Bitcoins

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  • Satoshi
    Satoshi Posts: 253 Forumite
    Unfortunately the romans are an example of why current policies are wrong because they did similar to us


    http://mises.org/daily/3663

    Very interesting thanks for that Sabretooth.

    Is it not true that just before Rome fell the barbarians demanded a ton of silver but the Romans could not or would not pay them, so they sacked Rome. I think it was the latter.

    But they could pay them as many debased 5% silver denarius coins. The barbarians said no way were not falling for that, only silver. I wonder if they would have fallen for bitcoins? I doubt it.
  • csm888
    csm888 Posts: 112 Forumite
    edited 23 November 2013 at 5:24PM
    can't the value of gold and silver go to nothing if we discover a new element with all of their properties and more on another planet in the not too distant future? Seems unlikely, but it's possible, if that were to happen what value would gold have? Would it still have value because it could be used?

    Unfortunately all the naturally occurring elements have been discovered already. (There are no gaps in the periodic table)

    It is theoretically possible to create gold from lighter elements using nuclear fusion, but no one has done this yet (neither has the sun). Gold mainly gets created in supernovas. Its cool to think that the gold ring on your finger was created in an exploding star, before our solar system existed.
    (Sorry bit off topic, but I thought it interesting)
  • sabretoothtigger
    sabretoothtigger Posts: 10,035 Forumite
    First Post Photogenic Combo Breaker First Anniversary
    edited 23 November 2013 at 7:05PM
    Apparently they can create gold, but it is an isotope not the full element. I think its unstable, radioactive with a half life of 6 months so pretty useless but maybe a Bond villian could make some, sell it for cash and a quick get away.

    Its easier to mine then make from everything Ive read
    Romans could not or would not pay them, so they sacked Rome. I think it was the latter.

    But they could pay them as many debased 5% silver denarius coins. The barbarians said no way were not falling for that, only silver. I wonder if they would have fallen for bitcoins? I doubt it.
    They debased coins because they didnt have enough precious metals to match their spending and military budgets.
    So they really didnt have enough especially at short notice, thats similar to now with the FED and US gov.
    They benefit from cheaper debt and easy money to pay off interest but if anyone demanded a real payment maybe SDR, gold or goods even oil I dont think they could pull it off.
    In theory they can confisicate but if the brutal regime of Rome couldnt do it in time I reckon Washington cant
  • Satoshi
    Satoshi Posts: 253 Forumite
    Thats the point why currency backed by something can not go to nothing like bitcoin or unbacked currency can. If there is a shortage price goes up.
  • Satoshi
    Satoshi Posts: 253 Forumite
    This is the big difference between physical silver and digital currency. If either became illegal to use in the case of silver bullion the value would go up and the free market would find the value as its traded in the black market untraceable physically changing hands in private in underground car parks or stations with no paper or digital trail. If bitcoins were made illegal everyone would have to comply because there is no way to transact privately with no trail. It would cease to exist and go back to its intrinsic value of nothing where it came from.
  • paddyrg
    paddyrg Posts: 13,543 Forumite
    Satoshi wrote: »
    This is the big difference between physical silver and digital currency. ...

    Is it rather similar to e-gold? That didn't end well :-(
  • JohnRo
    JohnRo Posts: 2,887 Forumite
    First Anniversary Combo Breaker First Post
    The reasons e-gold didn't end well are all addressed by bitcoin, having no central control, being designed to work in an electronic environment and not reliant on any of the hopelessly inadequate banking industry infrastructure which is wide open to all manner of corruption and fraudulent transaction.
    'We don't need to be smarter than the rest; we need to be more disciplined than the rest.' - WB
  • csm888
    csm888 Posts: 112 Forumite
    Another interesting way to think about Bitcoin, is Bitcoin is a stock, a share in the Bitcoin idea. In the same way that people have invested in Facebook and Twitter, each have very little intrinsic value just a cool idea. What they have is an idea, and once IPO'd you can invest. But Bitcoin is investable from the beginning by it's very nature.

    (Personally I think twitter and Facebook are overpriced, but they still have obviously significant value in the idea/implementation alone)
  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQ4OAV499EA

    Skip to 12 minutes. Max Keiser and someone from the Bitcoin Trust have a discussion; the person from Bitcoin Trust mentions how Bitcoin has the values of gold and money.
  • Satoshi
    Satoshi Posts: 253 Forumite
    edited 24 November 2013 at 5:54PM
    He makes a good point about how rich people can not put a lot of currency into bitcoin. You would have to keep finding sellers and there are not many sellers who have lots of bitcoin to sell.

    So the derivatives have started. Soon you will be able to place bets on if bitcoin will go up or down just like the bookies, (go long or go short)

    Why buy ETFs or other derivatives of bitcoin, why not just buy bitcoin?

    Thats what this video talks about 2:20 in

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02Y0MReC4a4
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