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  • Strangely
    Excellent summary of the grievous "industry" at work behind this whole scammy facade, @CompetitionCafe. This should be distributed as a template answer for anyone who's suffered at the hands of these charlatans.
  • Chillout5892
    [QUOTE=competitionscafe;48392547]There are no magic ingredients and everything on the fake news sites is just rubbish/lies made up by affiliate marketers to promote lead generation offers for scummy affiliate networks.

    The combining 2 products thing is just so that they make twice as much money when you order both.

    Here is how these scams work:

    Affiliates of scummy affiliate networks make fake news sites (fake testimonials, fake story, fake everything) - these fake news sites are all over the web:

    For every "free trial" order, the affiliates get paid a commission of up to $40 by the scam company. The affiliate network acts as a middleman and gets a cut too. So say $35 to the affiliate and $10 to the network = $45.

    In reality they charge the victim around $80 for each "free trial" so after paying the affiliate and affiliate network, they are left with about half that as profit: $35 to $40 . Then they still have to refund a few customers who complain enough to get their banks to force a refund (chargebacks etc).

    So all 3 parties in these scams make a nice profit and the consumer loses out. The scam company (selling the product) simply changes the product name once the complaints get too high and starts again with another website and product name. Rinse and repeat.

    The affiliates know it's a scam, the affiliate networks know it's a scam and the scam company obviously knows it's a scam.


    Competitonsafe, thank you.

    I admit, I'm totally out of my depth. It really has been beyond my imagination and comprehension that so many intelligent people, all over the world, could come together and invest so much time, money and resources to put together something that was rotten to the core from the bottom up, and successfully convince so many legitimate businesses with huge anti corruption and fraud investigation depts like google, credit card companies and banks to service their crimes. It's mind blowing. If anything the scale of this makes it look legit.

    There has been moments when things appeared odd and suspicious, such as when I couldn't find the face creams sold anywhere else. But it never crossed my mind the products were bogus to start off with. To think that behind this there are professional chemists, computer programmers, accountants, manufacturers, patent and intellectual property lawyers. This is international big business of a type that's never been known before.

    Ironically, seeing the facebook listing of Daniel Treisman that you posted showing him playing with his children on the sofa and listing himself proudly as the CEO of Guru Media, made me think, maybe he doesn't know that the call centres he's contracted to manage CS payments and refunds are pulling some fast ones to up their commission! I know, Duh! (Interesting he's removed his relationship to Guru Media but under interests he's listed Ads4Dough! Says it all really.)

    Let's face it, if you bought booze from a bootlegger in the prohibition era, you knew it was illegal to make, transport, sell, own and drink it, but you did get drunk. If you didn't, the speakeasy went out of business. You knew what you were getting into, and most of the time you knew the risks and it was your judgement call. It was fairly transparent. This is something else entirely. This is an industry that plays mainly on peoples fears to engage them in complicated financial contracts that are difficult to get out of and then I've discovered, sells products that are harmful (seems the teeth whitening and colon cleanse stuff is) and then sells on your contact information to further screw up your life by repeating the process by sending you different 'samples'. I can't find words to describe this. It like an industrialised psychopathy.

    It's ironic this thread is in the low spend freebies board! I really think this whole industry needs a board of it's own as it seems these issues have repeatedly come up on MSE but each under the title of a specific scam. There needs to be a sturdier platform to both educate and advise on this practice. I think it also needs a TV journalist to set up a special investigation on this, urgently.
    Chillout5892
    DMP PayPlan £17,652 @£100 pm > June 2027.
    Women don't mature.
    They either go hard or soft in the wrong places.
    Simone de Beauvoir
  • Strangely
    ReLift XS appears to have an address in Utah USA (aka US state capital of scams!)

    ReLift XS LLC
    12278 S Lone Peak Parkway, Suite 106
    Draper, UT 84020
    That's probably just a mailbox/maildrop though as it seems to be used by several companies.

    Another US company is taking legal action against YKnot Holdings LLC for breach of contract and the list of defendants is: Kenneth W Bell, Robert Brett Bell, Christian R Larsen, YKnot Holdings, LLC, Six Marketing, LLC and Mark Bell - all names linked with the Pacific Webworks scam as they were also named in the Google lawsuit.
    Originally posted by competitionscafe

    I have a PACER account so I've examined the YNot case. It seems that Six Marketing made millions with PWeb and the monies didn't come cleanly through to SMS, a money-processing intermediary.
    Specifically, SMS say that PWeb (Ynot) had hugely excessive chargebacks which has materially threatened their relationship as a processor with several "big" clients.

    So there we have it!

    If you want to beat the scammers - ASK FOR A CHARGEBACK from your bank or credit card company.
    It's the only fast way to keep the scammers down as law enforcement takes years to enact and by then the scum are very, very wealthy which means that they can use their scammed wealth to defend themselves with expensive lawyers.

    A chargeback costs you, the consumer, nothing!
  • djf49
    Revitaderm/perfect radiance
    I also got drawn into this scam, I'm usually vary wary about this sort of thing, but for some reason thought this was kosher. My products arrived yesterday and as there were not much in the way of instructions for use I logged onto the internet for advice and came across this forum. I immediately went to my email and replied to the original emails I'd received stating I was unable to use the products and to cancel. I checked my bank account and no further amounts have been withdrawn, fortunately, I then contacted my bank and cancelled my debit card. I have been unable to check at the moment to see whether I have had any response from my email, but intend to request a returns post label if they require anything returning to them. I don't know if I'll get away with this but will let you know how I get on
  • walesnet
    I can't believe that I got sucked into this. I ordered both products on the 23rd of October and received them about 5 days later. I don't recall seeing any t&c's on the page I ordered from, but I may be mistaken. Anyway I noticed on Monday 7th that my bank account looked a little short so I rang the bank and they told me that £74.99 had been debited from my account on the 3rd November and at that point they could not tell me by who. I checked online after midnight and could not believe that the money had gone to Perfect Radiance. I then found this thread and using the info here I rang their customer services which is actually in America as mentioned earlier in the thread.

    At first the representative was quite adamant that they were within their rights as per the t&c's but i demanded a refund under the terms of their 30 day money back guarantee told them that the company was basically running a scam, and that i was aware of the various other scams that they have been involved in, the bank in cyprus and so on, and finished by stating that I would be reporting them to the Federal Trade Commission if i did not get refunded and they responded by agreeing a full refund and cancelling my subscription for both products, proving that it is the same company. I asked for confirmation by email which eventually arrived yesterday.

    Today thankfully my bank account has been credited with 74.99. I have learned a big lesson this week and will be far more careful in future. Lloydstsb have also told me that as I have confirmation from them that the subscriptions have been closed, any further debits made will be treated as fraud and will be covered by them.

    Finally, they have not requested that the products are returned as a condition of the refund.

    A big Thanks to everyone who has posted here as it has helped me no end.
    Last edited by walesnet; 11-11-2011 at 4:38 PM.
  • jaybird66
    scam
    Hi
    Yes I am also another sucker who fell for the scam and really I should know better!
    I have paid today for the offer (2.95) and there was no terms and conditions box to tick but went back into the site and scrolled down to the bottom to see the terms and conditions at the bottom- in very small print) so read them and then research a little more and reading about the scam here.

    I think I need to cancel asap and can someone advise is calling from the UK what is the number I need to call to cancel.

    Any help would be greatly appreciated
    Jaybird66
    • MarilynMonroe
    • By MarilynMonroe 12th Nov 11, 1:18 PM
    • 1,522 Posts
    • 5,169 Thanks
    MarilynMonroe
    Were you actually getting anything for your money? What was the money for?

    I hope you all manage to get your money back, i wont be giving my details for ANY trials whatsoever. I got stung in the 1990's by a postal trial, couldnt get it stopped for ages, luckily it was cheques then no dd, I ended up sending their stuff back with sex sex sex have i got your attention now? written all over it in big letters so they couldnt possibly ignore it! Then it stopped!
    Good luck x
    1,2 & 5p: Christmas day food £9.31
    10 & 20p: misc savings £2.70
    50p: Christmas presents £3.50
    £2: holidays £2.00
  • walesnet
    I called 0808 168 3685, which is the customer services number for Perfect Radiance, however, I cancelled Revita derm on the same call. Unless I have somehow been scammed again, this is a freephone number which put me through to america??

    Hi
    Yes I am also another sucker who fell for the scam and really I should know better!
    I have paid today for the offer (2.95) and there was no terms and conditions box to tick but went back into the site and scrolled down to the bottom to see the terms and conditions at the bottom- in very small print) so read them and then research a little more and reading about the scam here.

    I think I need to cancel asap and can someone advise is calling from the UK what is the number I need to call to cancel.

    Any help would be greatly appreciated
    Jaybird66
    Originally posted by jaybird66
    Last edited by walesnet; 12-11-2011 at 5:27 PM.
    • heatherw_01
    • By heatherw_01 13th Nov 11, 5:22 PM
    • 4,815 Posts
    • 3,529 Thanks
    heatherw_01
    I am going to move this to praise vent and warnings to help warm others about this scam



    Hi, Martin’s asked me to post this in these circumstances: I’ve asked Board Guides to move threads if they’ll receive a better response elsewhere (please see this rule) so this post/thread has been moved to another board, where it should get more replies. If you have any questions about this policy please email forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com.
    I'm the Board Guide on Quick Grabbit, Freebies, Overseas Holidays & Travel Planning and the UK Holidays, Days Out & Entertainments boards. I'm a volunteer to help the boards run smoothly, and I can move and merge posts there. Board guides are not moderators and don't read every post. If you spot an illegal or inappropriate post then please report it to forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com (it's not part of my role to deal with this). Any views are mine and not the official line of MoneySavingExpert.com.
  • 12Casey4F
    Perfect Radiance & Revitalift
    I also was fooled by this supposed-to-be free offer, when I received the two products on the 10/11/2011, there was no information with the Despatch note regarding the products or the price of the products, so this set alarm bells ringing and on Sat 12/11/2011 was lucky enough to come across this forum on the internet. As I could not ring the contact numbers until Monday (14/11/2011) I contacted my Credit card company immediatly and cancelled my card. I have just contacted the Perfect Radiance no 08081683685 and (after 15 mins of listening to music)they confirmed that 2 items had been sent to me, I informed them that I wanted to cancel immediatly and was given a cancellation number for each number. I informed them that I would return the 2 items received and that I had been in touch with my Credit card Co, but I was told that I could keep the 2 items as I had cancelled within the trial period.
    So far the only charges on my card have been just under £6 for the P&P, so I am hoping that nothing more was put through before I blocked my card. But if there is anything, I will get in touch with the Dispute team at my card co.
    I will keep you posted if I have any more problems
  • alicemarieb1
    Embarrassed to say I also fell for this scam. £74.95 deducted from my bank account on Friday. Called the company this morning to cancel (within the time line on their T&C's), was on hold for 15 minutes, so that will cost a fortune! They agreed to cancel the account and proposed to give me 3 bottles of products and a 50% refund. I said "no" at least 3 times, specified clearly that they have fraudulently deducted money from my account. I then got an offer of a full refund within 30 days to which I said I wanted it done in 3-5 days and have compromised with a full refund within 7-10 days. Not 100% sure I'll get it though. Call lasted in total 34 minutes. I also get the girl to give me an internal reference for the refund transaction. I've been promised a confirmation email within 24 hours too.
  • gardenofeden
    Revitaderm, Perfect Radiance
    I also find it unbelievable that I got sucked into this scam. They have now taken £286.81 in total from my account and it looks unlikely that I will get it back! All I got were 2 jars of cream and one of serum, all of which are absolutely useless and caused me skin irritation. A very expensive lesson learnt to keep a closer eye on what is coming out of my account and never, ever take up one of these 'too good to be true' deals again. I have emailed them and asked them to cease taking amounts from my account and to cease my 'subscription' and they replied with an offer of a 50% discount on future monthly payments! Can you believe their cheek!
  • Chillout5892
    I don't know if this will help. I fell for the Juveneu anti-aging cream scam. But I saw a clause in the T&C that I used quite effectively, I phoned within a few mins of paying the p&p when I say too things, one was that they would charge £79 in 30 days, one was that even if cancelled they wouldn't refund the initial p&p, the other was that is was not advised for use with people who had high blood pressure and kidney disease (and other conditions.) I have both high BP and kidney disease, so I called their uk number and asked could the order be cancelled, I know I won't get my p&p back but I now realize I couldn't use them for medical reasons high BP and CKD. The account was cancelled, no money was refunded, but to date no more additional money has been taken out of my account. Fingers crossed. I phoned again about 2 weeks later, still haven't get the promised cancellation email. The number was on the confirmation email.

    Anyhow as it's probably the same company doing all these antiageing creams try this number, say it came up on google. (020) 3514 1398
    Good luck.
    Last edited by Chillout5892; 14-11-2011 at 9:50 PM. Reason: Additional info.
    Chillout5892
    DMP PayPlan £17,652 @£100 pm > June 2027.
    Women don't mature.
    They either go hard or soft in the wrong places.
    Simone de Beauvoir
  • competitionscafe
    Reminder - if scammed by any of the above companies fill in this FTC online complaint form:
    https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/FTC_Wizard.aspx?lang=en

    The FTC can take legal action against companies using deceptive marketing practices and force them to issue refunds. For example, they are currently taking legal action against other similar 'free trial' scams. However they usually only act once they receive a number of complaints so the more complaints they get the more likely they are to investigate. The online form only takes about 10 minutes to fill in and you can cut and paste any info from here to add to your complaint.
    "The happiest of people don't necessarily have the
    best of everything; they just make the best
    of everything that comes along their way."
    -- Author Unknown --
  • Chillout5892
    This takes the bloody biscuit. I am so angry I can't tell you. As I have told you, I have been in touch with Juveneu twice, requesting confirmation they have cancelled my account, and I have been waiting for the email confirmation.

    I received this email today from my ISP PlusNet.

    Dear Plusnet Customer,

    You are receiving this mail because you have an active virus-scanning service, and either a banned file extension or an email containing a virus has been sent to your address.

    The mail was sent to you from:

    * "Robert Dobs" <robert.dobs@Nacha.org>

    The subject line of the mail received was:

    * [-SPAM-] Bill payment canceled

    In order to protect you, this email has been ;stored on our servers and quarantined. If you wish to retrieve this, please send an email to unquarantine@quarantine.plus.com containing the following information


    The next part is some lines in code and my private email address, which I am not going to post. It is followed by

    It should be possible to reply to this mail to retrieve your email, as long as your email application includes this entire message in the reply.

    Kind Regards,
    Customer Support.



    Now, I can assure you, the Juveneu account is the only account I have cancelled and for which I'm awaiting confirmation.

    I have phoned PlusNet and am applying for the text of the email to be sent to me, so if further theft occurs I have proof to show my bank I've done all I can to get out of this scam.

    So to anyone who requests email cancellation confirmation from them a scammer, MAKE SURE YOU HAVE ALL THE ANTIVIRUS PROTECTION YOU CAN AFFORD UP AND RUNNING.

    Strangely posted a link to a site that explained how you get targetted with other 'offers' from them. I only hope they are not sending infected emails that read our address books to send our friends and relatives special offers 'recommended' by me. But you know, I wouldn't put it past them, the f*ckers.

    May I suggest you change you email address as well as your bank or credit card, I'll be deleting this one as soon as I get a copy of the text. I'm so bloody livid.
    Chillout5892
    DMP PayPlan £17,652 @£100 pm > June 2027.
    Women don't mature.
    They either go hard or soft in the wrong places.
    Simone de Beauvoir
  • competitionscafe
    I don't know if that is an unrelated spam email or linked to them but I would not put anything past them. Here is a site which details various other dodgy things that another fake news site is doing: http://www.workathometruth.com/blog/2010/07/22/newsdaily7-com-review-and-analysis/

    Yet the fake news site above (and others) have been advertised on Google (Adwords); Facebook; Yahoo (Sponsored Links); Photobucket and About.com (owned by the New York Times). So not only have large companies like Google, Yahoo, Facebook etc accepted advertising from these scams, they have indirectly profiting from them by doing so (taking the money paid for advertising).

    In addition smaller advertising networks have profited greatly from these scams by accepting their adverts, eg: Pulse 360, Adblade, Sitescout, Zedo, bnmla.com (aka Blink New Media/ Engage BDR) etc

    http://wafflesatnoon.com/2011/11/14/msnbc-and-pulse360-advertising-collusion/
    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505123_162-42749282/ftc-eyes-alleged-tiny-belly-con-artist----but-not-the-big-media-who-helped-him/?
    http://www.naturalnews.com/031280_acai_berries_scam.html
    Last edited by competitionscafe; 15-11-2011 at 4:55 PM.
    "The happiest of people don't necessarily have the
    best of everything; they just make the best
    of everything that comes along their way."
    -- Author Unknown --
  • 12Casey4F
    Perfect Radiance & Revita Derm
    We have managed to contact them this morning and have been given cancellation codes to confirm that they will no longer send the product - can anyone confirm that this is true for them or give further information to reassure me that the item is definitely cancelled?
    Originally posted by ang7998
    12Casey4F
    I also phoned and received two cancellation numbers for my products, but I had already phoned my credit card company and cancelled my card, before I phoned Perfect Radiance, then for extra assurance I e-mailed them told them that I had received cancellation numbers and had been told I could keep cream & serum, I also told them that they were to take no more money from my account other than the original P&P of £2.95 & £2.97 and that if they did, my credit card Dispute team would be informed. I then asked for an e-mail reply to confirm this. I received two confirmation e-mails, stating no more charges would be taken from me.
    I have checked my Credit card account and there have been no other charges, just waiting for my new credit card now. So thank heavens I came across this forum, which made me act very quickly.
    I hope you have been as lucky
  • TDstream
    TDstream
    This company should be investigated. I will be reporting this to the police. They have taken £280 off me within four weeks. I have incurred bank charges as I have become overdrawn because of this. It is not clear from the advertisement making extravagant claims that you would have to pay anything after the trial. I sent off for the trial which they held off for 6 weeks saying they had shipping difficulties. I was NOT aware I would have to pay anything beyond the price of the trial. If it was clear I would have cancelled. I was shocked when I got my bank statement revealing a number of transactions Serum Perfect Radiance £74.95, Revitadermatage £79.99, Radiant skin care agios £51.00 and Radiant Skin Care Agio Domentio £74.95. I have only recieved the trial pack and one other item for this money. I have seen none of the results they claim it is not clear what is in the product as no leaflet telling you about the ingredients or how to use it come with the package you could be putting anything on your skin. WARN EVERYONE ABOUT THIS PRODUCT.
  • djf49
    update on post 11/11
    Following on from my last post dated 11/11 where I had responded to the original email stating I couldn't use the products, I had a return email in the following 2 days suggesting I keep trying the products and offering to reduce the cost by 50% every month. I responded stating I still wished to cancel and request they terminate my account.

    To this I had a response telling me the account had been terminated but if at any time I wish to reinstate I could again at 50% of the original cost. The email also went on to say that if there was anymore product already on the way I could keep it at no charge(which I doubt as I had cancelled my card)

    So all in all I am very relieved at the way this turned out, I had a lucky escape, which is all thanks to everyone that has posted on this forum.

    If anyone wants to read the full emails I received I will gladly post them, just let me know

    Thank you again everyone
  • Chillout5892
    [QUOTE=djf49;48594061]Following on from my last post dated 11/11 where I had responded to the original email stating I couldn't use the products, I had a return email in the following 2 days suggesting I keep trying the products and offering to reduce the cost by 50% every month. I responded stating I still wished to cancel and request they terminate my account.


    Hi guys.

    I got involved in this scam by ordering Juveneu, an anti-aging serum, by paying trial p&p on October 11th. I cancelled the same day siting their 'medical cautions' using the phone number on their order confirmation email. But I never received the twice promised cancellation email.

    Since then my laptop has been behaving rather in an unpredictable and erratic way. Two days ago I was notified by my ISP they had quarantined an email addressed to me from an sender I did not recognize because it DID CONTAIN either illegal extensions or a virus. I'm trying to get a screen shot from my ISP of this or when my laptop is sorted, I'll try doing one in web mail, but I really don't want to infect my laptop again. I have also found out various people I haven't been in contact with for ages are receiving recommendations from me for various random products at discount rates by email and FB, I'm not sure if Juveneu has been mentioned yet. In truth I don't really want to know the details. I've spent the last few days running additional anti spyware and cleansing programs, a right bloody pain as well as explaining and apologizing all over the place. I sat up for 22 hours running Super AntiSpyware.

    Yes I Avast, have done for years. I now use 2 site warning identifiers, Web Rep by Avast and Trustee Rapport (which doesn't work well with blogs and forums.) I've cancelled the debit card and email account I used in October, and changed my browser.

    So, for anyone else unfortunately involved, check out what's going on. It appears the decision to use me as network hub, started with the confirmation email! I am so !!!!ed off, run down, tired angry and confused. I don't understand how these people can live with themselves. Have they any idea to the havoc they wreak in peoples lives It's beyond me. But look after yourselves, this aggravation could have an unexpectedly long shelf life.

    I've found a way to limit the risk of being suckered in, in the first place. Use ad blocking software and something to stop-pops. I used to wonder what they were so popular. It's not adverts, it's malware.
    Last edited by Chillout5892; 17-11-2011 at 10:19 PM. Reason: Adding malware security advice.
    Chillout5892
    DMP PayPlan £17,652 @£100 pm > June 2027.
    Women don't mature.
    They either go hard or soft in the wrong places.
    Simone de Beauvoir
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