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  • FIRST POST
    • jacobsdaduk
    • By jacobsdaduk 23rd Nov 11, 4:25 PM
    • 163Posts
    • 57Thanks
    jacobsdaduk
    1&1 internet persuing me via debt collection agency Arvato
    • #1
    • 23rd Nov 11, 4:25 PM
    1&1 internet persuing me via debt collection agency Arvato 23rd Nov 11 at 4:25 PM
    Not sure where to post this - hope this is the right place...

    About 18 months ago I bought a domain name and basic hosting package from 1&1 internet. It got to the end of the year and I had no intention of continuing with the service so let it expire.

    Around this time, I got an email from 1&1 telling me that they had tried to take monies for the next year but my debit card had been declined for around £70. I emailed them back within 30 minutes of the email saying that I didn't want the service anymore. Annoyingly, I got an auto response telling that the email address concerned didn't accept incoming email so I had to go on their website and send a message.

    A few days later they replied telling me I have to go online to cancel my account which I did immediately and received a cancellation email.

    That was the end of it….or so I thought.

    Recently I got an email from a company called Arvato who are instructed by 1&1 to pursue me for the “debt” (they had to email me as I have moved address). I explained to them that I cancelled the domain, supplied them with lots of emails to show I had acted in good faith and also a copy of the confirmation of cancellation.

    Today they have replied to say “Unfortunately, your cancellation was processed after the date that your invoice was raised. 1&1 Internet Ltd’s terms and conditions stipulate that cancellations must be processed at least fourteen days prior to the renewal date which has not been the case with your account” and asked me to pay.

    I’m not aware of any agreement that said I would allow repeat billing and I certainly didn’t sign a credit agreement. I did act in good faith as soon as I saw that I had been invoiced and I did take all steps to cancel the service as soon as I realised I was being billed for it.

    I think it’s grossly unfair that I am now being pursued for this given that it was never made clear to me and I would like to know who/where I can turn to next. Would this be a matter for the FOS? Should I let them issue proceedings and then show the court what I did? Are there any documents I can request to help my case?

    Any advice would be gratefully received. This has now become a matter of principal for me and I’m not prepared to have my credit record blighted by 1&1’s sneaky business practices! Have I got any rights?
    Happy with my advice? The please use the 'thanks' button vvvvvvvvvvvvv
Page 7
    • DaveJewell
    • By DaveJewell 24th Aug 17, 6:42 PM
    • 1 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    DaveJewell
    Just so that people know, this scam is still continuing, despite the fact that the first messages in this thread go back to 2011 or so!

    I'm the webmaster for a church in N.Wales which has done a lot of good work amongst the hopeless. For quite a few years, we had a domain with 1&1 but in recent times, their prices have been increasing more and more quickly. One month, I think I received two price hikes within a week!

    In addition to the above, it became clear that 1&1 were not providing the web storage space that we needed to host our MP3 messages. With all these things in view, I tried to cancel our domains and break off all connection with 1&1. I did what I could to cancel the domains and contracts online, and I sent a "proof of delivery" letter to 1&1 explaining why we wanted to cancel.

    And - yes - you've guessed right. We are now being actively pursued by Arvato. Initially, we decided not to pay the outstanding charges (the ALLEGEDLY outstanding charges) because we felt that it was morally wrong to pay for services we're not using. But we felt intimidated by Arvato collection agency and reluctantly paid the money. At the end of the online payment process, a message popped up to say "This doesn't completely clear your debts, so would you like to setup an online account for future payments" - or words to that effect. Worrying...

    Needless to say, another payment notification arrived from Arvato yesterday. Again, (probably stupidly!) I have paid that because we did have more than one domain with 1&1. However, after discovering this thread this morning, I now realise that was a stupid thing to do.

    We will not pay any more money to 1&1, (via Arvato or otherwise) and would like to recover the spurious payments already made. We will happily fight this in the small claims court because it is now obvious that it's just a scam. We would also like to write to the Financial Services Ombudsman and make them aware of the behaviour of this company.

    Any help or advice you can offer would be appreciated,
    Dave
    • thepostman1
    • By thepostman1 26th Aug 17, 3:23 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    thepostman1
    1 & 1 debt collection
    It would appear that they are still at it

    Just got a letter from arvato today demanding £28.19 not bad since the domain was only around £12.00.

    I notice that nobody seems to have posted in years, have they stopped been such bad boys, or more likely lost all their customers.

    Will be sending a letter using the points that have been made in the forum and daring them to take me to court.

    I doubt whether it is legal what they are doing but if it never gets tested - Am I now the only one out here or are other s still getting set up by this scam
    Last edited by thepostman1; 26-08-2017 at 3:28 PM.
    • thepostman1
    • By thepostman1 26th Aug 17, 10:25 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    thepostman1
    Have been doing research on 1 & 1 and it looks like all these negative comments are having an effect.

    The total number of domains as fallen through the floor, if it keeps up like this, they may not be around to send out the demands.

    Cant post link as a newbie but see

    webhostinggeeks.com/providers/1and1

    The comments are unbelievably bad, I bet that they will do anything to avoid the publicity of a court case ,like previous members have said they are just chancing their luck with the threats
    • principles101
    • By principles101 25th Sep 17, 10:27 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    principles101
    They are still at it with this scam
    I got the same letter and emails. I took up one of their 99p sign up offers for a year and didn't renew and cancelled my paypal auo renewal too. They are now chasing me on this, but as other have said, I will be taking it up with trading standard and also sending them a very nice mail


    Cannot believe they are still trying it?
    • principles101
    • By principles101 25th Sep 17, 10:31 PM
    • 2 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    principles101
    Got the same problem so I have researched the interent and here is the letter I am about to send. Ill post here if it works.

    Arvato Limited
    PO Box 321
    Willerby
    Hull
    HU10 6WF

    8th April 2015
    Your Ref:
    Dear Sir/Madam
    Further to your letter dated the 31 March 2015, I am writing to inform you that the debt you claim is due to 1&1 is disputed by myself on the basis that the service required was for a fixed term and I paid for that term in advance. The service was not required and not paid for beyond that term.

    Any claim to the contrary will remain in dispute and will need to be settle in a UK court of law or arbitration on the basis that Clause 3, Duration and Renewal of service, of the 1&1 contract is incompatible with the UK’s Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulation 1999, Schedule 2, section H) copied for your information below.

    Should you wish to dispute this you are required to provide evidence to the contrary as per section Q) of the regulations also copied below and agree to arbitration?

    As per clause 32 of the 1&1 contract it is recognised by 1&1 that some terms and condition may be incompatible with some law and I believe clause 3 to be such a clause for the UK.

    “The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999
    SCHEDULE 2
    INDICATIVE AND NON-EXHAUSTIVE LIST OF TERMS WHICH MAY BE REGARDED AS UNFAIR

    h) automatically extending a contract of fixed duration where the consumer does not indicate otherwise, when the deadline fixed for the consumer to express his desire not to extend the contract is unreasonably early;

    (q)excluding or hindering the consumer’s right to take legal action or exercise any other legal remedy, particularly by requiring the consumer to take disputes exclusively to arbitration not covered by legal provisions, unduly restricting the evidence available to him or imposing on him a burden of proof which, according to the applicable law, should lie with another party to the contract.”

    “1&1 Terms
    3. Duration and Renewal of Services
    Unless otherwise specified, Services are provided for a minimum contract term of 12 months and unless cancelled in accordance with Clause 4 below will automatically be renewed for the billing period You chose on sign up.

    32. Severability
    In the event that any provision of this Agreement is deemed unenforceable or invalid under any applicable law or pursuant to a court decision, such unenforceability or invalidity shall not render this Agreement unenforceable or invalid as a whole. We will amend or replace such provisions with one that is valid and enforceable and which achieves, in our reasonable opinion, to the fullest extent possible, the original objectives and intent between You and Us.”

    As the next step I recommend you confer with your client as to whether you wish to pursue this claim in the light of the legal standing protecting me from such clauses but note that should I need to engage legal counsel or incur any other costs in respect to this matter these will be submitted to the court or arbitrator as costs to be repaid by 1&1 and / or Arvato Limited should your claim be rejected and my position found in law to be accepted.

    I must also advise that any time taken to present this position in court or to an arbitrator that results in a loss of earning will also be included in any claim as part of reasonable costs.

    Thus far, time and effort is limited to this letter and I attribute no cost to this however should you wish to pursue this claim costs will be incurred on my part thereafter and added to any costs claim in court or with the arbitrator.

    Note any claim for costs on my part falls outside of clause 18 of the 1&1 liability disclaimer as it is not attributed to the service but to the defence of the claim against me.

    I look forward to your reply stating whether you intend to pursue this claim or accept that it is in fact based on a clause that is incompatible with “The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999” as stated above.

    For clarity I have also included below the guidance notes for “The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999” concerning the practices employed by your client.

    Unfair contract terms guidance 49
    Group 8: Excessive notice periods for consumer cancellation – paragraph 1(h) of Schedule 2.
    Schedule 2, paragraph 1, states that terms may be unfair if they have the object or effect of:

    (h) automatically extending a contract of fixed duration where the consumer does not indicate otherwise, when the deadline fixed for the consumer to express his desire not to extend the contract is unreasonably early.

    8.1 A clause which states how long a contract has to run is likely to be among its most important 'core' terms

    24 If a lesser term in small print can be used, relying on customer inertia, to extend the contract period beyond what the consumer would normally expect, it is not a core term, and is liable to be considered unfair.

    8.2 Particular suspicion attaches to a term in a contract for a fixed period which, if early notice to cancel is not given, automatically commits the consumer to a renewed fixed term.


    Yours sincerely
    Originally posted by Wont be Broken

    How did you get on with this?
    • beebrook
    • By beebrook 26th Sep 17, 10:55 AM
    • 40 Posts
    • 49 Thanks
    beebrook
    1&1 are greasy !!!!!!!s.
    • All of their prices are quoted ex VAT.
    • To cancel, you have to 'request' it via their website, then 'confirm your cancellation' over the phone. It takes hours to get through sometimes.
    • All of their quoted prices are 'introductory' and increase.
    • They hike their prices way beyond RPI when they can get away with it.
    Not a company you want to deal with.
    Debt to date: £4731.75 - 97.2% left to go
    Debt upon joining (Sep'2017): £4,870 - Loans, Credit Cards & Nationwide Overdraft
    • thepostman1
    • By thepostman1 30th Sep 17, 5:39 PM
    • 3 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    thepostman1
    1 & 1 debt collection -- continued
    Just a post to let anyone who is been pestered by 1&1's "auto-renewal" scam know how I got on.

    I have written 2 letters based on some of the info gained in this forum.
    Basically said that that I did not owe them any money and that their legal grounds where very suspect, did they have any precedence?

    Since I have given Arvato Financial Solutions (now based in Glasgow not Hull) such a hard time they seem to have given up before they began.
    The last letter (nice big A4 flat envelope) stated that the case would now be handed back to 1 & 1, do you really want us to do that (Hell no!! I am scared).

    The funny thing is today got an email stated that they had purchased another of my domains (I am locked out of the account and 100% certain this domain was CANCELLED!!!)

    Their emails seem to confirm this, so the only thing I can think of is that they are buying domains that they can sell on.

    What I bunch of CROOKS, I cant see them demanding payment because their own emails confirm that the domain was cancelled.

    Anyway if you are hassled by the 1&1 crooks you can either ignore them and will probably have go through the torture of endless phone calls (DONT GIVE THEM YOUR NUMBER) and threatening letters/emails, apparently you even get one threatening to take you to court (dont be fooled)

    If you contact them like I did, you can amuse yourself with Arvato repeating that you owe money regardless what you say.

    Contacting them or ignoring them in my opinion will result in the same result, they will crawl back under the stone they came from (hopefully without you giving them any money).

    If you feel you must do something I would suggest

    1. You contact 1&1, tell them you are disgusted with their actions, you do not owe any money and demand an immediate termination of any contracts with 1&1.

    Keep the proof of postage, I sent it by recorded (they never signed, what a surprise)

    2 Contact Arvato, tell them the bill is disputed and you are not prepared to enter into any negotiations with them, if they get bad with the debt collection stuff then send them a schedule of your fees.

    I await in fear now the case is back with 1&1, looks to me like they are going through the domains in my account looking to what they can grab.
    BUNCH OF CROOKS
    • MatthewSquizza
    • By MatthewSquizza 10th Oct 17, 1:04 AM
    • 5 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    MatthewSquizza
    Welcome to the club
    Just joined the club! Can't believe this scam goes back to 2011 and they're still getting away with it today!

    I'm at dispute stage but just cancelled credit card and asked for merchant block. Will no doubt be getting harassing emails from Arvato in a matter of weeks trying to enforce money for what is a scam.

    My experience in a nutshell - I phoned up in August to reduce package from 3 products a month to just 1. Instead of doing that they've cancelled only one (cheapest one, what a coincidence) and added another and renewed it for a year so the price went up instead of down despite receiving less services. The guy in august said he'd cancelled what I asked but clearly just added stuff to my contract until 12 months are up and now 3 months have past they can now claim I didn't inform them within 14 days etc. According to them my case notes for the call (where I asked to cancel and they confirmed) was they've written down that this conversation consisted of them asking me to call same number back to cancel at another time when cancellation dept is open! Utter liar.

    Gobsmacked they're allowed to get away with this when there's so many of us.
    Last edited by MatthewSquizza; 10-10-2017 at 1:07 AM. Reason: Clarifying missing detail
    • MatthewSquizza
    • By MatthewSquizza 15th Oct 17, 8:17 PM
    • 5 Posts
    • 0 Thanks
    MatthewSquizza
    2nd client move away from 1and1
    In addition to above, tried to move a 2nd client away from 1and1 and shocked with what I've found, like to think this is just some weird bug but it's so suspect:

    I can't post links because I"m new but i've uploaded the footage to youtube under title:
    "The 1and1 renewal scam" search that and you'll see why I think they're dodgey.
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