Ask Atos Healthcare disability assessment questions

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  • halight
    halight Posts: 3,629
    First Anniversary Combo Breaker
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    Rise in Atos rulings overturned by appeals

    http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/379841/Rise-in-Atos-rulings-overturned-by-appeals
    Appeals against the decisions are costing the taxpayer £50million a year.
    Gillian Guy, chief executive of Citizens Advice, said failure to get medical assessments right the first time was undermining the Government’s welfare reform programme.

    She said: “Disabled people and taxpayers are still paying far too high a price for mistakes made in benefit assessments of who is fit for work.”


    Must be all that Training that the Atos PR reap has told us about
    :jYou can have everything you wont in lfe, If you only help enough other people to get what they wont.:j
  • FTW
    FTW Posts: 8,682 Forumite
    halight wrote: »
    Rise in Atos rulings overturned by appeals

    http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/379841/Rise-in-Atos-rulings-overturned-by-appeals






    Must be all that Training that the Atos PR reap has told us about

    Severely penalising Atoss for overturned decisions is the first decision that should be implemented, and if they argue against it on contractual grounds, then the DWP contract in its entirety should be made public.
  • I found this which is very interesting and shows a possible connection between this forum and Atos?

    WHOIS information for moneysavingexpert.com:

    [Querying whois.verisign-grs.com]
    [whois.verisign-grs.com]
    Whois Server Version 2.0
    Domain names in the .com and .net domains can now be registered
    with many different competing registrars. Go to http://www.internic.net
    for detailed information.
    Domain Name: MONEYSAVINGEXPERT.COM
    Registrar: MELBOURNE IT, LTD. D/B/A INTERNET NAMES WORLDWIDE
    Whois Server: whois.melbourneit.com
    Referral URL: http://www.melbourneit.com



    Registry Details: Registrar: MELBOURNE IT, LTD. D/B/A INTERNET NAMES WORLDWIDE Status: clientTransferProhibited Created On: 2011-01-21 Expires On: 2013-06-07 Updated On: 2012-05-03 Name Server: ns1.ext.origin-it.com Name Server: ns2.ext.origin-it.com


    Raw Whois:
    Domain Name.......... origin-it.com Creation Date........ 1996-06-07 Registration Date.... 2011-01-21 Expiry Date.......... 2013-06-07 Organisation Name.... Atos Origin NSS global factory Organisation Address. Kraszewskiego 1 Organisation Address. Organisation Address. Organisation Address. Bydgoszcz Organisation Address. 85-240 Organisation Address. Bydgoszcz Organisation Address. POLAND Admin Name........... Atos Origin NSS global factory Admin Address........ Kraszewskiego 1 Admin Address........ Admin Address........ Admin Address. Bydgoszcz Admin Address........ 0000 Admin Address........ Bydgoszcz Admin Address........ POLAND Admin Email.......... [EMAIL="ipam@atosorigin.com"]ipam@atosorigin.com[/EMAIL] Admin Phone.......... +48.000000000 Admin Fax............
  • I disagree Andrea... if this thread helps one person you should also consider how many it damages or puts off others helping... it also will add to the problems many face.. something that may well be invisible to staff here. I was helping people day in day out as example on this site but really just lost my mojo when I felt I would spend my time here trying to deal with a PR agent who did not share my desire to help people here many of whom are vulnerable. I'm only popping on out of immense sense of guilt feeling I'm letting people down.. I cringe when I see that more private requests for assistance have gone unanswered by me due to absence. But let's not beat about the bush.. it is a PR agent... hence the PR responses rather than helpful responses. This is about ATOS HC trying to improve its public persona... not about helping customers. Difficult questions are evaded... ATOS HC can't possibly fail to follow procedure etc... attempts to get people off the thread with their issues if they're politically difficult... contact out CR department and discuss matters. My own questions took over a year to see a response... a full reply of any use to me is something I long since gave up on. In my case of course too... the agent wanted me to take my specific and relevant but non personalised questions into a private arena with ATOS HC CR (to discuss my case problems with them) which would have been of no value to me... or any other customer reading here. Surely the warning bells should have been sounding like mad when the agent here said ATOS HC played no role in the decision making process regarding ESA... something that a vulnerable customer (many whom suffer cognitive failings) could interpret to mean their benefits would not be affected by any of their dealings with ATOS HC... something that had to be leaped on before it could do any damage to readers here. I come here to help claimants... not combat PR trickery and undo the damage that causes.

    I despair that MSE in admin any way feel this thread has been overall benefit to so-called ATOS customers. You must have one heck of a different evaluation to I. I can only hope in time you'll get sufficient data to change that view and do the right thing... and let disabled and sick people get on with the difficulty of day to day life and needing advice about benefits from people who actually may desire to invest some effort in their wellbeing rather than dismissal.

    Sorry for my strong views... but I do feel they are exceptionally well founded. And as someone who has had at every assessment with ATOS their recommendation that I meet Support group criteria I can also add my views do not come from any underlying history of failing the WCA... I passed all 3 times.

    Just in case you missed it Andrea :)
    Never tell .
  • halight
    halight Posts: 3,629
    First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    Forumite
    FTW wrote: »
    Severely penalising Atoss for overturned decisions is the first decision that should be implemented, and if they argue against it on contractual grounds, then the DWP contract in its entirety should be made public.

    Other company's in other walks of life get penalized if they make mistake's
    Why not Atos ?

    Do they have Governments in there pockets, MP's, MEP;s other members of other country's Parliaments?
    :jYou can have everything you wont in lfe, If you only help enough other people to get what they wont.:j
  • halight
    halight Posts: 3,629
    First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    Forumite

    Well worth taking the time to listen to this.
    :jYou can have everything you wont in lfe, If you only help enough other people to get what they wont.:j
  • mazza111
    mazza111 Posts: 6,327 Forumite
    In all honesty, I too believe this is nothing but an ATOS PR farce.

    If the benefit board was better moderated to remove the posts from benefit bashers then people would get better/more advice there. As it stands at the moment, people are scared to post there because of all the bashing that goes on. People are posting on behalf of, so they aren't getting the stick. I can see that just from the amount of Pms I receive. It's the rules of the Benefit Board, but they just don't seem to be enforced :( You just have to look at the thread from a woman, posting on behalf of her friend who had MS. It turned into 12 pages of policy discussion and a slagging match. When the OP's question was answered within a couple of posts :(

    And it's a shame really, because MSE used to be such a great place to get benefit advice. I will continue to help people as much as I can, but please please please put a stop to this culture of benefit bashing. It's the same people doing it over and over again.
    4 Stones and 0 pounds or 25.4kg lighter :j
  • halight
    halight Posts: 3,629
    First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    Forumite
    mazza111 wrote: »
    In all honesty, I too believe this is nothing but an ATOS PR farce.

    If the benefit board was better moderated to remove the posts from benefit bashers then people would get better/more advice there. As it stands at the moment, people are scared to post there because of all the bashing that goes on. People are posting on behalf of, so they aren't getting the stick. I can see that just from the amount of Pms I receive. It's the rules of the Benefit Board, but they just don't seem to be enforced :( You just have to look at the thread from a woman, posting on behalf of her friend who had MS. It turned into 12 pages of policy discussion and a slagging match. When the OP's question was answered within a couple of posts :(

    And it's a shame really, because MSE used to be such a great place to get benefit advice. I will continue to help people as much as I can, but please please please put a stop to this culture of benefit bashing. It's the same people doing it over and over again.

    It seem to me that this whole site has gone very anti Benefits, To the point were people who are very sick are given the label of thief, They are all trying it on. That'a all you hear all over this web site now. And its allowed by the Mods and the site owners.
    But if you say anything ageist Gay people or people of other beliefs, they clamp down on you like a tun of bricks.

    Lets just face it. we now live in a country were people don't care. they don't wont to know, As long as they are ok then all is right with the world.

    We now live in a county were if you are sick. You have very few rights. what help you do get will be the minimum that you can get away with.

    Sick people are now of use for big company's to make a profit .
    They have no other use,

    how long before we start locking them out of sight again? Think this wont happen ? Well we lock many of our old folk away. out of site.

    this site has just turned into a site were you can come and have a moan about the person with cancer over the road that has just gone on a holiday to help with there recovery

    The Mods don't care. as long as the site hits its target number of "hits" each month.
    :jYou can have everything you wont in lfe, If you only help enough other people to get what they wont.:j
  • sicknotethefirst
    sicknotethefirst Posts: 184 Forumite
    edited 25 February 2013 at 11:36AM
    Atos rep I think you missed this follow up ?
    Originally Posted by sicknotethefirst viewpost.gif
    The approved health care professionals' (HCPs) role is to carry out an assessment of the functional effects of the customer's disabling condition, and to utilise the information gathered to provide the decision maker with an impartial and independent assessment.
    What specific disability analysis training do doctors, nurses and physiotherapists receive over and above their general medical training?

    Before working for Atos Healthcare, healthcare professionals must have at least 3 years’ post-registration experience across a wide range of specialities, and this must include some generalist training. All employees are provided with additional, comprehensive training specific to disability analysis. For the Work Capability Assessment, this includes an 8 day course for all doctors and a 17 day course for nurses and physiotherapists.
    Training of healthcare professionals can be considered in three distinct areas:

    1. Generic training
    2. Training to undertake benefit-specific assessments
    3. Scrutiny and file work training
    Now I have a question…


    Mr X has had a quadruple bypass leaving him with left ventricular failure to those who don’t know (heart failure) and later develops type 2 diabetes which then complicates matters even more.

    Mr Y who has had a single bypass with no other complications.


    Mr Z who was born with Spina bifida (Almost all patients with Spina Bifida will require lifelong antibiotics to prevent infection. Approximately 70% of all spina bifida patients will have to have some form of drug therapy later in life to try to control their bladder over-activity, and approximately 70% will have to practice clean intermittent catheterisation on a lifelong basis)


    Mr XX Who through an accident at work lost the use of the right side of his body.


    Now all these people send in their filled out ESA50 which is then scrutinised by a basic nurse with no additional qualifications except a 17 day disability analysis course provided by Atos.
    How is it that a basic nurse is able to learn so much about a person’s ability when they have only had an additional 17 days training? Bearing in mind the different complications that all illnesses may carry, and then make a recommendation about what they believe?



    I would like a specific answer and not something copied from the Atos website.
    Originally Posted by Atos Healthcare company representative viewpost.gif
    Hi sicknotethefirst All the HCPs who perform scrutiny for ESA are approved Disability Analysts who have received additional specific training and approval from DWP in the scrutiny/filework processes. It is worth mentioning that while all HCPs will meet the minimum requirements as described above, many have considerably more experience and additional qualifications. The role of the Atos HCP, whether at filework or face-to-face assessment, is to look at the functional effects of an individual’s medical conditions. They do this by reviewing the information in the individual’s ESA50 form, along with any other information that may be present (or which they request from the individual’s GP, for example). They will then advise if there is a need for a face-to-face assessment, or in other cases – where there is sufficient evidence and in accordance with DWP procedures – offer advice to the Decision Maker at the filework stage.
    If I understand you correctly what your saying is that all HCP's have enough qualifications to understand all illnesses and the their effects? regardless to how complicated this maybe? In your words you stated" many have considerably more experience and additional qualifications." I take it that this doesn't mean 'ALL'


    Are you saying that if they do not have enough information they 'WILL' seek more information from the claimants GP?


    You seem to have missed the above ????
    Hi sicknotethefirst

    Could you clarify your question please? Work capability assessments have been happening across Britain since ESA was introduced. If you are referring to assessment for ESA from IB these are also happening across Britain, but you would need to speak to DWP about their referral process and when you would be referred to us.


    Thank you I will contact the Dwp.
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