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  • FIRST POST
    • Butterfly Brain
    • By Butterfly Brain 28th Aug 12, 10:46 PM
    • 8,661Posts
    • 60,304Thanks
    Butterfly Brain
    Feed a family of four for 20 a week challenge
    • #1
    • 28th Aug 12, 10:46 PM
    Feed a family of four for 20 a week challenge 28th Aug 12 at 10:46 PM
    This is coming from the 7 a week thread. We need ideas on healthy meals for a family of four with 20 a week, this must include fruit and veg and protein. And like the 7 a week thread there is no stock cupboard. Can we do it guys and gals?

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=4084527


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    Last edited by MSE Zorica; 03-12-2014 at 12:56 PM.
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Page 58
    • Serena03
    • By Serena03 29th Mar 16, 2:57 PM
    • 174 Posts
    • 4,343 Thanks
    Serena03
    I can, but I'd like to something slightly more interesting and eat them.
    Originally posted by NewShadow
    How about carrot cake? I swear by this recipe http://www.bbcgoodfood.com/recipes/3229/yummy-scrummy-carrot-cake

    Carrot veggie burgers http://allrecipes.com/recipe/72865/carrot-burgers/
    Other things to make:
    Coleslaw
    Carrot pickle
    Carrot chutney
    Something I havent tried before but sounds interesting is carrot sorbet?

    Hope that helps
    'Never give up on something that you can't go a day without thinking about'
    • missymoo81
    • By missymoo81 29th Mar 16, 6:38 PM
    • 5,207 Posts
    • 16,306 Thanks
    missymoo81
    The ideas for weekly plans at the beginning of this thread are amazing, but I've noticed that most of the things that were available that were super cheap or tesco value just aren't available now, like the 15p value stuffing mix or value custard powder, 12 bread rolls for 35p or value mixed herbs, mine doesn't do value rich tea anymore or bourbons, small things but really make a difference if they're things you used to buy every week! Makes it a lot more difficult to come up with a plan too
    • Soworried
    • By Soworried 29th Mar 16, 7:49 PM
    • 2,154 Posts
    • 18,502 Thanks
    Soworried
    The ideas for weekly plans at the beginning of this thread are amazing, but I've noticed that most of the things that were available that were super cheap or tesco value just aren't available now, like the 15p value stuffing mix or value custard powder, 12 bread rolls for 35p or value mixed herbs, mine doesn't do value rich tea anymore or bourbons, small things but really make a difference if they're things you used to buy every week! Makes it a lot more difficult to come up with a plan too
    Originally posted by missymoo81
    I noticed this so I re costed one of the weeks menus I did (pg13) and it was a whopping 21% price increase.
    Asda still have the 15p stuffing in some times and they do the mixed herbs, the rest I haven't seen for ages.
    Stock cubes cost almost 300% more now
    GC Sep 240/39.49
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    • 3 kids 2 jobs 1 dog
    • By 3 kids 2 jobs 1 dog 30th Mar 16, 10:15 AM
    • 489 Posts
    • 1,587 Thanks
    3 kids 2 jobs 1 dog
    Morrisons still have their Savers stuffing, I mix it in with sausage meat when making sausage rolls and I think they still do the cheap mixed herbs too.

    I've noticed the 'value' ranges vary with the seasons ie value hot chocolate is available in the summer months but not in the winter, I guess they think you'll pay the extra when you really need something - uh no, I just stock up in the summer months!
    • NewShadow
    • By NewShadow 30th Mar 16, 10:18 AM
    • 1,260 Posts
    • 7,186 Thanks
    NewShadow
    How about carrot cake? I swear by this recipe http://www.bbcgoodfood.com/recipes/3229/yummy-scrummy-carrot-cake
    Originally posted by Serena03
    It does help, thanks.

    Everyone keeps saying carrot cake.

    Is it just me that can't stand the stuff? I love the cheese icing but I think i had a really bad experience once and it must have put me off

    I think about it and the texture in my head is just all grainy and gross - was it just a bad cake (oxymoron, I know)
    If you know something's wrong, and you won't stand up because you're scared - tell me and I'll stand with you.

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    21.1mi May, 16.3mi Jun,18.9mi Jul,
    • slowandsteady
    • By slowandsteady 31st Mar 16, 5:52 AM
    • 386 Posts
    • 3,289 Thanks
    slowandsteady
    Nice to see this thread pop up again, not had an email for a while about it. I don't have much worth contributing but do appreciate all those who do have that knowledge and share it 😁
    • honeythewitch
    • By honeythewitch 31st Mar 16, 12:58 PM
    • 717 Posts
    • 2,283 Thanks
    honeythewitch
    It does help, thanks.

    Everyone keeps saying carrot cake.

    Is it just me that can't stand the stuff? I love the cheese icing but I think i had a really bad experience once and it must have put me off

    I think about it and the texture in my head is just all grainy and gross - was it just a bad cake (oxymoron, I know)
    Originally posted by NewShadow
    Seen as parsnips are so cheap at the moment it might be worth giving a parsnip cake a go. http://www.riverford.co.uk/recipes/view/recipe/parsnip-cake

    I dont know if the texture is the same as carrot cake.
    • SmlSave
    • By SmlSave 31st Mar 16, 6:51 PM
    • 4,662 Posts
    • 16,258 Thanks
    SmlSave
    Parsnip cake is amazing and much nicer than carrot cake imo. I grate it really small

    Yuk to cream cheese frosting though

    I've got half a leek and half a cabbage - any ideas on what to do with them?
    Boy Smllet born 23/06/2011 and Girl Smllet born 01/03/2014

    5 year challenge to pay off 20,000
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    • Feral Moon
    • By Feral Moon 31st Mar 16, 7:22 PM
    • 2,222 Posts
    • 3,146 Thanks
    Feral Moon
    Parsnip cake is amazing and much nicer than carrot cake imo. I grate it really small

    Yuk to cream cheese frosting though

    I've got half a leek and half a cabbage - any ideas on what to do with them?
    Originally posted by SmlSave
    I always stir fry leek and cabbage together usually served with mashed potatoes (so any leftovers can be turned into bubble & squeak) and a meat/gravy based dish - so maybe braised steak, liver & onions, sausage & onion gravy, steak & kidney pie etc.
    • HOWMUCH
    • By HOWMUCH 3rd Apr 16, 4:42 PM
    • 1,287 Posts
    • 9,313 Thanks
    HOWMUCH
    I had to return something to Sainsbobs so I did a YS shop 6.60 to 1.65 then passed MrT's so popped in 12.94 to 1.12 then Asder 3.60 to 1.08 I had a free lift as DS was going to the supermarket to double up his points. We are lucky we have 5 supermarkets within a mile and 3 are on 1 road.
    Why pay full price when you may get it YS
    • buzzyzoe
    • By buzzyzoe 22nd Sep 16, 4:34 PM
    • 391 Posts
    • 901 Thanks
    buzzyzoe
    Hope no one minds me reviving an old thread!

    I've read a lot of the low cost meal plan threads, and decided I would like to have a go myself. This is a plan for 4 people for a week and comes in at 18.74, which would leave you a bit of money for some fresh fruit, biscuits or anything else that you felt particularly deprived of following this plan!

    This differs from most of the plans that I've seen as I don't particularly like sandwiches or find them very filling, particularly extremely low cost sandwiches, so I haven't included sandwiches at all for lunch and have done a variety of other meals instead.

    All prices are correct as of today from Tesco. I can elaborate on any of the recipes if anyone wants but should all be fairly straightforward! I have gone for veggie chilli and bolognese as it's so much cheaper, and the lentils are a great source of protein and give you more than your daily needs. These are all recipes I make regularly, but with some alterations to make them a bit cheaper, be that leaving out some ingredients or using basics options.

    Shopping list:
    Oats (0.75/1KG)
    Jam (0.29/454G)
    Couscous (0.70/500G)
    Rice (0.45/1KG)
    Pasta (0.30/500G)
    Spaghetti (0.20/500G)
    Mayonnaise (0.40/500ML)
    Stock cubes (0.30/Pack of 10)
    Onions (0.59/1KG)
    Mushrooms (0.86/380G)
    Potatoes (0.79/700g)
    Carrots (0.90/2KG)
    Lentils (1.05/3x 390G)
    Tinned tomatoes (0.62/2x 400g)
    Kidney beans (0.30/400g)
    Sausages (0.66/Pack of 8)
    Chicken (3.58/1.8KG)
    Cooking bacon (0.60/500G)
    Extra mature cheddar (1.40/200G)
    Gravy granules (0.20/200G)
    Instant noodles (0.60/3 packs)
    Curry sauce (0.25/440G)
    Garlic (0.30/1 bulb)
    Flour (0.40/100G)
    Milk (1/4 pints)
    Eggs (1.25/15)

    Total: 18.74

    Breakfast
    Porridge with jam x 5 days (Use porridge oats and jam)
    Pancakes with jam x days (Use 200g flour, 4 eggs, 600ml milk, jam)

    Lunches
    Pasta salad w/bacon x 2 days (Use pasta, 200g bacon, mayonnaise)
    Lentil and vegetable soup x 2 days (Use 1 tin lentils, 300g carrots, 300g potatoes, 2 onions, 100g mushrooms, 2 stock cubes)
    Couscous w/roasted veg (Use couscous, 1 onion, 60g mushrooms, 100g carrots, 50g bacon, 1 stock cube)
    Rice w/roasted veg (Use rice, 1 onion, 60g mushrooms, 100g carrots, 50g bacon, 1 stock cube)
    Toad in the hole and gravy (Use 4 sausages, 100g flour, 1 egg, 300ml milk, 1 stock cube, gravy granules)

    Dinners
    Vegetarian spaghetti Bolognese (Use 1 tin lentils, 1 tin tomatoes, 1 onion, 200g carrots, 80g mushrooms, 1 stock cube, 50g cheese)
    Vegetarian chilli con carne with rice (Use 1 tin lentils, 1 tin tomatoes, 1 tin kidney beans, 1 onion, 200g carrots, 80g mushrooms, 1 stock cube, 50g cheese)
    Bacon risotto (Use 200g bacon, rice, 1 stock cube, 50g cheese)
    Sausage pasta (Use 4 sausages, spaghetti, 1 stock cube, 50g cheese)
    Roast chicken with roast potatoes, carrots, Yorkshire puddings and onion gravy (Cook whole chicken, serve roughly , 400g potatoes, 300g carrots, 1 onion, gravy granules, 140g plain flour, 4 eggs, 200ml milk)
    Chicken curry and rice (Use of chicken, jar of curry sauce, 200g carrots, 1 onion, rice)
    Chicken noodle soup (Use of chicken, packs of noodles, 1 stock cube, 1 onion)

    Hope this helps someone!
    Mortgage offer received 20/04/2014
    Mortgage at start - 72995
    Current mortgage - 47995
    Original mortgage free date - 09/2038
    Mortgage free wannabe date - 09/2020
    • Feral Moon
    • By Feral Moon 23rd Sep 16, 8:32 AM
    • 2,222 Posts
    • 3,146 Thanks
    Feral Moon
    Sorry but the above is completely unrealistic. Maybe for ONE person but certainly not to feed FOUR healthy adults. They certainly wouldn't be very healthy if they had to survive on this diet!

    For example, are you seriously suggesting a pack of eight sausages will provide two main meals for FOUR people? So that's one sausage per person per meal. With not much else to bulk out the meal nor make it filling
    • buzzyzoe
    • By buzzyzoe 23rd Sep 16, 10:32 AM
    • 391 Posts
    • 901 Thanks
    buzzyzoe
    Sorry but the above is completely unrealistic. Maybe for ONE person but certainly not to feed FOUR healthy adults. They certainly wouldn't be very healthy if they had to survive on this diet!

    For example, are you seriously suggesting a pack of eight sausages will provide two main meals for FOUR people? So that's one sausage per person per meal. With not much else to bulk out the meal nor make it filling
    Originally posted by Feral Moon
    Completely disagree with you, I have made both these meals and they have served 4 people. Firstly the toad in the hole is a lunch rather than a dinner - that would be more than enough food for me for lunch. I work on the principle of a smaller lunch and a larger dinner as that is how I eat. You could have it with rice if you were that worried about going hungry.

    Secondly, for the sausage pasta dish, the main ingredient is the spaghetti - that would be the bit that would fill you up. The sausage is to add flavour so you're not just eating plain pasta.

    I imagine you've gone along the lines of thinking that a meal needs to be mainly meat - this is not the case at all. The daily recommended intake of protein for a man is 56g, and less for women and children - this meal plan easily provides that.

    When you have such a limited budget, the important thing is to make sure people don't feel hungry. There is no way you would be able to do this if you're making meat the main component of any of the meals.
    Mortgage offer received 20/04/2014
    Mortgage at start - 72995
    Current mortgage - 47995
    Original mortgage free date - 09/2038
    Mortgage free wannabe date - 09/2020
    • AsherBat
    • By AsherBat 23rd Sep 16, 10:34 AM
    • 10 Posts
    • 42 Thanks
    AsherBat
    I tried this out to make a meal plan and didn't quite manage. It came to 25.63. I'm veggie and lactose intollerant, so eat vegan. I tried to base it on that. Still might be a useful base. Not sure it's all that healthy, although there's lots of veg. I eat more than this haha. I'll probably try to do one for under 20 when I have a bit more time.

    The Plan
    DAY 1: Curried carrot & kidney bean burgers in pitas with mango chutney & potato wedges
    1 tin kidney beans
    1 onion
    1 garlic clove
    2 carrots
    1 teaspoon curry powder
    4 tbsp oats
    Salt
    1 tbsp oil for frying
    Mango chutney
    4 sweet potatoes + 1 tbsp oil, salt, oregano
    4 pitas

    DAY 2: Spaghetti puttanesca
    400g spaghetti
    1 tbsp oil
    2 garlic cloves
    1 tin chopped tomatoes
    1 onion
    1 carrot
    jar olives
    1 chilli

    DAY 3: Flatbread (pizza style) topped with tomato sauce & veg
    500g flour
    1 tsp yeast
    Salt
    2 tbsp oil
    1 tin chopped tomatoes
    2 garlic cloves
    1 red onion
    ⅓ jar olives
    1 chilli
    Oregano

    DAY 4: Spaghetti with courgette-lemon pesto
    400g spaghetti
    350g courgettes
    3 tbsp lemon juice
    Salt
    ⅓ jar olives
    Oregano

    DAY 5: Chana Masala with garlic flatbreads
    2 tins chickpeas
    2 onions
    1 chilli
    5 garlic cloves
    2 tbsp curry powder
    4 tbsp oil
    2 tins chopped tomatoes
    Mango chutney
    500g flour
    1 tsp yeast
    Salt

    DAY 6: Sweet potato dhal with rice
    2 sweet potatoes
    2 tbsp oil
    1 red onion
    4 garlic cloves
    1 chilli
    2 tbsp curry powder
    Mango chutney
    350g lentils
    Salt
    1 stock cube
    300g rice

    DAY 7: Chilli with rice
    2 tins kidney beans
    1 red onion
    1 carrot
    2 tins chopped tomatoes
    2 Stock cubes
    1 chilli
    Oregano
    300g rice

    Breakfasts: porridge with sweetened soy milk or toasted homemade bread
    Lunches: soups with homemade bread, spiced tomato & lentil or pea & mint

    The Shopping List (from tesco, probably cheaper elsewhere)
    Fresh food
    1 pack of mint 0.70
    1 kg pack red onions 0.69
    1 kg pack brown onions 0.59
    1 350g pack of courgettes 0.60
    1 pack of chillies 0.60
    2 garlic bulbs 0.60
    1 kg pack of sweet potatoes 0.95
    4 loose carrots 0.24
    Frozen food
    2 bags of peas 1.38
    Store cupboard
    3 cartons of soy milk 2.25
    1 pack of veg stock cubes 1.50
    1 kg bag of red lentils 1.80
    1 kg bag of rice 0.45
    2 tins of chickpeas 0.70
    1 bottle of lemon juice 0.60
    1 jar of oregano 0.70
    1 jar of yeast 0.65
    2 bags of plain flour 0.90
    1 jar of black olives 0.75
    9 tins of chopped tomatoes 2.79
    2 packs of spaghetti 0.40
    1 jar of mango chutney 1.00
    1 500ml bottle of sunflower oil 0.75
    1 tub of salt 0.29
    2 1kg bags of oats 1.50
    1 jar of curry powder 1.00
    3 tins of kidney beans 0.90
    1 pack of pita breads 0.35
    Last edited by AsherBat; 23-09-2016 at 10:37 AM.
    • Feral Moon
    • By Feral Moon 23rd Sep 16, 11:59 AM
    • 2,222 Posts
    • 3,146 Thanks
    Feral Moon
    Completely disagree with you, I have made both these meals and they have served 4 people. Firstly the toad in the hole is a lunch rather than a dinner - that would be more than enough food for me for lunch. I work on the principle of a smaller lunch and a larger dinner as that is how I eat. You could have it with rice if you were that worried about going hungry.

    Secondly, for the sausage pasta dish, the main ingredient is the spaghetti - that would be the bit that would fill you up. The sausage is to add flavour so you're not just eating plain pasta.

    I imagine you've gone along the lines of thinking that a meal needs to be mainly meat - this is not the case at all. The daily recommended intake of protein for a man is 56g, and less for women and children - this meal plan easily provides that.

    When you have such a limited budget, the important thing is to make sure people don't feel hungry. There is no way you would be able to do this if you're making meat the main component of any of the meals.
    Originally posted by buzzyzoe

    No, I'm not going on the basis of needing more meat, although being a protein it would certainly fill you up and stop you becoming hungry again a lot better than a carbohydrate. And there are lots of ways to provide protein that doesn't necessarily involve meat. Eggs, for example are cheap, filling and nutritious.

    I was also looking at the amount of batter you used to make the toad in hole (around half that you used for the Yorkshires in the roast dinner) and I'm sorry but that simply wouldn't suffice to feed four adults (toddlers maybe) with just a single sausage each.

    I also don't see any vegetables other than the carrots. A little variety would be more nutritious and doesn't have to cost very much. In fact you could make enough soup to feed the entire family for a week with just some basic vegetables and barley, using the chicken carcass for stock.

    Oh, actually I see you've put chicken noodle soup down but as a main dinner? Really? Most people would look on that as a starter to their main course, not a meal in itself.

    I think the ideas are good but there's just not enough food there to realistically feed four adults for an entire week. Most children I know eat far more than that.
    • buzzyzoe
    • By buzzyzoe 23rd Sep 16, 1:00 PM
    • 391 Posts
    • 901 Thanks
    buzzyzoe
    No, I'm not going on the basis of needing more meat, although being a protein it would certainly fill you up and stop you becoming hungry again a lot better than a carbohydrate. And there are lots of ways to provide protein that doesn't necessarily involve meat. Eggs, for example are cheap, filling and nutritious.
    Originally posted by Feral Moon
    Exactly, see where I have used multiple eggs in this menu

    I was also looking at the amount of batter you used to make the toad in hole (around half that you used for the Yorkshires in the roast dinner) and I'm sorry but that simply wouldn't suffice to feed four adults (toddlers maybe) with just a single sausage each.
    Originally posted by Feral Moon
    As I said, you can have with rice if you feel that you would be hungry.

    I also don't see any vegetables other than the carrots. A little variety would be more nutritious and doesn't have to cost very much. In fact you could make enough soup to feed the entire family for a week with just some basic vegetables and barley, using the chicken carcass for stock.
    Originally posted by Feral Moon
    Vegetables
    Carrots
    Mushrooms
    Onions
    Potatoes
    Lentils (count as 1 of your 5 a day)

    See the vegetable soup on the menu plan

    Oh, actually I see you've put chicken noodle soup down but as a main dinner? Really? Most people would look on that as a starter to their main course, not a meal in itself.

    I think the ideas are good but there's just not enough food there to realistically feed four adults for an entire week. Most children I know eat far more than that.
    Originally posted by Feral Moon
    Again this is a meal I eat regularly for dinner. Either you eat too much or I eat too little..

    You seem very keen to poke holes, care to post your own menu plan so I can compare? The whole point is that it's not very easy to feed 4 people on that amount of money. If it was, everyone would do it.

    I also said that there is a small amount of money left over on my plan - this could be used for whatever you feel is lacking, be that more veg, more sausages, more noodles, whatever. For me this would be enough food and I would probably spend the extra on some herbs and seasonings to make the food more interesting, and maybe some treats - a bar of chocolate perhaps
    Last edited by buzzyzoe; 23-09-2016 at 1:04 PM.
    Mortgage offer received 20/04/2014
    Mortgage at start - 72995
    Current mortgage - 47995
    Original mortgage free date - 09/2038
    Mortgage free wannabe date - 09/2020
    • tessie bear
    • By tessie bear 23rd Sep 16, 2:49 PM
    • 4,225 Posts
    • 27,196 Thanks
    tessie bear
    great to see this thread back with us i need to get a grip of my food shopping it has got to silly amounts of money and all the cupboards and freezer are bursting at the seams

    going to stock take the freezer and use some of it and ban myself from buying any yellow stickers for a bit as need to use what i have
    on the brink...
    • Tink_04
    • By Tink_04 23rd Sep 16, 10:13 PM
    • 706 Posts
    • 3,170 Thanks
    Tink_04
    Really going to look at my meal plans so this thread is great to make a start.
    2 Savers club
    Money Saving Mission 2016
    • Feral Moon
    • By Feral Moon 24th Sep 16, 5:06 PM
    • 2,222 Posts
    • 3,146 Thanks
    Feral Moon
    Exactly, see where I have used multiple eggs in this menu



    As I said, you can have with rice if you feel that you would be hungry.



    Vegetables
    Carrots
    Mushrooms
    Onions
    Potatoes
    Lentils (count as 1 of your 5 a day)

    See the vegetable soup on the menu plan



    Again this is a meal I eat regularly for dinner. Either you eat too much or I eat too little..

    You seem very keen to poke holes, care to post your own menu plan so I can compare? The whole point is that it's not very easy to feed 4 people on that amount of money. If it was, everyone would do it.

    I also said that there is a small amount of money left over on my plan - this could be used for whatever you feel is lacking, be that more veg, more sausages, more noodles, whatever. For me this would be enough food and I would probably spend the extra on some herbs and seasonings to make the food more interesting, and maybe some treats - a bar of chocolate perhaps
    Originally posted by buzzyzoe

    Sorry, but I stand by what I said previously. The eggs you have used - only 15 to feed for 4 adults for a week - have all been used in producing batter/pancakes. I'm talking about actually using eggs as food items, e.g. scrambled, boiled, poached, omelettes, flan/quiche or even eggy bread (gypsy toast) etc.

    As a family of four adults I would expect to use at least 3 dozen eggs a week, at a cost of 3 from local sources, which would cover breakfast for everyone (nutritious and filling) plus a couple of lunch/dinner options - spaghetti carbonara, frittata, quiche etc.

    For example, for breakfast this morning we had two poached eggs each, on a slice of toasted soda bread topped with a slice of thick carved ham, a grilled tomato and a spoonful of spinach.

    Total cost 45p a person (bread & ham reduced price from Co-op) but none of us wanted any lunch and we're still not hungry at almost 5pm as it was so filling.

    Dinner will be spag bol - 400g veal mince 2.14 (Waitrose), tin of tomatoes 25p, squirt of tomato pur!e 5p, herbs, onion 10p, red pepper 20p, mushrooms 20p, black olives 20p, 300g linguine 60p, freshly grated Parmesan cheese 30p - so total cost approx 4 to feed four people.

    Total cost today to feed four people with healthy, nutritious but tasty food = 5.80 or 1.45 per person.

    Yes, you can eat healthy, nutritious food on a budget. It doesn't have to be all cheap, beige carbs which are neither nutritious nor filling.

    Ok, I can't do it for 20 a week but bare in mind this thread was started 4 years ago and food prices have increased since then. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect to spend at least 40 a week for four people, even in a tight budget. That's just 10 per week each!
    • ariarnia
    • By ariarnia 24th Sep 16, 5:13 PM
    • 905 Posts
    • 2,680 Thanks
    ariarnia
    As a family of four adults I would expect to use at least 3 dozen eggs a week, at a cost of 3 from local sources, which would cover breakfast for everyone (nutritious and filling) plus a couple of lunch/dinner options - spaghetti carbonara, frittata, quiche etc.
    Originally posted by Feral Moon
    erm... Don't you find that many eggs dreadfully ... binding?

    I mean, that's 9 eggs per person in a single week.

    We get through maybe 12 or so in a week with two adults and two tiny sproglets

    And quite often that's savoury pancakes or batter based (It's not like making them into a batter effects their protein levels)

    I thought the menu given was quite varied and have stolen some of the recipes for my meal planner - including the lovely sounding noodle soup.
    Almost everything will work again if you unplug it for a few minutes, including you. Anne Lamott

    It's amazing how those with a can-do attitude and willingness to 'pitch in and work' get all the luck, isn't it?
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