IMPORTANT! This is MoneySavingExpert's open forum - anyone can post

Please exercise caution & report any spam, illegal, offensive, racist, libellous post to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com

  • Be nice to all MoneySavers
  • All the best tips go in the MoneySavingExpert weekly email

    Plus all the new guides, deals & loopholes

  • No spam/referral links
or Login with Facebook
Crown Land Securities
Closed Thread
Views: 3,920
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
# 1
Rayos
Old 15-09-2006, 11:26 AM
MoneySaving Newbie
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Buckinghamshire
Posts: 4
Question Crown Land Securities

Hi - my first post on here. I was browsing the Daily Telegraph website and saw a banner ad for Crown Land Securities www.crownlandsecurities.co.uk and a competition to win some land. So I entered. Have now had a salesman ("Senior Portfolio Advisor") call me and explain the deal (£8000 for a small plot of land without planning permission). This is termed Land Banking and investors gamble on planning permission being granted. I wanted to ask if anyone has used this company or heard anything about them. I feel this may be a scam, but the fact that this was via Telegraph site makes me wonder. Many thanks for any responses.
Rayos is offline
Report Post
# 2
dmg24
Old 15-09-2006, 11:48 AM
Deliciously Dedicated Diehard MoneySaving Devotee
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 29,862
Default

I don't have personal experience of them but I have heard about it, and it is a scam. Avoid at all costs! x
dmg24 is offline
Report Post
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to dmg24 For This Useful Post: Show me >>
# 3
Raggie
Old 15-09-2006, 12:16 PM
MoneySaving Stalwart
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 502
Default

Scam is a bit hard..

They buy agrigutual land at £X per acre.. divide it into little bits and sell at £(X*100) per cm..

the theroy goes.. one person applying to build houses on land wil lbe declined..

if you have 100 applications for the same land then you have a better chance of it being granted..

whats even better they make bucketloads on peoples hopes to make a good profit.... so win win :rolleyes:

sorry if I sound sceptical..
The only place where success comes before work is the dictionary…
Raggie is offline
Report Post
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Raggie For This Useful Post: Show me >>
# 4
Rayos
Old 15-09-2006, 12:19 PM
MoneySaving Newbie
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Buckinghamshire
Posts: 4
Default

Thanks Raggie & dmg24 - sounded too good to be true and as usual it seems it is!
Rayos is offline
Report Post
# 5
Debt_Free_Chick
Old 15-09-2006, 12:32 PM
Deliciously Dedicated Diehard MoneySaving Devotee
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Beautiful Sussex
Posts: 13,141
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rayos
This is termed Land Banking and investors gamble on planning permission being granted.
And if you don't get planning permission? I think the word "gamble" says it all.

Quote:
I wanted to ask if anyone has used this company or heard anything about them. I feel this may be a scam, but the fact that this was via Telegraph site makes me wonder. Many thanks for any responses.
I think you'll find that just about anyone can advertise on the Telegraph site - no-one vets them. You'll probably find that in small print, the Telegraph accepts no responsibility for the legitimacy of advertisers and that they suggest you take your own advise.

Some land is actually earmarked as potentially for development. Some land is earmarked as "no development". You don't need to pay anyone to find this out - but you do need to go through each local planning authority's Local Plan to find out which land falls in to which category.

I suppose you could call it a scam - although I think it's probably legal. They are probably giving what they promise - which is an introduction to land that might get planning permission.
Debt_Free_Chick is offline
Report Post
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Debt_Free_Chick For This Useful Post: Show me >>
# 6
noyk
Old 15-09-2006, 2:01 PM
MoneySaving Stalwart
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 251
Default

it is a scam, agricultural land is about 2-4k per acre. If you need/want to buy some buy a country magazine, dont buy it from someone selling at 100% markup because they attach a "may be granted planning permission in the future" tag to it!
noyk is offline
Report Post
The Following User Says Thank You to noyk For This Useful Post: Show me >>
# 7
RHemmings
Old 15-09-2006, 2:11 PM
Serious MoneySaving Fan
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,756
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Debt_Free_Chick
Some land is actually earmarked as potentially for development. Some land is earmarked as "no development". You don't need to pay anyone to find this out - but you do need to go through each local planning authority's Local Plan to find out which land falls in to which category.
How do you get to see the local planning authority's Local Plan? Are these plans available online, or does it depend on the authority?
RHemmings is offline
Report Post
# 8
Me Myself
Old 15-09-2006, 5:52 PM
MoneySaving Stalwart
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 519
Default

*Bump*

I'd like to know the same thing as RHemmings.

Any ideas please?
Things can only get better.
Me Myself is offline
Report Post
# 9
Victoria Falls
Old 15-09-2006, 6:00 PM
MoneySaving Convert
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 47
Default

Local Plan / Development plans - you can either type in your council followed by local plan or unitary development plan in google and see if there is a page? or a really good site is www.planningportal.gov.uk there is a wealth of knowledge on here. Go to http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/eng...425564270.html

click view development plans (left hand side) and type you council in. if there is a plan available it will say. Look on the left hand side for proposals map.

If the council you have is not on the planning portal, let me know the council and i will see if there is link to it. Most councils are slowly but surely heading towards the web to show items such as development plans. If it is not on your web, you can pop down to the council to view the hard copy. Some librarys also have it on display.

Last edited by Victoria Falls; 15-09-2006 at 6:14 PM.
Victoria Falls is offline
Report Post
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Victoria Falls For This Useful Post: Show me >>
# 10
HenryJames
Old 02-04-2007, 9:21 PM
MoneySaving Newbie
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 4
Default Where does your info come from?

I don't really know where you have got your info from. Land Banking has been around for years. Crown is very reputable and we have dealt with them on many occassions and had good returns.
It is all about doing proper research into the area you intend to purchase a plot.
There are clear risks but these guys are experts and know what they are doing.
Yes they make a lot of money but so could you.
The world is still round- these techniques were used all the time by private land owners and bokers say 15 years ago but now for many reasons there are opportunities for the private investor too.
You cannot call this a scam. It is not a get rich fix but should be part of a structured investment plan.
If I could give any advice it would be to take your investments seriously, do your homework; don't just listen to some guy on this site and who has no idea of what he is talking about.
HenryJames is offline
Report Post
# 11
Generali
Old 02-04-2007, 9:30 PM
Deliciously Dedicated Diehard MoneySaving Devotee
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 25,703
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HenryJames View Post
I don't really know where you have got your info from. Land Banking has been around for years. Crown is very reputable and we have dealt with them on many occassions and had good returns.
It is all about doing proper research into the area you intend to purchase a plot.
There are clear risks but these guys are experts and know what they are doing.
Yes they make a lot of money but so could you.
The world is still round- these techniques were used all the time by private land owners and bokers say 15 years ago but now for many reasons there are opportunities for the private investor too.
You cannot call this a scam. It is not a get rich fix but should be part of a structured investment plan.
If I could give any advice it would be to take your investments seriously, do your homework; don't just listen to some guy on this site and who has no idea of what he is talking about.
Why would a speculative bet on getting planning permission be a good investment? It's not like the purchaser is getting any income from the land and it's an expensive way of buying agricultural land.

I'd be interested to know your thinking.

Are you connected with this company or a similar one by any chance? I notice you haven't posted before.
Today me will live in the moment unless the moment is unpleasant in which case me will eat a cookie. The Cookie Monster
Generali is offline
Report Post
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Generali For This Useful Post: Show me >>
# 12
Doozergirl
Old 02-04-2007, 10:24 PM
Deliciously Dedicated Diehard MoneySaving Devotee
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Midlands
Posts: 18,335
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HenryJames View Post
I don't really know where you have got your info from. Land Banking has been around for years. Crown is very reputable and we have dealt with them on many occassions and had good returns.
It is all about doing proper research into the area you intend to purchase a plot.
There are clear risks but these guys are experts and know what they are doing.
Yes they make a lot of money but so could you.
The world is still round- these techniques were used all the time by private land owners and bokers say 15 years ago but now for many reasons there are opportunities for the private investor too.
You cannot call this a scam. It is not a get rich fix but should be part of a structured investment plan.
If I could give any advice it would be to take your investments seriously, do your homework; don't just listen to some guy on this site and who has no idea of what he is talking about.

Rubbish. As part of a "structured investment plan" I could buy an entire field of greenbelt land with the hope of obtaining planning permission for an entire development of houses in the future. That would be a less risky investment because I'd stand to make a great deal more money and at the very least I'd stand a hope of getting a development plan agreed which would meet the local plan at the time.

When you say good returns, have you had planning permission granted on any of your plots? When PP is granted, who owns the land where the road is planned to run (and presumably the services will need to go) to access these particular plots? Presuming it is Crown Investments how is the contract worded to allow the plot owners access to their land and public services without incurring more cost?

Funny how this is such a hot topic for a newbie after 6.5 months. :rolleyes:
But I'm just some 'guy' who doesn't know what they're talking about :confused:

Tesco "land bank". I hardly think that buying 0.1acres of a field in rural Staffordshire qualifies as that.
Doozergirl is offline
Report Post
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Doozergirl For This Useful Post: Show me >>
# 13
HenryJames
Old 02-04-2007, 11:30 PM
MoneySaving Newbie
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 4
Default Difference of opinion/Strategy

I am in no way connected with this company or any other of its kind.
I have used two 'Land Banking' companies and admit they are not the correct investment for everybody. However, they have both done me well and I have been more than happy with my return (which has typically been x4 my outlay).
To clarify; the plots which you purchase are not really done so with the thought of you building on them but with the hope that PP will be granted and the land then sold to a developer for profit. It is a relatively passive investment as the company acts as the broker, applies for PP etc etc
The sites are well identified and researched.
I can understand your views and as I have said this is not for everyone. However, I have been investing in and developing property for about 11 years now, my whole professional life, and I have found that land banking fits well into my strategy of investment as a mid to long term investment. I certainly would not suggest putting all my eggs into one basket and going for broke with this system but to say it does not work is not correct. It does and I have seen it happen and had the rewards myself.
I am sorry that being a 'newbie' on this site does not, in some eyes, grant me much authority.
HenryJames is offline
Report Post
# 14
HenryJames
Old 02-04-2007, 11:33 PM
MoneySaving Newbie
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 4
Default

ps I do not understand the Tesco comment or know anything about investing in rural Staffordshire.
HenryJames is offline
Report Post
# 15
Doozergirl
Old 02-04-2007, 11:42 PM
Deliciously Dedicated Diehard MoneySaving Devotee
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Midlands
Posts: 18,335
Default

Well, you may be missing the irony bone but you haven't answered my questions which I felt were quite clear?

"When you say good returns, have you had planning permission granted on any of your plots? When PP is granted, who owns the land where the road is planned to run (and presumably the services will need to go) to access these particular plots? Presuming it is Crown Investments how is the contract worded to allow the plot owners access to their land and public services without incurring more cost?"
Doozergirl is offline
Report Post
The Following User Says Thank You to Doozergirl For This Useful Post: Show me >>
# 16
Doozergirl
Old 02-04-2007, 11:44 PM
Deliciously Dedicated Diehard MoneySaving Devotee
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Midlands
Posts: 18,335
Default

Of what benefit is it to a plot owner if CLS own 49% of the potential development land when each plot has it's own freehold title?
Doozergirl is offline
Report Post
# 17
HenryJames
Old 03-04-2007, 12:03 AM
MoneySaving Newbie
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 4
Default Doozer

You are clearly not a believer in this. That is ok.
It works and has made me alot of money.

The answer to your question is I don't know who owns the road, I don't really care. By the time building starts I already have my return! and yes several sites have been granted PP.

I do not quite understand the other question but of course it is in their interest to own half the site, they make alot of money from that.

Are you sure you understand the concept?

I find you quite bullish and rude; and there is no need. I am intitled to my opinion just as you are. You think this system does not work, I know it does because I have been involved first hand.

Maybe you should try it!!

I have nothing further to add.
HenryJames is offline
Report Post
# 18
Doozergirl
Old 03-04-2007, 12:15 AM
Deliciously Dedicated Diehard MoneySaving Devotee
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Midlands
Posts: 18,335
Default

If you read through my posts, you'll find that I'm neither bullish nor rude when someone has something genuine to give or ask. I am asking genuine questions and whilst being cynical, you have the perfect opportunity to answer those questions with the benefit of having invested. You will have to forgive me if I assume that you didn't read through the last six months of posts before finally deciding to reply on this particular thread and choosing not to post on any other thread at all.
Maybe I'd try it (as you suggest) if someone could give me a little more useful information :confused:. Investing in property myself and this being a MoneySaving site, I like to research exactly what it is before my money into something. Perhaps you aren't personally involved; you're either being evasive or don't seem to know very much about this company that you have dealt with many times :confused:

I'd genuinely love to see examples of the developments that have sprung up as a result of these small plots being sold off seperately.

Last edited by Doozergirl; 03-04-2007 at 12:19 AM.
Doozergirl is offline
Report Post
The Following User Says Thank You to Doozergirl For This Useful Post: Show me >>
# 19
ABN
Old 03-04-2007, 12:30 AM
MoneySaving Stalwart
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 227
Default

http://www.propertyscam.org.uk/
ABN is offline
Report Post
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to ABN For This Useful Post: Show me >>
# 20
Doozergirl
Old 03-04-2007, 12:38 AM
Deliciously Dedicated Diehard MoneySaving Devotee
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Midlands
Posts: 18,335
Default

From an article in the Observer linked to from the site linked to by ABN (iyswim!):

"...Anyone tempted by one of these investments should bear in mind the fact that there is not a single known example to date of a site divided up into small investment plots receiving planning permission for development - despite what any of the salesmen claim about their 'track record'."

"Hayden James, for example, claims on its website that 'land prices over the past 20 years have seen consistent rises totalling over 1,000 per cent with no signs of slowing'."

Nothing to do with you, HenryJames? Or would that be too much of a coincidence?

Last edited by Doozergirl; 03-04-2007 at 12:41 AM.
Doozergirl is offline
Report Post
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Doozergirl For This Useful Post: Show me >>
Closed Thread

Bookmarks
 
 




Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

 Forum Jump  

Contact Us - MoneySavingExpert.com - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

All times are GMT +1. The time now is 8:41 PM.

 Forum Jump  

Free MoneySaving Email

Top deals: Week of 20 August 2014

Get all this & more in MoneySavingExpert's weekly email full of guides, vouchers and Deals

GET THIS FREE WEEKLY EMAIL Full of deals, guides & it's spam free

Latest News & Blogs

Martin's Twitter Feed

profile

Cheap Travel Money

Find the best online rate for holiday cash with MSE's TravelMoneyMax.

Find the best online rate for your holiday cash with MoneySavingExpert's TravelMoneyMax.

TuneChecker Top Albums

  • VARIOUS ARTISTSNOW THAT'S WHAT I CALL MUSIC! 88
  • ED SHEERANX (DELUXE EDITION)
  • COLLABROSTARS

MSE's Twitter Feed

profile
Always remember anyone can post on the MSE forums, so it can be very different from our opinion.
We use Skimlinks and other affiliated links in some of our boards, for some of our users.