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Results: Are you currently invested with Vanguard Life Strategy

Yes

47.50% • 304 votes

No

16.41% • 105 votes

No, but I would like to at some point

30.16% • 193 votes

There are better options than Vanguard

5.94% • 38 votes

You may not vote on this poll

640 votes in total.

  • FIRST POST
    • Carpi09
    • By Carpi09 15th Jan 13, 6:37 PM
    • 293Posts
    • 262Thanks
    Carpi09
    Vanguard Life Strategy
    • #1
    • 15th Jan 13, 6:37 PM
    Vanguard Life Strategy 15th Jan 13 at 6:37 PM
    Hello all,

    This thread was created to talk about the Vanguard Life Strategy fund which includes the 20/40/60/80 & 100. Please tell us what you think about the VLS and how you believe it would act as a core within a portfolio.

    Please be aware that investments can go up as well as down so unless you are planning to invest for several years, I don't recommend investing with S&S. From what I know and have researched the ideal time scales each of the LS funds are as follows:

    20: 3-5 years +
    40: 5 years +
    60: 5 years +
    80: 5-8 years +
    100: 10 years +

    These may well not be accurate and are a rough guide. Please be aware, if you are close to retirement or thinking about closing a fund, think about your risk attitude and what you can do in order to lessen the chance of a great fall.

    You can also suggest other funds outside Vanguard that would work well with the VLS in order to evaluate the balance of the portfolio.

    About me, Im 23 and planning early for my future. I intend to hold this fund for 20 years plus so fluctuations are bound to happen. Heavy drops will not effect me because i know values fall aswell as rise. I dont want to fall in to the trap that most people do which is to buy high and sell low because they panic.

    Currently I hold the Vanguard Life Strategy 80% with Hargreaves Lansdown and plan to put 50% of the ISA allowance into it each year. The other 50% will be put into a Cash ISA because I am saving up for a house deposit. Come April, I will be looking at adding other funds because I want more than just a passive approach and while I am still young, I would like to take the risk for greater gains.

    From all the research I have done, the VLS fund is perfect for a beginner because it does everything for you. Depending how the market is doing, it does the rebalancing for you. Having researched for around a month now and taking opinions from people on this board, I believe I have developed knowledge allowing me to move on a little and look for other funds to support the VLS fund. I still believe I am a beginner and will not rush into anything without researching and planning first.

    Please comment, suggest, discuss this fund and what experience you have had this far. Hopefully this thread will give confidence to people who were in the position I was, brand new to S&S and not a clue what anything meant. Taking the time to do a little research will not only improve confidence but improve knowledge too!

    I am sure there are plenty of books to read but one I have read recently is by Tim Hale called Smarter Investing. It is a great read and gives you all the information you need to start investing.

    Good luck!

    This opening post has been edited to give a tad more information and why this thread was created. All replies from other members from the start has been fantastic so thank you.

    MSE Insert:

    If you're new to saving for retirement read our Pension need-to-knows
    Last edited by MSE Andrea; 26-01-2016 at 9:40 AM. Reason: Improve opening post.
Page 79
    • bowlhead99
    • By bowlhead99 25th Sep 17, 9:48 AM
    • 6,741 Posts
    • 12,017 Thanks
    bowlhead99
    My question SHOULD have been given a 20+ time frame with a lad who doesnt really worry about a fund tasnking which in people opinion should provide a better return over the long term VLS OR Vanguard FTSE Global All Cap Index Fund and what is the difference between the VLS and Vanguard FTSE Global All Cap Index Fund
    Originally posted by frenchplonka
    The VLS80 fund you mentioned a few posts ago is 80% equities and the Vanguard Global All Cap Index Fund is 100% equities (and also incorporates some equities in smaller companies).

    Over a long enough timescale you would expect the All Cap Index Fund to have the potential to generate a greater total return, though it has a greater proportion of overseas equities, smaller companies and that combined with the fact that it is fully equity based with no bonds will mean it is likely to be more volatile - perhaps quite a bit more.
    • frenchplonka
    • By frenchplonka 25th Sep 17, 10:13 AM
    • 263 Posts
    • 63 Thanks
    frenchplonka
    The VLS80 fund you mentioned a few posts ago is 80% equities and the Vanguard Global All Cap Index Fund is 100% equities (and also incorporates some equities in smaller companies).

    Over a long enough timescale you would expect the All Cap Index Fund to have the potential to generate a greater total return, though it has a greater proportion of overseas equities, smaller companies and that combined with the fact that it is fully equity based with no bonds will mean it is likely to be more volatile - perhaps quite a bit more.
    Originally posted by bowlhead99
    So in for a bumpy ride however over 20+ this should one hopes recover and have a bigger upside?
    Sealed Pot Challenge 10 - #571
    • bowlhead99
    • By bowlhead99 25th Sep 17, 1:02 PM
    • 6,741 Posts
    • 12,017 Thanks
    bowlhead99
    So in for a bumpy ride however over 20+ this should one hopes recover and have a bigger upside?
    Originally posted by frenchplonka
    Over a fixed period say now to 2037, 2040, 2050, nobody really knows what performance will be achieved. Historically, a 100% equities portfolio has performed better over long time periods than a portfolio which also includes bonds. However, most would prefer mixing in some bonds for a smoother ride without a massive detriment to performance.

    If you select the Global All-Cap fund you will have all your money in equities and in excess of 94% of those equity investments in companies listed on stock exchanges outside the UK.

    That is a significantly higher risk profile than the typical UK investor and if I were told someone had that as their whole portfolio, I'd expect it is either likely to be an experienced investor who has a specific reason for doing so, or or a naive investor who is doing it because he doesn't know much about investing and has bought it by accident having not taken onboard the advice he's received in the last couple of years of posting in this forum. Of those two reasons, if it were you, I would say it was the latter.

    However, you say you have started to put money into the VLS80 and not into the Global All-Cap. That fund allocates more of its capital to larger companies, more 'home bias' in terms of country allocation, and has some bonds too. 80% equities is still higher-risk than the average UK investor would tolerate, but it is likely to be less volatile than the Global All-Cap.
    • copthis1
    • By copthis1 25th Sep 17, 1:24 PM
    • 72 Posts
    • 19 Thanks
    copthis1
    I have £30,000 left to invest in one of these Vanguard funds (Due to some unexpected bills)..... which one?

    I am just 51 and want to invest for between 5 (Unlikely) and 10 years (more likely)

    Which fund VLS60 or 80?
    • AndyT678
    • By AndyT678 25th Sep 17, 1:28 PM
    • 722 Posts
    • 985 Thanks
    AndyT678
    I have £30,000 left to invest in one of these Vanguard funds (Due to some unexpected bills)..... which one?

    I am just 51 and want to invest for between 5 (Unlikely) and 10 years (more likely)

    Which fund VLS60 or 80?
    Originally posted by copthis1
    What is it that you're unlikely to buy in 5 years and more likely to buy in 10 years and how much do you think it will cost when you want to buy it?
    • copthis1
    • By copthis1 25th Sep 17, 1:32 PM
    • 72 Posts
    • 19 Thanks
    copthis1
    What is it that you're unlikely to buy in 5 years and more likely to buy in 10 years and how much do you think it will cost when you want to buy it?
    Originally posted by AndyT678
    Ignore the five year bit......Assume I will invest for 10 years(ish)
    • bowlhead99
    • By bowlhead99 25th Sep 17, 1:34 PM
    • 6,741 Posts
    • 12,017 Thanks
    bowlhead99
    I have £30,000 left to invest in one of these Vanguard funds (Due to some unexpected bills)..... which one?

    I am just 51 and want to invest for between 5 (Unlikely) and 10 years (more likely)

    Which fund VLS60 or 80?
    Originally posted by copthis1
    Some would say don't invest at all for 5-10 years, only invest for 10-15 years plus. If 10 years is likely - and you have narrowed it down to only those two options out of all the other ones on the planet, and definitely want one of them - the 60 should be a safer investment in terms of risk of loss.

    If you do end up needing the money back in five years be aware you might have to lose a quarter or a third of it (or 40% or more if you had used the 80% version).
    • copthis1
    • By copthis1 25th Sep 17, 1:45 PM
    • 72 Posts
    • 19 Thanks
    copthis1
    Some would say don't invest at all for 5-10 years, only invest for 10-15 years plus. If 10 years is likely - and you have narrowed it down to only those two options out of all the other ones on the planet, and definitely want one of them - the 60 should be a safer investment in terms of risk of loss.

    If you do end up needing the money back in five years be aware you might have to lose a quarter or a third of it (or 40% or more if you had used the 80% version).
    Originally posted by bowlhead99
    Any other suggestions to consider then?
    • bowlhead99
    • By bowlhead99 25th Sep 17, 2:29 PM
    • 6,741 Posts
    • 12,017 Thanks
    bowlhead99
    You haven't given us much to go on other than timescale, so it's impossible for us to tell you whether you would prefer the 60% or 80% equities product. Most people probably prefer lower risk than 80% especially for a short timescale like a decade. So, it's natural to get comments pushing you towards 60 rather than 80 when we know nothing about you. With any two choices, the fund with lower medium-to long-term volatility is usually a safer one to be steered towards.

    The very lowest-risk traditional investments are not really yielding much more than retail cash deposits and top savings accounts. So, that might tempt people to go for low-medium or medium risk investments where otherwise cash and bonds could have been OK for a decade's timeframe.

    Just clicking on your post history you mention your wife is using L&G multi-index 7. Any reason not to use that fund range for your own investments? If it's for a relatively short timescale such as 10 years and you don't want more than 'about medium' risk you could consider their multi-index 5.

    You mention you are 51. So presumably in a decade's time if the investment has performed poorly you still have half a decade of 'working age' before state pension in which to go out and earn more money to top up your ISAs. And if you are in reasonable health you could be around for another 40 years from now, or more. So, some people would not mind taking higher levels of risk over that timescale. But as you have mentioned you will be investing only for 10 years ish (or originally, perhaps 5) rather than keeping the investment for the next two or three or four decades, it would make sense to stick with a lower risk product, and one that's relatively simple for you to understand.
    • A_T
    • By A_T 25th Sep 17, 3:21 PM
    • 198 Posts
    • 96 Thanks
    A_T
    My question SHOULD have been given a 20+ time frame with a lad who doesnt really worry about a fund tasnking which in people opinion should provide a better return over the long term VLS OR Vanguard FTSE Global All Cap Index Fund and what is the difference between the VLS and Vanguard FTSE Global All Cap Index Fund
    Originally posted by frenchplonka
    Some big Chinese companies are excluded from the FTSE index: Alibaba and Baidu in particular are two of the world's largest companies. But it may not be worth worrying about too much. They are included in VLS which includes an MSCI Emerging Markets index tracker rather than the FTSE.

    Also VLS has a much bigger UK equity share than the Vanguard FTSE Global All Cap Index Fund.
    • frenchplonka
    • By frenchplonka 25th Sep 17, 4:40 PM
    • 263 Posts
    • 63 Thanks
    frenchplonka
    Personally I think I have selected the right risk level for the next 10-15 years I can always dail it back as I approach my 50-60s in terms of bonds %

    Has anyone thought bout investing in Greek market surely after the ride they had it got to be better prob the naive investor in me talking there tho
    Sealed Pot Challenge 10 - #571
    • aroominyork
    • By aroominyork 27th Sep 17, 10:51 PM
    • 230 Posts
    • 45 Thanks
    aroominyork
    Some would say don't invest at all for 5-10 years, only invest for 10-15 years plus. If 10 years is likely - and you have narrowed it down to only those two options out of all the other ones on the planet, and definitely want one of them - the 60 should be a safer investment in terms of risk of loss.

    If you do end up needing the money back in five years be aware you might have to lose a quarter or a third of it (or 40% or more if you had used the 80% version).
    Originally posted by bowlhead99
    If planning to retire in about ten years and not being sure whether VLS 60 or 80 is the right choice, does it make sense to split the funds between them and plan to draw on the 60 first?
    • bowlhead99
    • By bowlhead99 28th Sep 17, 4:39 AM
    • 6,741 Posts
    • 12,017 Thanks
    bowlhead99
    If planning to retire in about ten years and not being sure whether VLS 60 or 80 is the right choice, does it make sense to split the funds between them and plan to draw on the 60 first?
    Originally posted by aroominyork
    If you invest in the 60 and 80 at the same time (and assuming you juggle the weights from time to time as one grows or falls faster than the other, to keep bringing the mix of the two funds back to 50:50 every so often) then you have effectively created a portfolio you could call VLS 70 with a risk level and growth potential somewhere between the two.

    Then as you enter retirement and start pulling money out of the investments so you can spend it, there are lots of possibilities but the three simplest ones will be:

    - sell the funds in equal proportions so that your remaining investments are still giving you a 'VLS 70'

    - draw mostly from the 60 first as you suggest, so that what you have left is mostly 80 and is therefore higher risk than what you have been doing for the first decade leading up to retirement

    - draw mostly from the 80 first so that the investments which remain for the rest of your retirement are mostly the 60, and are less volatile than what you have been dealing with when you were still in 'accumulation mode'.

    So, although you suggested 'draw on the 60 first', to me that seems the least recommendable thing.

    You might be planning to live until a ripe old age and still perfectly happy with 70% equities as you hope to grow your capital to provide spending power over the subsequent three or more decades after retirement. So I could understand the first option of drawing on the two funds equally.

    Or you might be looking to access the bulk of the funds sooner than that - assuming your spending needs in early retirement are higher than those when you get older, because you'll want more money for travel and socialising etc. So, when you hit retirement age you will be quite a bit closer to the average date you need the money than you are today, so I could well understand an idea to de-risk - cash out some of the 80 and be left with the 60% equities as the remaining, lower-risk investment instead of what you started with which was 70%

    The suggestion to draw the 60 one first is therefore a less obvious choice because it retains exposure to the highest risk fund as you get older and closer to needing the money !

    I suppose where you have got that idea from is the concept that you don't want to sell at a low point in the markets and take a big loss, so you recognise that the 80 might be something you'd have to hold for longer to realise its potential, and therefore if you have to sell something at the bottom of a big crash for a bombed-out lowball price, it should be the 60, and leave the 80 invested at cheap prices in the hope of a recovery.

    There is some sense in that, but only if - at the time you need the money - you are actually experiencing a prolonged low-point in the markets when it is clearly a great time to be buying up cheap equities rather than selling. But of course you can't know now whether some random date about a decade in the future will be a particularly high or low price in the context of historic market levels. Statistically you should expect it to be 'about normal, not particuarly high or low'. So then the question just boils down to shall I leave my VLS 70 at these normal prices or mostly withdraw the 60 and be invested heavily in VLS80, as I get closer to spending my last penny. The answer for most would be to sell the VLS80 in all but the most exceptional circumstances, rather than sell the 60 and leave yourself berelatively heavily invested in the 80.
    • Malthusian
    • By Malthusian 28th Sep 17, 9:00 AM
    • 3,076 Posts
    • 4,474 Thanks
    Malthusian
    Has anyone thought bout investing in Greek market surely after the ride they had it got to be better prob the naive investor in me talking there tho
    Originally posted by frenchplonka
    "Things can only get better" is what they said about HBOS and the Weimar Republic.

    I Googled the Greek stock market and got an article from the Torygraph's share tipster in July 2015 saying he'd bought a Greek ETF on pretty much the same logic as you. Assuming he's still got it, he's lost 25% of his money, compared to a 40% gain if he'd invested in the FTSE World over the same time period. But hey, that means the Greek stockmarket is even better value than when the Torygraph was tipping it.

    Sometimes shares crash for a very good reason, because they're crap.
    • ColdIron
    • By ColdIron 28th Sep 17, 11:25 AM
    • 3,474 Posts
    • 4,102 Thanks
    ColdIron
    It's been just over a month since the voting on this thread picked up again so I thought I'd have a look at how the numbers panned out (yes, it's a slow morning)

    Are you currently invested with Vanguard Life Strategy?
    A) Yes
    B) No
    C) No, but I would like to at some point
    D) There are better options than Vanguard

    From 15/01/2013 to 24/08/2017 - 531 votes
    A) 250 (47%)
    B) 91 (17%)
    C) 159 (30%)
    D) 31 (6%)

    Today - 626 votes
    A) 299 (48%) +49
    B) 100 (16%) +9
    C) 190 (30%) +31
    D) 37 (6%) +6

    My conclusions
    1) Not much has changed proportion-wise
    2) It was a dodgy question, what's the difference between B) and D)?
    3) I wonder how many C)s really became A)s
    4) Vote rate is 95 votes per month compared to its historic 9.5 votes per month
    5) Vanguard's LifeStrategy remains very popular around these parts
    6) I could have spent the last half hour more constructively
    • Audaxer
    • By Audaxer 28th Sep 17, 11:06 PM
    • 491 Posts
    • 213 Thanks
    Audaxer
    It's been just over a month since the voting on this thread picked up again so I thought I'd have a look at how the numbers panned out (yes, it's a slow morning)

    Are you currently invested with Vanguard Life Strategy?
    A) Yes
    B) No
    C) No, but I would like to at some point
    D) There are better options than Vanguard

    From 15/01/2013 to 24/08/2017 - 531 votes
    A) 250 (47%)
    B) 91 (17%)
    C) 159 (30%)
    D) 31 (6%)

    Today - 626 votes
    A) 299 (48%) +49
    B) 100 (16%) +9
    C) 190 (30%) +31
    D) 37 (6%) +6

    My conclusions
    1) Not much has changed proportion-wise
    2) It was a dodgy question, what's the difference between B) and D)?
    3) I wonder how many C)s really became A)s
    4) Vote rate is 95 votes per month compared to its historic 9.5 votes per month
    5) Vanguard's LifeStrategy remains very popular around these parts
    6) I could have spent the last half hour more constructively
    Originally posted by ColdIron
    Maybe there should just have been 2 answers available A) Yes and B) No, because those that answered B), C) or D) all haven't invested in VLS for whatever reason. That would make the result A) 47% and B) 53%, therefore VLS not looking quite as popular on here as I first thought.
    • Vortigern
    • By Vortigern 29th Sep 17, 10:00 AM
    • 2,275 Posts
    • 1,475 Thanks
    Vortigern
    Maybe there should just have been 2 answers available A) Yes and B) No, because those that answered B), C) or D) all haven't invested in VLS for whatever reason. That would make the result A) 47% and B) 53%, therefore VLS not looking quite as popular on here as I first thought.
    Originally posted by Audaxer
    Maybe this poll should now be closed because those who voted C and subsequently became A cannot change their vote to reflect their current positions. Some of the votes are over 4 years old and VLS seems to have grown in popularity in that time, judging by the number of times it's mentioned on this forum.
    • ewaste
    • By ewaste 29th Sep 17, 10:23 AM
    • 38 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    ewaste
    Has anyone done a poll on Vanguard LS and the alternatives like L&G Multi-Index and HSBC Global Strategy?

    Furthermore has anyone done a somewhat definitive post that outlines the key differences of each regarding the different approaches taken, asset allocations and risk. Essentially a summary of one of the themes that reappears in this thread. (I haven't read it all)
    • ElizabethJane
    • By ElizabethJane 4th Oct 17, 4:08 PM
    • 24 Posts
    • 7 Thanks
    ElizabethJane
    Are you able to update us on what's happened with your ISA investments in the last 5 years. I am currently deciding on where to place my ISA S/S funds for the current financial year.
    • badger09
    • By badger09 4th Oct 17, 4:30 PM
    • 5,182 Posts
    • 4,383 Thanks
    badger09
    Are you able to update us on what's happened with your ISA investments in the last 5 years. I am currently deciding on where to place my ISA S/S funds for the current financial year.
    Originally posted by ElizabethJane
    Who are you asking?

    Why 5 years?

    If you're asking OP, don't hold your breath as he/she hasn't been active on the forum for about 18 months.
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