly uses any power when cooling
    Rhondda Cynon Taf, 4kWp, W roof, 30° pitch, 16 x 8.33 Eternity 250w E+10 panels, Solar Edge SE4000-16A Inverter + P300 Optimisers & REUK Diverter
    + Toshiba RAS-10G2KVP-E Ultra High Efficiency Air Conditioner/Heat Pump
    • Exiled Tyke
    • By Exiled Tyke 19th Jun 17, 11:20 AM
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    Exiled Tyke
    OK I'm getting a little further ('though obviously will miss the heatwave). Does anybody have any experience/views of the LG Libero range? I can't see them mentioned here but they seem to fit the bill i.e. reasonably priced and extremely controllable.

    Thanks
    Install 28th Nov 15, 3.3kW, (11x300LG), SolarEdge, SW. W Yorks.
    • Martyn1981
    • By Martyn1981 19th Jun 17, 1:36 PM
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    Martyn1981
    OK I'm getting a little further ('though obviously will miss the heatwave). Does anybody have any experience/views of the LG Libero range? I can't see them mentioned here but they seem to fit the bill i.e. reasonably priced and extremely controllable.

    Thanks
    Originally posted by Exiled Tyke
    Not the most efficient, but that's what I have, the 3.5kW model, very cheap, very quiet.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
    • ASavvyBuyer
    • By ASavvyBuyer 22nd Jun 17, 10:28 AM
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    ASavvyBuyer
    The recent heatwave has reminded us of your comment when we were considering getting an air conditioner/heat pump.
    Your missing one major point.....how much is a good nights sleep worth when we get a heatwave(uncommon I know)?
    There's been a good few days this year I've had the aircon on all day(for free) and had to get under the duvet at night to keep warm while all the neighbours have their windows wide open trying to keep cool...for me...that's priceless
    Originally posted by tunnel
    For the last few days we have had the aircon on all day at 22C cooling the lounge, but also with the internal doors open, the rest of the bungalow. It has worked a treat; and all using solar generated power
    Last edited by ASavvyBuyer; 22-06-2017 at 10:29 AM. Reason: typo
    Rhondda Cynon Taf, 4kWp, W roof, 30° pitch, 16 x 8.33 Eternity 250w E+10 panels, Solar Edge SE4000-16A Inverter + P300 Optimisers & REUK Diverter
    + Toshiba RAS-10G2KVP-E Ultra High Efficiency Air Conditioner/Heat Pump
    • Martyn1981
    • By Martyn1981 30th Jul 17, 4:20 PM
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    Martyn1981
    As this thread is about the small scale use of solar and heat pumps, I thought, just for a laugh, I'd point to the more extreme end to show just what is possible:-

    Study: Solar Heating Could Provide More Than 80% Of Heating Energy For Households In Finland
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
    • ASavvyBuyer
    • By ASavvyBuyer 7th Aug 17, 11:07 AM
    • 554 Posts
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    ASavvyBuyer
    Recently had a questionaire from E.on about them potentially providing Air Heat Pumps. Proposed cost was between £5k - £9k fully installed, to save approximately £100/year on energy costs!

    So even based on the lowest cost, it would take 50 years to pay for itself, not allowing for inflation or loss of interest.
    Rhondda Cynon Taf, 4kWp, W roof, 30° pitch, 16 x 8.33 Eternity 250w E+10 panels, Solar Edge SE4000-16A Inverter + P300 Optimisers & REUK Diverter
    + Toshiba RAS-10G2KVP-E Ultra High Efficiency Air Conditioner/Heat Pump
    • zeupater
    • By zeupater 7th Aug 17, 4:09 PM
    • 3,761 Posts
    • 4,652 Thanks
    zeupater
    Recently had a questionaire from E.on about them potentially providing Air Heat Pumps. Proposed cost was between £5k - £9k fully installed, to save approximately £100/year on energy costs!

    So even based on the lowest cost, it would take 50 years to pay for itself, not allowing for inflation or loss of interest.
    Originally posted by ASavvyBuyer
    Hi

    Perhaps the E.ON representative (malc) could feed back information to management on how ridiculous their option is to a sane person! ...

    HTH
    Z
    Last edited by zeupater; 07-08-2017 at 4:52 PM. Reason: -same +sane
    "We are what we repeatedly do, excellence then is not an act, but a habit. " ...... Aristotle
    • Martyn1981
    • By Martyn1981 14th Sep 17, 10:43 AM
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    Martyn1981
    Little bit of ASHP today, almost all PV supplied. Cool.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
    • ASavvyBuyer
    • By ASavvyBuyer 14th Sep 17, 11:44 AM
    • 554 Posts
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    ASavvyBuyer
    Little bit of ASHP today, almost all PV supplied. Cool.
    Originally posted by Martyn1981
    Don't you mean "Warm"

    Had ours on a few times recently when its been a bit cool; all PV supplied and very quick to take the chill of the room.
    Rhondda Cynon Taf, 4kWp, W roof, 30° pitch, 16 x 8.33 Eternity 250w E+10 panels, Solar Edge SE4000-16A Inverter + P300 Optimisers & REUK Diverter
    + Toshiba RAS-10G2KVP-E Ultra High Efficiency Air Conditioner/Heat Pump
    • zeupater
    • By zeupater 14th Sep 17, 12:29 PM
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    zeupater
    ..Had ours on a few times recently when its been a bit cool; all PV supplied and very quick to take the chill of the room.
    Originally posted by ASavvyBuyer
    Hi

    Same here, but I've decided to open up all of the internal doors and assist the solar gain to charge-up the house as a thermal mass store today ... same as you, all on PV ...

    HTH
    Z
    "We are what we repeatedly do, excellence then is not an act, but a habit. " ...... Aristotle
    • ASavvyBuyer
    • By ASavvyBuyer 14th Sep 17, 2:15 PM
    • 554 Posts
    • 1,438 Thanks
    ASavvyBuyer
    Hi

    Same here, but I've decided to open up all of the internal doors and assist the solar gain to charge-up the house as a thermal mass store today ... same as you, all on PV ...

    HTH
    Z
    Originally posted by zeupater
    Same again here, all internal doors open, so the warm air is flowing to all the other rooms. We also have solid internal walls (and cavity filled external walls), so they also act as a thermal mass store retaining and then releasing the heat in the evening when the sun goes down.
    Rhondda Cynon Taf, 4kWp, W roof, 30° pitch, 16 x 8.33 Eternity 250w E+10 panels, Solar Edge SE4000-16A Inverter + P300 Optimisers & REUK Diverter
    + Toshiba RAS-10G2KVP-E Ultra High Efficiency Air Conditioner/Heat Pump
    • zeupater
    • By zeupater 14th Sep 17, 3:19 PM
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    zeupater
    Hi

    Currently ~3kW of heating, boiling the kettle, watching TV, laptop charging, solar thermal pump doing it's thing, all baseload covered ... and we're still exporting well over 1kW to the grid ...

    HTH
    Z
    "We are what we repeatedly do, excellence then is not an act, but a habit. " ...... Aristotle
    • Martyn1981
    • By Martyn1981 14th Sep 17, 5:43 PM
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    Martyn1981
    Fully Charged has just released part 2 of their Orkney Island visit, so far they've covered the use of hydrogen storage for excess generation and the building of 'better' homes.

    Gas and now oil are not options, so they are using heat pumps. Combination of build quality and about £200 savings from PV, leave them with annual energy bills of £600pa which I didn't think was bad given the location, all electric and that they were 3 bed semi's.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
    • Martyn1981
    • By Martyn1981 1st Oct 17, 6:25 PM
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    Martyn1981
    The best laid plans of Mice and Men
    So, all's going well, October arrives, and Mart thinks, time to play with the ASHP. Typical generation is 220-250kWh, so probably 100kWh of export to shove through HiPpie, keep the GCH down, and top up that thermal mass. What could possibly go wrong?

    Well, we've got a lodger for the next month, an utterly stunning 19month old guidedog awaiting placement. What could possibly go wrong?

    He's stunning, well behaved and very, very friendly. What could possibly go wrong?

    Then he meets F4 (Flash the ferocious feral feline). He looks at Flash, Flash looks back. He moves towards Flash, Flash bear-charges him to just out of paw range. He thinks this is fun, and leans in closer, Flash appears to move slightly - dog's nose starts bleeding from multiple scratches (not ideal on what is now about £50k worth of doggie). He thinks, this is great fun, barks and charges at Flash ..... many things happen in a very brief time period.

    Now cats are living in conservatory, and doggie is sharing living room. [Come on Z, you've worked it out now haven't you?]

    Yes - crucial to heat distribution, is having the conservatory to living room door wide open!!!!!!!

    Further canine/feline negotiations have been scheduled at the UN, but Trump is keeping them a little busy at the moment.

    In the meantime I've found that laying on the floor watching telly with 30kg of affectionate cuddly Labrador, is surprisingly warm. There's always an upside!
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
    • Martyn1981
    • By Martyn1981 19th Oct 17, 1:35 PM
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    Martyn1981
    I lost the battle today.

    GCH went on this morning for 30 mins.

    Very little generation for a few days now, and also grey cool (not quite cold) weather, so little solar gain too.

    Canine / Feline negotiations went well and non-blood letting distances have been maintained.

    Very, very pleased with the amount of heat we put into the house as storage, I hadn't really calculated that into my thoughts back when this thread started (thanks). Leaving the door wide open and letting HiPpie run worked well to keep warm air going through the house. Plus it's been a very mild October.


    As recommendations go though, I have a new favourite, Labrador heating is even better, though it does tend to lead to falling asleep in front of the telly, but 'chasing rabbits' usually wakes me up at a semi-reasonable time for bed.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
    • ASavvyBuyer
    • By ASavvyBuyer 21st Oct 17, 11:09 AM
    • 554 Posts
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    ASavvyBuyer
    I lost the battle today.

    GCH went on this morning for 30 mins.
    Originally posted by Martyn1981
    Notice that GCH has come on a few times this month, either in the morning or evening to warm the bedroom up when the wireless programmable thermostat has called for heat.

    However, with the heat pump running in the lounge and the internal door opens to circulate the warm air, our gas use is down to a less than a third of what it was last October, at a predicted less than 200kWh for the month and electric use only up by about 20kWh, despite the recent poor PV generation.

    From checking stats for October last year, it has been a bit milder so far this year, but by only a couple of degrees, but there has not been much sun
    Rhondda Cynon Taf, 4kWp, W roof, 30° pitch, 16 x 8.33 Eternity 250w E+10 panels, Solar Edge SE4000-16A Inverter + P300 Optimisers & REUK Diverter
    + Toshiba RAS-10G2KVP-E Ultra High Efficiency Air Conditioner/Heat Pump
    • matty2767
    • By matty2767 25th Oct 17, 4:27 PM
    • 429 Posts
    • 552 Thanks
    matty2767
    Hi guys

    I have read all of this thread - some good stuff in here.

    We are going to have a conservatory built. It will be approx.. 3.6m x 3.6m, A rating glass roof but then pretty much all glass down to a dwarf wall connected to our kitchen.

    I need to decide whether to spend on underfloor heating plus probably an oil filled rad or something else.

    AASHP is intriguing but could I use it stand alone! And would you recommend please? it looks about the same price to install but from what I read, floor heating is expensive to run and we want to have the choice of using the new space all year round.

    We have PV but then pretty much max out on what we use of that with having timers on and the electric car. So a decision would need to be made on running ASHP fully off import.

    Many thanks

    Matt
    • Martyn1981
    • By Martyn1981 8th Nov 17, 3:19 PM
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    Martyn1981
    Got to say I'm loving the ASHP. Absolutely, definitely would have had to put the heating on several times during the day these last two weeks, whereas instead the living room is toasty and lots of heat going into the 'structural mass battery' of the house. Probably 75%+ from PV. Interestingly, dull days with less generation are also warmer, so less heating needed, whereas cold days are sunny. Nice.

    Slightly odd to still be in shorts and t-shirt in Nov, rather than 'big boy' trousers and a fleece top, but the living room is 20.5C to 21C even with the door to hallway wide open, as I'm trying to maximise heating and minimise gas burn.

    Several days barefoot too after getting wet taking the dog for a walk, but he's been matched now with a guide dog owner, so no more Labrador cuddles to keep me warm ... for now.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
    • Martyn1981
    • By Martyn1981 8th Nov 17, 3:25 PM
    • 6,048 Posts
    • 10,126 Thanks
    Martyn1981
    Hi guys

    I have read all of this thread - some good stuff in here.

    We are going to have a conservatory built. It will be approx.. 3.6m x 3.6m, A rating glass roof but then pretty much all glass down to a dwarf wall connected to our kitchen.

    I need to decide whether to spend on underfloor heating plus probably an oil filled rad or something else.

    AASHP is intriguing but could I use it stand alone! And would you recommend please? it looks about the same price to install but from what I read, floor heating is expensive to run and we want to have the choice of using the new space all year round.

    We have PV but then pretty much max out on what we use of that with having timers on and the electric car. So a decision would need to be made on running ASHP fully off import.

    Many thanks

    Matt
    Originally posted by matty2767
    Hiya Matt, not sure I'm well enough informed, but the ASHP suits me well. It's a 3.5kW model and can raise our conservatory* from 10C to 20C in about 20 mins.

    *It's only 2.4m by 2.4m by 2.4m and only one outside wall is glass, plus the DG glass roof.

    If you were pondering location, like myself sometime back for house heating, then I don't think it would work for you due to the losses heating/cooling your proper conservatory, but if you are looking for a way to heat/cool your conservatory anyway, then certainly an easy way to do it, and possibly a way to cool the room, and adjoining room too, if you can block out most of the sun during a heatwave (blinds/curtains).

    It's certainly worth a ponder me thinks, but others on here know far, far more than I.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
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