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  • FIRST POST
    TheVujanic
    Child & Co Bankers ?
    • #1
    • 25th Sep 12, 3:56 AM
    Child & Co Bankers ? 25th Sep 12 at 3:56 AM
    Hi There

    I was looking on a thread on this Forum about people who did not want there RBS accounts to become Santander accounts due to the branch sell off in England. Some people on the thread were saying that they just "transfered their account to Child & Co" so they didn't have to change, and also said that "Opening an account at Messrs Drummond is just like at any other branch" which has surprised me as I thought these banks were just like Coutts and Adam & Company where you have to have very high assets or income to become a client.

    I still highly doubt what they are saying is true, and maybe this is what they thought they could do, but if true, you can just open an account with Child or Drummond this would shock me.

    Finding information about Child and Drummond is like trying to find a needle in a haystack, and its odd that RBS run websites for Coutts and Adam but not Child and Drummond.

    Is there anyone on here that is with Child or Drummond and can give me some helpful information about the Banks, or anyone they moved there account to any of them to avoid Santander.

    Thanks

    http://
    forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=3735955
Page 6
    • Marchitiello
    • By Marchitiello 29th Sep 16, 4:55 PM
    • 141 Posts
    • 44 Thanks
    Marchitiello
    Weatherbys looks to be catering specifically for people involved in horse racing http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=4885622&goto=newpost%5C

    If you qualify for premium/private banking from most High Street Banks, I would also look at suitability of equivalent accounts from Barclays, Lloyds and HSBC (which have an attached Premium Credit Card with nice benefits).

    Also, if the qualifying criteria are met, have you looked into other proper private banks like Arbuthnot Latham, Brown Shipley, C Hoare & Co and Duncan Lawrie?
    • whoevenknows
    • By whoevenknows 30th Sep 16, 9:34 AM
    • 6 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    whoevenknows
    I must say, Child is excellent.
    I have a black account with them, which I rate highly. Their branch service is excellent (recently refurbished, beautiful) and my relationship manager is one of the best I've ever dealt with. Everything gets sorted quickly.
    The rest is unfortunately RBS, so expect slow transactions update (batch processing during the night) and an average website. However the app is decent.

    To answer to the previous enquiry, to get a Drummond card you have to be a private bank client and have an account at their branch. Not many know about the card even within the staff.

    Drummonds and Child are sister branches. They share some staff. Holts instead is based in Farnborough and operates on a different model (military bank).


    I also bank with Cater Allen (and some others). Their costumer service is awesome, but their online banking is awful. No mobile app. Faster Payments aren't really "faster" (bank giro credits) and take at least one day to appear. They scrapped the deferred element of the debit cards, which was a huge plus for me. The only interesting plus they have is their cash withdrawal limit (£2005 pd).

    I suggest Duncan Lawrie as an alternative. Aburthnot Athams if you are a HNWI.

    Otherwise the Child&Co (not the RBS) service is awesome or Drummonds if you care about the fancy piece of plastic.. the staff will still be awesome.
    Originally posted by AlexPF
    Thanks ever so much for this - very helpful! I was worried I was being suckered in to what was a brilliant brand with a great history but which failed to live up to that now. However, based on my limited experience with them already and your comments above, I don't think that's a valid concern.

    Pardon my ignorance but is there a difference (even in terms of "glamour") between Drummonds and Child? Does this account for why posters are eager to understand how to get hold of a Drummonds account / branded card? Are they the 'next rung up' i.e. closer to Coutts and Adams than Child? Or is it just a north and south of the border difference, historically ? I'm now wondering if I should pursue a Drummonds account!! Does the Child account not still come with a fairly fancy piece of plastic?!

    Also, great info re. Cater Allen although I thought they still offered the deferred Visa Debit.

    Re. Arbuthnot Latham - I am defs not a HNWI. However, I reached out to them before I was properly educated and they have been very nice thus far. I was contacted by email personally after a website enquiry and they suggested a face to face meeting, which I'm due to attend next week. Gulp. I have already been honest and told them I don't have any investable assets to bring with me (more typical requirement for true private banking) and the contact said "let's chat in person, I remain open minded and will be honest if we don't think it's the right time to establish a relationship". I'm not holding out much hope that they'll roll out the red carpet, but I do appreciate the straightforward approach. I shall report back.

    Finally, and funnily enough, I've already called Duncan Lawrie to enquire about opening an account. I spoke to someone very nice but who was not an accounts opening person. However I have not been called back and I'm disenchanted already.

    Thanks again, I'm oddly quite enjoying getting up the curve with this.
    • whoevenknows
    • By whoevenknows 30th Sep 16, 9:42 AM
    • 6 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    whoevenknows
    Weatherbys looks to be catering specifically for people involved in horse racing.

    If you qualify for premium/private banking from most High Street Banks, I would also look at suitability of equivalent accounts from Barclays, Lloyds and HSBC (which have an attached Premium Credit Card with nice benefits).

    Also, if the qualifying criteria are met, have you looked into other proper private banks like Arbuthnot Latham, Brown Shipley, C Hoare & Co and Duncan Lawrie?
    Originally posted by Marchitiello
    Thanks so much for this! Funnily enough though, the more you snoop around re. Weatherbys and their Private / Premier accounts (I qualify for the Premier rather than Private) they are very much trying to attract a broader cohort of customers, particularly City professionals (from the horse's mouth, if you'll pardon the expression!). They have also, thus far, blown me away with just their straightforward responsiveness and friendliness. I am very tempted but can't seem to hang my hat on one provider over another. A final detail that you guys might find interesting is that they do offer "restricted" (i.e. not tied but not fully independent) financial advice and wealth management. Starting from the bottom up too, by which I mean, even if you feel like a financial dunce, they will start you off with simple practical advice to get your every day life as financially efficient as possible but can also offer all the fancy stuff if you become a millionaire overnight And you pay for that service rather than it being linked to commissions etc. Therefore you get a bank and potentially a trustworthy financial advisor, all under one roof. Whereas I think the private banking brands of the bigger banks (e.g. Childs) can only sell or advise on the bigger banking group's products (e.g. RBS).

    Also, see my previous reply just now re. Duncan Lawrie and Arbuthnot Latham - I'll report back! Needless to say Hoares and Brown Shipley would laugh me out of the door (sadly) as likely will Arbuthnot!!
    • AlexPF
    • By AlexPF 30th Sep 16, 11:27 AM
    • 27 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    AlexPF
    They are a bank of brands (Child, Holts, Drummond, Coutts, Adam&co, NatWest, Western Branch...) but they are about to announce changes in the structure due to the 2008 crisis (basically separating risk). It should be known in the next few days.
    RBS in England is going to disappear (replaced by NatWest holdings) so I expect a higher relevance of the various brands which won't be renamed in NatWest. It could even be that Child will become a Coutts like entity.
    So I'd expect their operating model to have relevant changes over the next year.

    About the difference, Child is more related to the law field, while Drummonds is historically related to the royal family and wealthy individuals. Nowadays Drummonds does not really have any particular "glamour", if we ignore an "antique" looking branch (but they have a great art collection and nice dinners if you are lucky enough to be invited to dine there) and their lottery winner department. However they have a closer affinity with Coutts, as some of the staff is shared.
    In regards to the debit card and material, Child operates slightly differently as it as a higher exposure of its brand. Drummonds is more related to RBS, and their debit card is not nearly as fancy as the Child one
    I'd say the difference is that Child is not commonly known by the masses, while Drummonds is relatively famous as it deals with lottery winners. But as I said getting the branded material is not as straightforward as with Child.
    In regards to financial advice, I'm sure that private bankers of both Child and Drummonds can refer you to either Coutts or suggest an independent third party.

    I'm curious to see exactly how Child and Drummond will be differentiated once RBS retail disappears and NatWest holdings will be in place.

    About Cater Allen, they recently announced the changes about the deferred element of the cards being strapped. Their site is not up to date.

    Arbuthnot Latham, they are extremely nice people :P their requirements and fees are high, but you get the best boutique service around. Fancy debit card.

    Brown Shipley has a very fancy credit card. Damn difficult to get hold of it tho :P

    ALL banks are willing to compromise depending on your particular situation. For example if you come from a wealthy family, if you are an entrepreneur with a promising business or if you are young and on a high salary. Potential earnings and willing to use more services from the same bank can go a long way
    • whoevenknows
    • By whoevenknows 30th Sep 16, 3:01 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    whoevenknows
    Thanks so much for this @AlexPF - very interesting and a quick Google does indeed confirm the news trickling out as we speak about how the new structure will look. I shall add that to my list of questions for Childs!

    But good to understand slightly more about the current differences between the brands of Childs and Drummonds (given I'm a lawyer, incidentally, I might take that as a sign towards Childs), and yes - it will be interesting to see if this takes on greater emphasis as part of this shake up. In case it's indicative of anything - I feel that given Childs has recently-ish completed its big re-furb of its 1 Fleet Street HQ, that perhaps betrays an intention to push it as a brand going forwards? The lady from Childs I spoke to couldn't stop gushing about it...

    I also spoke to Drummonds today but they require me to come into branch rather than have an initial chat on the phone. Nice touch but a bit useless given they don't have appointments around work hours i.e. before 9 or after 5. I've got a lunchtime appointment scheduled for a week on Monday so will let you know what I glean.

    Great info re. Cater Allen, especially as the deferred debit card was appealing to me, I'm slightly less interested now.

    Thank you also for your comments re. Arbuthnot - I agree with your view (despite not knowing anything)! Even the small interaction I've had has been very sensible and pleasant. Really makes me keen to try and 'get in'. Let's hope that such pragmatism is indeed the order of the day. As I must admit, if they are interested in taking me on, despite their crazy current account fees, I'd be too curious to say no.

    I am going to, just for the fun of it, take a similar approach with Coutts too. In other words, I fall far short of their advertised eligibility requirements but will be interested to see whether they are able to demonstrate the same degree of pragmatism and flexibility. For completeness, I fall mainly in the "young but good earning potential" bracket. No likely huge inheritances coming my way etc. etc.

    I'll try and report back without boring anyone!

    p.s. still feeling oddly torn between Childs and Weatherbys.
    • AlexPF
    • By AlexPF 30th Sep 16, 3:41 PM
    • 27 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    AlexPF
    Cheers @whoevenknows.

    Most of Child's clients are lawyers and barristers (the royal court of justice is incidentally just across the street :P) so that's their main type of client and expertise field.

    Definitely we will see the array of Coutts, Drummonds, Child&Co, Holts becoming more relevant as RBS disappears, now that the changes are public. I'm quite excited about it

    Curious to know what Drummonds will tell you during your visit!

    Cater Allen: the deferred debit card was the main push for me too. Was fun while it lasted, but there are other providers out there (think Duncan Lawrie or Investec).

    Arbuthnot - curious to hear what they say there too. Criteria were more relaxed some time ago.. they have been pushing for big deposits recently. Would be curious to see if you'll have a different experience with them. High fees but still less than Coutts! And a lot of their private bankers are ex Coutts, which is good, as well as senior management. Current account fees are scrapped if you have a decent amount invested with them however.

    Coutts is worth a call, lighter requirements if you are under 26 (no account fees for example). Let me know

    Weatherbys seems interesting. I might request some info as well as I never had a look into it!
    • Paul_1977
    • By Paul_1977 30th Sep 16, 5:53 PM
    • 977 Posts
    • 303 Thanks
    Paul_1977
    I wonder why they allow people who are not entitled to private banking (like myself) the option of getting a child card? It's great but does not make much sense.
    • whoevenknows
    • By whoevenknows 30th Sep 16, 6:13 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    whoevenknows
    I wonder too! However for reasons known only to themselves, they do differentiate between "personal" and "private" clients and offer different services to each. I do wonder if those who have banked with them for generations but who don't meet the private requirements have prompted the need for them to offer a personal account too? I shall try and find out more.
    • Paul_1977
    • By Paul_1977 30th Sep 16, 6:40 PM
    • 977 Posts
    • 303 Thanks
    Paul_1977
    One of the reasons I left Child, is being of the fear they would turn around one day and say you are not rich bye bye. So you waste years banking with someone and they throw you out. I would rather use a standard bank for that reason. Among others.
    • taccy
    • By taccy 1st Oct 16, 9:08 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    taccy
    Coutts v Child
    Interesting. I've been banking with Coutts for 10 years. I opened the account when I took out a mortgage with them so didn't have any bank charges, and also used the Silk charge card enough to have the £350 annual fee waived. The online banking has been great plus the 'Coutts 24' telephone service. Don't really use the Concierge service but do use the travel insurance and airport lounge pass cards. However, my mortgage has ended (sold the property) so now I pay full fees, and from December they're 1) increasing banking fees to £1000 pa (!) and 2) Dropping travel insurance and airport lounge pass.
    Whilst I've had a Private Banker over the 10 years I rarely have cause to speak to them. It's always quicker and more efficient to use Coutts 24 or online.
    I'm wondering about switching to Child & Co (I share the same surname...). Particularly if the online/telephone service part is as good. Not sure what the annual charges are? Or I just pay the £1000 pa to continue with Coutts. It's not that I can't afford the £1k, it's more I don't like paying for things unless there's sufficient reason! Perhaps the kudos of the Coutts debit and chargecards are? Thoughts?
    • Paul_1977
    • By Paul_1977 2nd Oct 16, 12:23 AM
    • 977 Posts
    • 303 Thanks
    Paul_1977
    If you switch to Child, you will basically be getting an RBS current account, unless you qualify for the private side ie black account. But this is still an RBS account.

    £1000 per year is a bit much.
    • Marchitiello
    • By Marchitiello 2nd Oct 16, 12:33 AM
    • 141 Posts
    • 44 Thanks
    Marchitiello
    Interesting. I've been banking with Coutts for 10 years. I opened the account when I took out a mortgage with them so didn't have any bank charges, and also used the Silk charge card enough to have the £350 annual fee waived. The online banking has been great plus the 'Coutts 24' telephone service. Don't really use the Concierge service but do use the travel insurance and airport lounge pass cards. However, my mortgage has ended (sold the property) so now I pay full fees, and from December they're 1) increasing banking fees to £1000 pa (!) and 2) Dropping travel insurance and airport lounge pass.
    Whilst I've had a Private Banker over the 10 years I rarely have cause to speak to them. It's always quicker and more efficient to use Coutts 24 or online.
    I'm wondering about switching to Child & Co (I share the same surname...). Particularly if the online/telephone service part is as good. Not sure what the annual charges are? Or I just pay the £1000 pa to continue with Coutts. It's not that I can't afford the £1k, it's more I don't like paying for things unless there's sufficient reason! Perhaps the kudos of the Coutts debit and chargecards are? Thoughts?
    Originally posted by taccy
    Child & co accounts use RBS standard online site and mobile app. If you qualify for Black Rewards Current account (which carry a monthly fee) then you will get I believe Lounge access but not sure about the travel insurance. If you have enough earning but not enough for private banking, then you will still get a personal banker that you can call at Child.

    Consider that a standard Barclays account with the Travel Plus Pack will cost you £186 pa (£15.50pm) and come with Dragon Pass (6 free entry) and family world wide travel insurance.
    • whoevenknows
    • By whoevenknows 2nd Oct 16, 12:19 PM
    • 6 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    whoevenknows
    Hi there @taccy

    Interesting quandary re. Coutts -v- Child. In case helpful background, whilst I would qualify for Private banking at Childs due to income, I spoke to Coutts to satisfy my curiosity and was promptly dismissed I was then advised, with a whiff of condescention, that I might be better suited to Childs. The point being, one account / bank clearly (at least in the view of Coutts' staff) is not interchangeable for the other....

    I agree with all @Marchitello said - in short, you are getting an RBS account, even if you qualify for the "Black Private" account. Having spoken to someone at Childs recently, they then sent me all of their marketing material and accounts information. What's so interesting is that none of the accounts related documentation bears any Childs branding. It's all RBS. The only Childs specific stuff I received was a brochure about its history and about the refurb at Fleet Street. I am, concurrently, speaking to Drummonds and I am awaiting their printed info and will update.

    However, as @AlexPF notes below, RBS is currently undergoing some fairly radical changes. This can already be seen on RBS' main website: [sorry, I'm not allowed to paste links yet] where Childs, Drummonds, Holts and Coutts are split out as distinct brands but lumped together as private banking brands. This may indeed be the beginning of a big change that would mean that each of the brands above really does reclaim an individual identity and the odd hybrid pack of info I received will be a thing of the past. However, only time will tell. The other key point to note is that whilst on the main RBS website Childs, Drummonds and Coutts are all listed together, Coutts does have its own banking licence from the UK regulators. That is very valuable and even when a private bank is acquired by a big group, they almost never want to lose the additional licence (Cater Allen is the same).

    So, to cut to it, Coutts is still, in the current world, quite distinct from RBS more generally and difficult to 'get in' to. I can't imagine Coutts sending you info about its accounts that are RBS branded?! Maybe Childs will become the same with time. However what is almost guaranteed is that the Coutts brand will remain strong and distinct. As such it's really down to you as to whether the £1k per year (which does seem high) is worth it. However, to get the RBS Black Private Childs account is £28 per month. Still vastly cheaper but not free! Finally, a close friend of mine also banks with Coutts and is relatively unimpressed. But I think that's because she too, like you, is fairly on top of things and so just does her online banking without needing the more bespoke services. However I do tease her that despite that I think she'd be a bit shocked if she didn't have at least the option of speaking to someone helpful, immediately should something go wrong
    • Marchitiello
    • By Marchitiello 2nd Oct 16, 1:24 PM
    • 141 Posts
    • 44 Thanks
    Marchitiello
    I think you guys have over expectation for the RBS changes.

    The original plans to rebrand the English and Welsh branches to W& Co and float it has been shelved so now it is simply back to try to sell all England and Wales branches with the exceptions of Holts, Child&co and Drummonds. They have still to separate the business as the the fines were going to be imposed by both the EU and UK competition commission (they have unfair competitive advantage vs other U.K. Banks that were not bailed out as well as other European banks), and the management of those branches has been separate for a while and as per my exchange with Paul1977 early in this thread, they have shared the premier/private banking team amongst them for a while, as well as the top Private Bankers at the Drummonds branch are also shared with Coutts.

    RBS are simply trying to keep those branches with strong identies and brand south of the boarder and have done so for as along as they have owned these brands (Coutts was part of NatWest before being acquired and have also been kept as a separate business before RBS). You may know that RBS has sold off the actual building where Drummonds and Child & Co are loacated, leasing back the lower floors only. There are plans to transform the upper building of Drummonds in luxury appartments...
    • AlexPF
    • By AlexPF 15th Oct 16, 7:29 PM
    • 27 Posts
    • 5 Thanks
    AlexPF
    Seems like we are starting to see some of the changes to RBS brands already.



    I like this new design! Holt's is following a similar path to Childs.

    Hopefully they will strip the RBS logo from the Drummonds debit card as well, not a fan.
    I really appreciate that the "accessible" design is by default now.
    • cheesetoast
    • By cheesetoast 22nd Oct 16, 9:21 PM
    • 200 Posts
    • 117 Thanks
    cheesetoast
    Interesting that on this page: http://www.rbs.com/our-brands/child-co.html, they say that Child & Co has 6,000 "personal customers", plus 1,800 "private customers".

    I wonder how many of the 6,000 are MSE'ers...
    • LeeUK
    • By LeeUK 22nd Oct 16, 10:22 PM
    • 5,244 Posts
    • 2,436 Thanks
    LeeUK
    Interesting that on this page: http://www.rbs.com/our-brands/child-co.html, they say that Child & Co has 6,000 "personal customers", plus 1,800 "private customers".

    I wonder how many of the 6,000 are MSE'ers...
    Originally posted by cheesetoast
    Well I'm 1 of them.
    Lee's No More Takeaways Club No.1
    • starM
    • By starM 23rd Oct 16, 5:37 PM
    • 1,217 Posts
    • 165 Thanks
    starM
    How can I open up a Child & co personal account?

    Thinking to apply for one.
    • Paul_1977
    • By Paul_1977 23rd Oct 16, 6:11 PM
    • 977 Posts
    • 303 Thanks
    Paul_1977
    How can I open up a Child & co personal account?

    Thinking to apply for one.
    Originally posted by starM
    Go to the RBS site, apple for a normal current account, near the end of the application, you will be asked to select a branch. At this point select Fleet Street.

    Depending on an internal RBS score, you may be given a Child branded debit card. If not, it will be a normal RBS one.
    • Paul_1977
    • By Paul_1977 23rd Oct 16, 6:13 PM
    • 977 Posts
    • 303 Thanks
    Paul_1977
    Seems like we are starting to see some of the changes to RBS brands already.



    I like this new design! Holt's is following a similar path to Childs.

    Hopefully they will strip the RBS logo from the Drummonds debit card as well, not a fan.
    I really appreciate that the "accessible" design is by default now.
    Originally posted by AlexPF
    Very nice, what is that circle bit on the edge?
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