Getting a job after dismissal

chipmoon · 22 July 2009 at 5:13PM

I am facing disciplinary at the lightest form but most likely dismissal from my job for falsifying information during the recruitment process (I didn't state my correct line manager - I gave someone else). I know now it was wrong and it's my own fault either way....

To top that up, I was caught cheating in my exams (when at university) and I know this is on my record for life. My four modules were capped at 40% and the one I cheated in, I was required to resit.

Looking at all this, nothing looks good for me, I look like a dishonest person overrall and is something which I would think of someone if I saw this on their screening check and didn't know them or why they did what they did. Funnily enough, with all this, I have always been known to be a model employee/student and very talented and have gained promotions along the way because I am good at what I do (minus interviews).

I just wanted to know...
- how will disciplinary affect me in future jobs (assuming I got offered a job)?
- how will dismissal affect me in future jobs (assuming I got offered a job)?
- Would they withdraw the job offer if my referees state I was facing disciplinary or dismissal?
- how easy will it be for me to get any job after all of this on my back?
- Should I just hand in my resignation and just go to avoid dismissal or disciplinary to make it easier to find work? (This will affect me financially very badly as I have lots to pay and no other support.)
-Will I be entitled to any support if I voluntarily resign?

Thanks in advance for any help.

Uncertain · 22 July 2009 at 6:02PM

chipmoon wrote: »

I am facing disciplinary at the lightest form but most likely dismissal from my job for falsifying information during the recruitment process (I didn't state my correct line manager - I gave someone else). I know now it was wrong and it's my own fault either way....

To top that up, I was caught cheating in my exams (when at university) and I know this is on my record for life. My four modules were capped at 40% and the one I cheated in, I was required to resit.

Looking at all this, nothing looks good for me, I look like a dishonest person overrall and is something which I would think of someone if I saw this on their screening check and didn't know them or why they did what they did. Funnily enough, with all this, I have always been known to be a model employee/student and very talented and have gained promotions along the way because I am good at what I do (minus interviews).

I just wanted to know...
- how will disciplinary affect me in future jobs (assuming I got offered a job)?
- how will dismissal affect me in future jobs (assuming I got offered a job)?
- Would they withdraw the job offer if my referees state I was facing disciplinary or dismissal?
- how easy will it be for me to get any job after all of this on my back?
- Should I just hand in my resignation and just go to avoid dismissal or disciplinary to make it easier to find work? (This will affect me financially very badly as I have lots to pay and no other support.)
-Will I be entitled to any support if I voluntarily resign?

Thanks in advance for any help.

Well I hope people will respond to your post in a helpful way and not with some of the judgemental attitude we sometimes see.

Do I assume you have only been in your current job for a short time?

If so, might it be possible to miss this out in any future job applications. Instead use the posts where you got on well. Perhaps you can give the impression, without saying so, that you took an extended break but whatever you do don't try to hide one lie with another.

Equally there is no certainty that you will be dismissed for this, although you may well be. Draw attention to all the positive things you have done since you have been in the job and try to put the "oversight" down to your eagerness to work for this firm.

Resigning may not help very much and could make claiming JSA harder.

Above all learn from the past and move forwards.

Horace · 22 July 2009 at 6:12PM

For one thing a lot of university students cheat and it is very easy these days to spot that they are cheating (I am not saying that all students cheat but some do). You say you were asked to resit the exam that you cheated on - how did you do?

Depending on the severity of the lie on your application - you may face the sack but then again if you are an excellent worker then you may get off with a written warning. If you resign before your disciplinary then that proves your guilt - best to let your employer lay their cards on the table and see what they say and see what you can do to appeal to their better nature because at the moment it is all a case of what if...and what if may never happen. Was it a genuine mistake that you put down someone who wasnt your line manager or was it a deliberate attempt to mislead? There is a difference.

I have never been sacked from a job so I have no idea if being sacked has an impact on your future job prospects. However, I wish you well.

chipmoon · 22 July 2009 at 6:12PM

Uncertain wrote: »

Well I hope people will respond to your post in a helpful way and not with some of the judgemental attitude we sometimes see.

Do I assume you have only been in your current job for a short time?

If so, might it be possible to miss this out in any future job applications. Instead use the posts where you got on well. Perhaps you can give the impression, without saying so, that you took an extended break but whatever you do don't try to hide one lie with another.

Equally there is no certainty that you will be dismissed for this, although you may well be. Draw attention to all the positive things you have done since you have been in the job and try to put the "oversight" down to your eagerness to work for this firm.

Resigning may not help very much and could make claiming JSA harder.

Above all learn from the past and move forwards.

Thank you for your reponse. I appreciate it.

Yes I was in the job for three months until my sickness bought it to their attention which then bought my line manager into questioning.

I have learnt from my mistake but the firm are being reluctant to give me a chance to prove myself. I am upset that after being an excellent performer and really contributing to many changes, they are not willing to overlook this.

As a result, I'm wondering whether resigning before dismissal is better than allowing dismissal for future jobs. I'd only use JSA for a temporary period whilst I try my best to secure another job but isn't something I want to be on long term. I do want to be working and contributing to society. I just don't know how bad dismissal will look for prospective employers... especially with "falsifying information" on my back.

Horace · 22 July 2009 at 6:20PM

If you resigned then the jobcentre view this as having made yourself jobless and it makes it harder to claim JSA. If you are dismissed then getting JSA is easier - no-one likes JSA but sometimes needs must.

Start looking for another job - and when asked don't lie because that won't help but show genuine remorse and say that you are young and have learnt from your mistakes.

chipmoon · 22 July 2009 at 6:22PM

Horace wrote: »

For one thing a lot of university students cheat and it is very easy these days to spot that they are cheating (I am not saying that all students cheat but some do). You say you were asked to resit the exam that you cheated on - how did you do?

Depending on the severity of the lie on your application - you may face the sack but then again if you are an excellent worker then you may get off with a written warning. If you resign before your disciplinary then that proves your guilt - best to let your employer lay their cards on the table and see what they say and see what you can do to appeal to their better nature because at the moment it is all a case of what if...and what if may never happen. Was it a genuine mistake that you put down someone who wasnt your line manager or was it a deliberate attempt to mislead? There is a difference.

I have never been sacked from a job so I have no idea if being sacked has an impact on your future job prospects. However, I wish you well.

Thankyou very much Horace.

I passed 2nd time round. The first they marked 0. The second I passed at 58% or something and I also sat right at the front of the hall in front of four examiners and the people who roam around the hall so definitely not making that mistake again.

See I do want to let them do that but I am really worried they will sack me. From what I've heard, people who get dismissed never get jobs and I really don't want to sit on JSA for the rest of my life. I do want to do something useful and make use of the skills I do have. If I resigned, it wouldn't be to do with me being guilty but rather me not leaving with dismissal on my back for falsifying information!!!

I stated another senior manager was my current line manager when I knew she wasn't but I had put the real one down because I really didn't think it was an issue. I thought everybody does it. I have been asked to come into a meeting with the managers with regards to the reference but they have not told me what they will do. They have just labelled it reference query and of course I'm going to be asked why I did it.

I have been told not to say "I didn't know" because ignorance isn't a reason but that that is the actual reason. I actually didn't know it was wrong. Other than that I don't know how to explain myself. I now KNOW it is wrong but at the time of submitting the form, I didn't know that.

It really was a genuine mistake. I didn't do it to mislead them. I just thought I could choose someone senior and chose someone who wasn't my line manager but knows the details of my work and performance and can comment on my performance. I didn't realise it's something punishable or deemed as falsifying information.

iamana1ias · 22 July 2009 at 6:25PM

chipmoon wrote: »

I stated another senior manager was my current line manager when I knew she wasn't but I had put the real one down because I really didn't think it was an issue. I thought everybody does it. I have been asked to come into a meeting with the managers with regards to the reference but they have not told me what they will do. They have just labelled it reference query and of course I'm going to be asked why I did it.

I have been told not to say "I didn't know" because ignorance isn't a reason but that that is the actual reason. I actually didn't know it was wrong. Other than that I don't know how to explain myself. I now KNOW it is wrong but at the time of submitting the form, I didn't know that.

It really was a genuine mistake. I didn't do it to mislead them. I just thought I could choose someone senior and chose someone who wasn't my line manager but knows the details of my work and performance and can comment on my performance. I didn't realise it's something punishable or deemed as falsifying information.

Who did they ask you to name as a referee? your manager or anyone?

If they specifically asked for your line manager, and you knowingly gave someone else's details, then it wasn't a mistake at all and you must have named the other person for a reason. :rolleyes:

chipmoon · 22 July 2009 at 6:28PM

Horace wrote: »

If you resigned then the jobcentre view this as having made yourself jobless and it makes it harder to claim JSA. If you are dismissed then getting JSA is easier - no-one likes JSA but sometimes needs must.

Start looking for another job - and when asked don't lie because that won't help but show genuine remorse and say that you are young and have learnt from your mistakes.

I read something about not being able to get JSA for gross misconduct. Is falsifying information and gross misconduct the same thing? I just can't see any employer wanting to employ me after falsifying information. They may think I will do it to them too. Other than denying my line manager (as I say not with intent).

If they ask me why I got dismissed, should I say it's because I falsified information during the recruitment process? I normally am honest and open about stuff, I just really didn't think this was a big thing. If I did, I wouldn't have done it.

And I have learnt from my mistake. I just don't know why they are so quick to dismiss me.

chipmoon · 22 July 2009 at 6:33PM

iamana1ias wrote: »

Who did they ask you to name as a referee? your manager or anyone?

If they specifically asked for your line manager, and you knowingly gave someone else's details, then it wasn't a mistake at all and you must have named the other person for a reason. :rolleyes:

Well the application form said "line manager" and as I was an internal member of staff, I read a policy once that said, you can put another "senior manager" who is aware of your responsibility and role. As such, I put the other one down. And she is definitely someone who can line manage me.

I didn't put my real manager down because I was scared. We had known issues which I felt would affect my reference. I don't know why, it was just all a big mistake.

I am excellent in all other ways in terms of performance etc, that is the only mistake I made - saying who my line manager is.

Bamber19 · 22 July 2009 at 6:40PM

You have a couple of options. The reality is you lied about the reference to avoid your real line manager giving a bad reference. You can either claim that you thought the manager you named had a better knowledge of you as a worker and would give a more accurate reference or you can be honest about it and say there were issues, however if these issues were to do with your work and not something personal between you then if I was your employer i'd class that as you deliberately misleading me and trying to stop me from getting an honest and accurate reference for you.

I'd expect this could affect future applications, especially when coupled with your university history, but that isn't an excuse to do the same and lie on future applications to avoid both your previous line manager giving a reference and your current employer doing the same (which would likely mention the reason you were dismissed (if that happens))

iamana1ias · 22 July 2009 at 6:46PM

chipmoon wrote: »

Well the application form said "line manager" and as I was an internal member of staff, I read a policy once that said, you can put another "senior manager" who is aware of your responsibility and role. As such, I put the other one down. And she is definitely someone who can line manage me.

I didn't put my real manager down because I was scared. We had known issues which I felt would affect my reference. I don't know why, it was just all a big mistake.

I am excellent in all other ways in terms of performance etc, that is the only mistake I made - saying who my line manager is.

oh dear ....................

Getting a job after dismissal

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