Please put me out of my misery...

mlang88 · 30 May 2017 at 8:43PM

I have just read bargepole's thread on irrelevant defences and would just like someone to tell me whether or not any of these are permissible at all (I've got a court date - SIPS & Gladstones)

- Parked in the car park 10 times previously, have evidence and was never issued a ticket
- Paid for parking on the day
- I know the 'but there was no loss to the claimant' argument is considered a dead duck, but in this instance they were £2 up from me (pushing it a bit far perhaps?) and there's a £2 car park literally across the way, so no real gain for me to park there?
- I appealed the original 'PCN' on the grounds that I thought the SIPS warden hadn't seen my ticket, but this was rejected and the charge doubled (at which point I decided £65 was ridiculous)
- My MP has even been in touch with them to try and lower the charge to the original £35 but no avail
Please help!!

:(

Just want to know whether or not I even have a case at all or whether or not I should just take whatever punishment they have for me

Thanks in advance

waamo · 30 May 2017 at 8:52PM

What was the reason they ticketed you? If you paid then I think you probably have a very strong case. Several fluttering ticket cases have been thrown out recently. Seems some judges feel they are a waste of court time.

mlang88 · 30 May 2017 at 9:00PM

waamo wrote: »

What was the reason they ticketed you? If you paid then I think you probably have a very strong case. Several fluttering ticket cases have been thrown out recently. Seems some judges feel they are a waste of court time.

Ah sorry, this is probably a very pertinent point this I missed off there - it was a 'Permit Only' which had changed from a cheap £2 all day car park some time recently. I spoke to SIPS (mistake I know) who told me that they had decided to be lenient on ticketing people for a period but had all of a sudden decided to issue tickets. They had A4 sized signage up at one point, but when I went back to take a picture it had been replaced with a large sign.

Give it to me straight doctor, I've got no hope have I? Everyone says it, but it just feels mightily disproportionate (the likely £300 fine)

Thanks

Redx · 30 May 2017 at 9:06PM

mlang88 wrote: »

Give it to me straight doctor, I've got no hope have I? Everyone says it, but it just feels mightily disproportionate (the likely £300 fine)

Thanks

a court case isnt that simple or that black and white

there are many defence arguments for any court case, including no contract , poor signage , the fact they accepted the money (so variance of contract) , any NTK or POFA2012 errors or failures, a myriad of factors and its judge bingo on the day of the court case

so if you think anyone here can study your case on the above megre offerings and expect them to provide a decision then it wont happen

BARRY BEAVIS thought he had a good case and failed 3 times to 10 out of 11 judges

its all about rights of audience , signage , contracts , laws , precedents and any other dozen aspects that can influence your court case

it would be there job to prove what the signage said on the day

you can allege they accepted the parking contract because they took your £2

I am sure there are many other legal arguments for your defence too

if its one parking charge , then its not £300 , more like £175 if you lost , plus its not a "fine" , never was , it would be a judgment against you if you lost

waamo · 30 May 2017 at 9:11PM

Permit parking. Great. Bit of research and you stand a very good chance of seeing this off.

If they have not ticketed you before then they obviously have some sort of whitelist of cars they know and shouldn't ticket. In which case there is no need to ticket you if they are aware you have permission to park there.

You need to read the Newbies thread at the top of this section. It is an incredibly comprehensive guide including court defences.

prosaver · 30 May 2017 at 9:17PM

i got a ticket for not displaying a ticket, it blown off the dashboard when i closed the door, i got off with a warning when i explained what happened.

mlang88 · 30 May 2017 at 9:22PM

Thank you both - I felt I had read the Newbies thread from top to bottom, couldn't quite see how my case really fit in with the others as there seemed to be stronger grounds and I felt as though I was potentially relying on either good will, or some little known legal precedent I would never find.

My thinking was that after accepting my £2 (and on 10 previous occasions) does that not then become an agreement/contract that we have entered into seeing as though this was never 'punished'? Feels like a potential grey area?

mlang88 · 30 May 2017 at 9:23PM

prosaver wrote: »

i got a ticket for not displaying a ticket, it blown off the dashboard when i closed the door, i got off with a warning when i explained what happened.

This has actually happened to me previously and I've been 'let off' too, which has only contributed to my frustration more in this instance

prosaver · 30 May 2017 at 9:26PM

mlang88 wrote: »

This has actually happened to me previously and I've been 'let off' too, which has only contributed to my frustration more in this instance

i read on it on another thread as they suppose to make the tickets sticky

prosaver · 30 May 2017 at 9:31PM

thought i seen it b4
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=parking+ticket+blew+off+dashboard&oq=parking+ticket+blew+of&aqs=chrome.1.69i57j0l4.20798j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

Coupon-mad · 31 May 2017 at 12:17AM

prosaver wrote: »

i got a ticket for not displaying a ticket, it blown off the dashboard when i closed the door, i got off with a warning when i explained what happened.

But this case isn't even about a fluttering ticket.

Your advice on this forum is suspect, please stick around and read & learn from posts if this area of MSE interests you but best not to post misleading stuff. Start slowly, we all did, years ago. You can learn loads here.

The OP here is saying the use of the car park changed but the signs were not obvious to bring that change of rules to anyone's attention and clearly they were still accepting P&D payments and letting a machine dish out tickets, therefore they allowed a variation of contract (P&D) to continue at this site, never mind the small signs which might have said it was now 'permits only'.

It it were really ''permits only'' then the machines would have been disabled/removed, and they were not.

Give it to me straight doctor, I've got no hope have I? Everyone says it, but it just feels mightily disproportionate (the likely £300 fine)

On the contrary - it sounds to me that you have a solid case to defend it.

My thinking was that after accepting my £2 (and on 10 previous occasions) does that not then become an agreement/contract that we have entered into.

Yes indeed. We would agree.

Have you already submitted the defence you stated in post #1, and if so, when is your court date and what is your upcoming date to exchange evidence and Witness Statements with the other side (check the local court letter if you have one yet).

Please put me out of my misery...

Comments

Categories

Get our FREE Weekly email full of deals & guides - and it’s spam-free