Weight getting me down

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  • Anoneemoose
    Anoneemoose Posts: 2,258
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    FBaby wrote: »
    I don't understand that. To me it would be the same than saying that looking at a clock to balance your day is not natural. Doing it excessively isn't healthy, but getting on with life without ever looking at a clock is likely to mean you end up losing track of time.

    I see counting what you eat the same discipline. It's not about counting every individual calorie or even every meal, but keeping track of how much you put in your body is a good way of making sure you don't over do it without notice.

    Exercising in an interesting point. I know that many people control their weight with exercise. That's never worked for me. I do quite intense interval training 5/6 times a week as well as endurance, but increasing or decreasing how much I do makes no difference. My losing weight/putting on weight is fully dependent on how much I eat. This is probably one area where we are indeed all different.

    Because these things (can) cause unnatural obsessiveness. And I totally appreciate that not everybody will do that, but if you learn to listen to our body, it isn't actually necessary. It takes a bit of learning, but it works. Since following this approach, I don't always want to eat cake or chocolate. I stood in the supermarket the other week and craved celery of all things. My diet now naturally and without any effort (beyond the therapy I sought for my ED), consists of mostly whole, unprocessed (organic - as a personal choice due to chronic illness) foods, with the occasional slab of chocolate or bit of cake. And as I said, my weight has stabilised, without effort, for the first time in the last 2 decades.

    All diet clubs, by virtue of the fact they focus mainly on the numbers on the scales are bad. As I said before, weight loss does not guarantee and is not necessary for good health, healthy behaviours (both physical and mental) are necessary for good health.

    I also totally appreciate that there are people out there who have success with these plans, and once again, I am not knocking any individual. But, ask yourself, how many people in these diet clubs (all of them) return time and time again because they fail to keep their weight off? The last time I dabbled with SW, I attended about 5 different classes due to shifts and childcare. The overwhelming majority of members were repeat, obese customers (like me). And these plans are designed to make people think that when they fall off plan, it's their own fault, and not the diet's.
  • meer53
    meer53 Posts: 10,217
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    SW IS a calorie controlled diet, as quoted by SW themselves in their consultant training manuals. I wouldn't say obsessive, just passionate in my wanting of other people to see it for what it really is. So counting syns, healthy extras etc is natural..hmm, I think not!

    Also, I have already said I know you don't have to eat those things, but they still promote them regardless and there are many people out there who aren't as clued up who will actually think these things are healthy - that's where the danger lies. I am one of those people who blindly believed it all, so as I said, I am not knocking the individual members. Just SW, the business.

    I also believe that SW does not help disordered eating, as I say, calorie counting, syns, points, healthy extras should have no place in nutrition. They are not natural.

    I'm intrigued as to how you make the statement that SW is a "calorie controlled diet" ? Nowhere in SW plan does it state you have to count calories.

    As for "not natural", nature decides that if you take in more calories than you burn, your weight will increase, whether you eat 2000 calories per day of double cream or 2000 calories of vegetables.

    I think you've found "your way" of managing your weight and are completely blinkered to others. Its not fair to knock something that other people have found works for them.
  • Anoneemoose
    Anoneemoose Posts: 2,258
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    edited 17 April 2017 at 12:22PM
    meer53 wrote: »
    I'm intrigued as to how you make the statement that SW is a "calorie controlled diet" ? Nowhere in SW plan does it state you have to count calories.

    As for "not natural", nature decides that if you take in more calories than you burn, your weight will increase, whether you eat 2000 calories per day of double cream or 2000 calories of vegetables.

    I think you've found "your way" of managing your weight and are completely blinkered to others. Its not fair to knock something that other people have found works for them.

    Because I was a consultant for them and that is what the very first line of the training manual they gave me said. Obviously it is not a here's 2000 calories and count them scenario, they do that for you, but it is, as most other diets are, calorie controlled.

    You're also correct from a physics point of view, you gain weight if you take in more energy than you need. However, there are lots of other factors involved in this too..hormones for example. The brain...as soon as the brain detects restriction (whether it be real famine like in the cavemen days, or perceived - it can't tell the difference), it will automatically send out signals to make your appetite and cravings increase. That's how it was made..to survive famine..and although our access to food sources has changed over the years, the brain hasn't adapated that much at all. That's why, as soon as you are told you can't have something, you want it more and in a lot of cases, become focused on it. Removing ANY form of restriction allows your body and mind to see what it actually needs.

    I have already said there will be people who diets work for, but I still wholeheartedly believe they will be a tiny percentage of people, as shown in scientific studies.

    Edited - Sadly, my manuals met their demise in a fire, else I would have posted a pic of them.
  • Pollycat
    Pollycat Posts: 34,539
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    ecgirl07 wrote: »
    Regarding exercise, my friend and I did SW at the same time, I exercised 5 hours a week and over the 1st 4-5 months was only half a stone ahead of my pal. The difference exercise makes is probably as much mental as physical, it feels good to get fitter.

    All eating in the modern world is a compromise, we would all love to sit about drinking and eating as much as we liked of what we like and be a size 10-12 but for most of us this is not possible. So the compromise I'm happy to make? SW principles for 5 days a week. If we are lucky we find the compromise that works for us.
    It's possible that through your exercise you had more muscle - that weighs heavier than fat - and that is why you and your friend's weight continued to be so similar.
  • onlyroz
    onlyroz Posts: 17,661
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    Pollycat wrote: »
    It's possible that through your exercise you had more muscle - that weighs heavier than fat - and that is why you and your friend's weight continued to be so similar.
    Despite having at least a 500 calorie deficit each day, and doing plenty of exercise, my husband's weight loss has stalled. However, we have bought some fancy scales that measures body fat and muscle as well as weight. He can see that he is visibly getting slimmer and his body fat is dropping - but his weight is pretty static and is still in the "overweight" section of the BMI chart.

    Weight is only one factor in your general health, and becoming obsessed with the number on the scales is not always helpful.
  • Anoneemoose
    Anoneemoose Posts: 2,258
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    edited 17 April 2017 at 12:38PM
    onlyroz wrote: »
    Despite having at least a 500 calorie deficit each day, and doing plenty of exercise, my husband's weight loss has stalled. However, we have bought some fancy scales that measures body fat and muscle as well as weight. He can see that he is visibly getting slimmer and his body fat is dropping - but his weight is pretty static and is still in the "overweight" section of the BMI chart.

    Weight is only one factor in your general health, and becoming obsessed with the number on the scales is not always helpful.

    This! With bells on. BMI is also a useless indicator of health, it was never designed to be used as it is. In fact, there is also increasing evidence to show that being in the overweight category leads to a longer life than the 'normal' category.

    I do actually have things saved with links to 'proper' studies, but I can't figure out how to get them on here. In the meantime, here is a link that is quite interesting.

    http://www.sciencealert.com/the-healthiest-weight-might-actually-be-overweight-massive-study-finds
  • I'm sorry, but if I just 'listened to my body' I would be eating all the time. May work for some, but not all.
    (AKA HRH_MUngo)
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    Imagine someone holding forth on biology whose only knowledge of the subject is the Book of British Birds, and you have a rough idea of what it feels like to read Richard Dawkins on theology: Terry Eagleton
  • Anoneemoose
    Anoneemoose Posts: 2,258
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    I'm sorry, but if I just 'listened to my body' I would be eating all the time. May work for some, but not all.

    You wouldn't, unless you were mentally restricting in some way. I thought that too. Maybe at first you would, as I did, as I was testing my previously restricted diet boundaries. That soon settled down. As you will see from my history, I too thought I had no control over my food intake.

    The fact is, humans are designed to know how much to eat (think about the baby that pushes the bottle away when it's had enough). It's only since we've been using external cues (diets, portion sizes, 'good food, bad food') that the ability to control things naturally has been lost.

    I can see it may seem an airy fairy, hippy concept to some, but you look at naturally slim people (like my parents - and me before I started dieting), and they will likely tell you they never count anything, they don't think of food as good and bad, they just eat what they feel like (usually a wide range, with some set things, like my dad generally has the same breakfast because that's what he likes), stopping for the most part (not always) before they are uncomfortable.

    Tell me..if all of these slimming clubs worked, why are we still in the midst of an 'obesity crisis'? Maybe it's time to realise that the usual low fat, calorie counting mantra spouted by the NHS, isn't working.
  • Fireflyaway
    Fireflyaway Posts: 2,766
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    I tried slimming world and lost a stone but gained it plus extra when I took my eye off the ball. As a vegetarian I was eating lots of carbs and probably not enough fruit and veg. I think rather than following any particular plan I will try to up the fruit and veg and ditch the chocolate habit! Just knowing I am on some sort of plan makes me want to rebel. I constantly think of food and feel deprived. I'm lucky in I can't identify a reason for overeating such as sadness or loneliness etc I think I have just got into bad habits. However I do eat in secret. When I'm alone I will eat stuff in quantities I'd never do with family present and i do attribute that to the negative comments. Going for coffee mum would say ' you don't need a cake as well' it would make me feel like a child so I'd go home and have 2 cakes! At home we never had sweets or cakes or fizzy drinks which mum obviously thought was setting a good example. However now I can buy what I want it gives me satisfaction to buy ' naughty' foods. Very silly now I come to think of it. Just because I can doesn't mean I should!
  • Anoneemoose
    Anoneemoose Posts: 2,258
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    I tried slimming world and lost a stone but gained it plus extra when I took my eye off the ball. As a vegetarian I was eating lots of carbs and probably not enough fruit and veg. I think rather than following any particular plan I will try to up the fruit and veg and ditch the chocolate habit! Just knowing I am on some sort of plan makes me want to rebel. I constantly think of food and feel deprived. I'm lucky in I can't identify a reason for overeating such as sadness or loneliness etc I think I have just got into bad habits. However I do eat in secret. When I'm alone I will eat stuff in quantities I'd never do with family present and i do attribute that to the negative comments. Going for coffee mum would say ' you don't need a cake as well' it would make me feel like a child so I'd go home and have 2 cakes! At home we never had sweets or cakes or fizzy drinks which mum obviously thought was setting a good example. However now I can buy what I want it gives me satisfaction to buy ' naughty' foods. Very silly now I come to think of it. Just because I can doesn't mean I should!

    This is EXACTLY the type of thinking and mental struggle I am referring to and pretty much proves my point.

    OP, I am not trying to force you to go a way which you don't feel comfortable with, of course it's up to you (as it is up to anyone else which way they go).

    Why shouldn't you buy cake? And eat it? Cake is usually tasty and should be enjoyed by those who like it. Obviously not for every meal, but I can pretty much guarantee if you ate it for every meal because you truly allowed it without ANY restriction (no feelings of it being good or bad), you would soon not want it any more.

    I know it must be difficult with your mum, my biological father was very similar, but I cut him of my life (for other things), so I haven't had that since.

    It might be worth seeing if you can arrange counselling to help deal with your situation (if you haven't already). It may just help you feel stronger and more able to cope with her without what she says affecting you as much. Xx
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