Your browser isn't supported
It looks like you're using an old web browser. To get the most out of the site and to ensure guides display correctly, we suggest upgrading your browser now. Download the latest:

Welcome to the MSE Forums

We're home to a fantastic community of MoneySavers but anyone can post. Please exercise caution & report spam, illegal, offensive or libellous posts/messages: click "report" or email forumteam@.

Search
  • FIRST POST
    • firebird082
    • By firebird082 12th Jun 17, 5:07 PM
    • 547Posts
    • 433Thanks
    firebird082
    Redundancy whilst on maternity leave
    • #1
    • 12th Jun 17, 5:07 PM
    Redundancy whilst on maternity leave 12th Jun 17 at 5:07 PM
    Hi all,

    Heard from work last week that my role is at risk of redundancy. I'm currently on maternity leave, with baby due imminently. I'm aware that there are some protections due to my current status, but I'm not entirely clear how far this goes (I've read the ACAS pages). Current contract gives me additional maternity pay for 18 weeks before it reverts to statutory (which I understand they have to pay me, even if made redundant, as it's paid by gov?).

    I have another meeting tomorrow to confirm more details (the pool of people at risk, scoring etc) and would like to be informed as to my rights. Don't obviously trust work not to cut corners and try and get away with a little as possible if they've got the option...and will need to consider financial consequences of all options.

    Thanks
Page 1
    • getmore4less
    • By getmore4less 13th Jun 17, 7:17 AM
    • 28,808 Posts
    • 17,223 Thanks
    getmore4less
    • #2
    • 13th Jun 17, 7:17 AM
    • #2
    • 13th Jun 17, 7:17 AM
    The main additional right is preferential treatment on suitable alternatives.

    If smart they can get round this, something to keep back until you know the reasons behind the redundancies their scope and if selected what alternative jobs there are that would be suitable.
    • firebird082
    • By firebird082 13th Jun 17, 10:03 AM
    • 547 Posts
    • 433 Thanks
    firebird082
    • #3
    • 13th Jun 17, 10:03 AM
    • #3
    • 13th Jun 17, 10:03 AM
    Thanks...it seems there is a pool of (2 or 3 of) us for 1 remaining job in my team - does the preferential offer of an alternative not include the job in my team that remains then? Will know my scoring this afternoon, but presumably not how that compares to anyone else's. .
    • firebird082
    • By firebird082 13th Jun 17, 6:04 PM
    • 547 Posts
    • 433 Thanks
    firebird082
    • #4
    • 13th Jun 17, 6:04 PM
    • #4
    • 13th Jun 17, 6:04 PM
    Ok, so my score was apparently lower than colleague's, so I'm out. Next meeting is an appeal one - have some grounds here I think, as a couple of the criteria are potentially affected by pregnancy, which is something I understand they have to be really careful about... these are performance, and adaptability and flexibility. Manager has only been around since July, and I have been pregnant since September, so I imagine there's potential to argue that she is unaware of the 'normal, un-pregnant' me? Especially given that my previous appraisal rating was higher than this year's...?
    • Sparx
    • By Sparx 13th Jun 17, 10:28 PM
    • 647 Posts
    • 363 Thanks
    Sparx
    • #5
    • 13th Jun 17, 10:28 PM
    • #5
    • 13th Jun 17, 10:28 PM
    For what it's worth, I went through redundancy 2 years ago - two of my colleagues were in similar circumstances, however our redundancy was mandatory and we all had to go. They relocated our office function to another office in the UK...

    One colleague was due on mat leave in 2-3 months, the other was already on mat leave. When it came to redundancy, they received the remainder of the company mat leave pay, statutory mat pay, redundancy pay, the bonus the rest of staff got etc so was zero discrimination.

    I thought that was quite fair to be honest! They came out quite well, hopefully your employer treats you the same.
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 14th Jun 17, 8:32 AM
    • 3,201 Posts
    • 5,221 Thanks
    sangie595
    • #6
    • 14th Jun 17, 8:32 AM
    • #6
    • 14th Jun 17, 8:32 AM
    Ok, so my score was apparently lower than colleague's, so I'm out. Next meeting is an appeal one - have some grounds here I think, as a couple of the criteria are potentially affected by pregnancy, which is something I understand they have to be really careful about... these are performance, and adaptability and flexibility. Manager has only been around since July, and I have been pregnant since September, so I imagine there's potential to argue that she is unaware of the 'normal, un-pregnant' me? Especially given that my previous appraisal rating was higher than this year's...?
    Originally posted by firebird082
    No, you aren't "out". You are on maternity leave and still within ordinary maternity leave. There is still one job left. So unless someone else is also on maternity leave, that job is yours - by law. During ordinary maternity leave, you must be offered the job without competition. See here https://www.maternityaction.org.uk/advice-2/mums-dads-scenarios/redundancy-during-pregnancy-and-maternity-leave-additional-questions/

    Since this is a reduction in the number of staff to one, and your legal right is to return to that position, the employer cannot offer it to someone not on maternity leave, no matter what the score is. You will need to point out to them that they are proposing to break the law!
    • firebird082
    • By firebird082 14th Jun 17, 11:30 AM
    • 547 Posts
    • 433 Thanks
    firebird082
    • #7
    • 14th Jun 17, 11:30 AM
    • #7
    • 14th Jun 17, 11:30 AM
    Since this is a reduction in the number of staff to one, and your legal right is to return to that position, the employer cannot offer it to someone not on maternity leave, no matter what the score is. You will need to point out to them that they are proposing to break the law!
    Originally posted by sangie595
    Oh really? That's interesting...can you point me in the direction of the legalities? I wasn't entirely clear on this point, as it seems like positive discrimination in many ways against my colleague who doesn't happen to be on maternity leave... of course, a case for unfair dismissal could be interesting if I choose not to challenge it now (in many ways, redundancy is more appealing finaincially than staying).
    • getmore4less
    • By getmore4less 14th Jun 17, 2:48 PM
    • 28,808 Posts
    • 17,223 Thanks
    getmore4less
    • #8
    • 14th Jun 17, 2:48 PM
    • #8
    • 14th Jun 17, 2:48 PM
    if you want to leave then timing can be on your side.

    play your hand too early and they can undo the mess they got themselves into by not making everyone redundant and creating a new post that is not a suitable alternative for you

    at some point a settlement agreement will potentially be on the cards to enhance a payout.
    • firebird082
    • By firebird082 14th Jun 17, 4:50 PM
    • 547 Posts
    • 433 Thanks
    firebird082
    • #9
    • 14th Jun 17, 4:50 PM
    • #9
    • 14th Jun 17, 4:50 PM
    Ok, so probably best to keep quiet, have the baby and leave it all for the time being then. If this next meeting is supposed to be about the appeal to the decision, does that mean my colleague's position is also not confirmed until they have absolutely confirmed what is happening with me?

    I find it really quite suprising that the HR department of a company with several hundred employees can be so unaware of the law.

    sangie595 - so the pool was 2 of us, with 1 job remaining. If the law says I have to be offered the job, why was I in the redundancy pool at all, and why did they bother to score it using assorted performance criteria?
    • Takeaway_Addict
    • By Takeaway_Addict 14th Jun 17, 7:37 PM
    • 5,544 Posts
    • 6,308 Thanks
    Takeaway_Addict
    Ok, so probably best to keep quiet, have the baby and leave it all for the time being then. If this next meeting is supposed to be about the appeal to the decision, does that mean my colleague's position is also not confirmed until they have absolutely confirmed what is happening with me?

    I find it really quite suprising that the HR department of a company with several hundred employees can be so unaware of the law.

    sangie595 - so the pool was 2 of us, with 1 job remaining. If the law says I have to be offered the job, why was I in the redundancy pool at all, and why did they bother to score it using assorted performance criteria?
    Originally posted by firebird082
    Because 1) they thought it would be an easy way to get rid of you or 2) they genuinally thought you were the weaker candidate but were ignorant of the law.
    Don't trust a forum for advice. Get proper paid advice. Any advice given should always be checked
    • firebird082
    • By firebird082 14th Jun 17, 7:58 PM
    • 547 Posts
    • 433 Thanks
    firebird082
    Hmmm, probably 2, as I really don't think it's malicious, but it has been done in rather a hurry. Will need to speak to some form of legal representation in due course then to confirm my facts, but this will all have to wait until after baby's arrival. Your help very much appreciated, and I will be back for more in due course!
    • lush walrus
    • By lush walrus 14th Jun 17, 8:05 PM
    • 1,876 Posts
    • 1,549 Thanks
    lush walrus
    The situation for you is not that you are entitled to any preferential treatment, you are not, that would be discriminatory against your other colleagues. it is purely that as you are on maternity leave and therefore not in an active role, your role can not be made redundant - you aren't doing it to not be needed.

    If all of you were being made redundant that is a different circumstance altogether.
    • Masomnia
    • By Masomnia 14th Jun 17, 11:08 PM
    • 16,998 Posts
    • 37,345 Thanks
    Masomnia
    The situation for you is not that you are entitled to any preferential treatment, you are not, that would be discriminatory against your other colleagues. it is purely that as you are on maternity leave and therefore not in an active role, your role can not be made redundant - you aren't doing it to not be needed.

    If all of you were being made redundant that is a different circumstance altogether.
    Originally posted by lush walrus
    Ignore the above, Sangie is right.

    If you want to leave anyway this is your leverage. You're legally entitled to the role... but what would they offer you if you did choose to accept redundancy and sign a settlement agreement? This is what I would be asking in your situation. As I say if you want to leave anyway and they are willing to sweeten the deal it could work out well for you. Good luck anyway!
    “I could see that, if not actually disgruntled, he was far from being gruntled.” - P.G. Wodehouse
    • getmore4less
    • By getmore4less 15th Jun 17, 5:31 AM
    • 28,808 Posts
    • 17,223 Thanks
    getmore4less
    Also any meetings should be treated as KIT days and paid appropriately.
    • sangie595
    • By sangie595 15th Jun 17, 9:12 AM
    • 3,201 Posts
    • 5,221 Thanks
    sangie595
    To be honest, the law on maternity leave and redundancy rights is on the internet in many places, and I would have been very inclined to help - if it hadn't been for the comment about keeping quiet and then claiming unfair dismissal because you want to leave anyway! Obviously others are prepared to help you stick it to the employer, but I wouldn't be comfortable doing that.

    If you wish to make a claim, there is a requirement to raise your issues with the employer - not wait until they can't undo it and then sneak up. You now know. It is dishonest to say otherwise. And to take a job that you don't want and which will result in someone else losing a job that they do.

    There is a difference in my book between standing up for your rights, and deliberately attempting to lead people into a legal claim simply for your own financial benefit without any consideration for others.
    • firebird082
    • By firebird082 15th Jun 17, 11:15 AM
    • 547 Posts
    • 433 Thanks
    firebird082
    I appreciate that Sangie, and I'm not completely without morals! (just can't help an initial emotional reaction to the situation ). I'm not taking any further action or attending futher meetings until after the baby arrives, and we've properly thought through all the consequences. Half the problem is that I'm struggling at the moment to think rationally about what is best for me/my family, and what I actually want out of this situation - I might feel entirely different after baby arrives. And at the same time, now is really not a good time to be thinking this through when baby arrival is imminent, and I need to be calm and relaxed!

    I'm not actually going to be underhand and go for unfair dismissal (really not that type of person!), but I will use the fact that they haven't followed legal requirements to get the best result possible for me.

    I have arranged to meet with my colleague to discuss, so we can hopefully come to a suitable arrangement that works for both of us.

    getmore4less - That's useful, but I'm still on full pay for the time being, so don't think it counts at this stage?
    Last edited by firebird082; 15-06-2017 at 11:37 AM. Reason: Clarification
Welcome to our new Forum!

Our aim is to save you money quickly and easily. We hope you like it!

Forum Team Contact us

Live Stats

618Posts Today

5,455Users online

Martin's Twitter