Proof of overnight stays.

2

Comments

  • Will that be 20% of the total amount or 20% of the amount outstanding? The government calculator says I should pay £90 a month less if the boys stay overnight 1 night a week on average. I'm willing to write off the extra £18 if it's 20% of the outstanding balance.
  • WYSPECIAL
    WYSPECIAL Posts: 633
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    It was the case when CMS first came in that where there was a dispute with insufficient evidence as to overnight stays then they would make an assumption at 1/7 and calculate based on this. This was one of the big differences between CMS and CSA.

    Presumably this is still the case so might be worth asking about.
  • Wrighty1977
    Wrighty1977 Posts: 26 Forumite
    Thank you WYSPECIAL, I will get back in touch with the CMS and look into this.
  • newbutold
    newbutold Posts: 752
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    Will that be 20% of the total amount or 20% of the amount outstanding? The government calculator says I should pay £90 a month less if the boys stay overnight 1 night a week on average. I'm willing to write off the extra £18 if it's 20% of the outstanding balance.

    Under the new system, if you don't pay or have arrears the PWC can request to go on to collect & pay. If the CMS believe you won't pay or have proven not to pay in the past, the PWC's request for collect & pay will be granted. They will then collect the whole amount owing each month from you with a 20% surcharge, the PWC will get charged 4%.

    By only part paying you will be in arrears and therefore classed as proven not to pay and wont be able to chose whether to pay direct or not.

    The 20% will be of the whole amount due each week.
    If my posts have random wrong words, please blame the damn autocorrect not me :D
  • Wrighty1977
    Wrighty1977 Posts: 26 Forumite
    What would happen if I told the CMS that I was living with my girlfriend and her child? Would they ask me to prove it or would that just take my word for it like they took my ex's word for it when she denied the boys stay with me overnight?
  • HoneyNutLoop
    HoneyNutLoop Posts: 568
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    The way you've phrased your post implies you don't actually live with your girlfriend and her child, so would be planning to deliberately misrepresent your situation.

    You may want to consider the wider implications of such a plan. For example, CMS/CSA is part of DWP and share information with each other and HMRC. If your girlfriend is claiming tax credits as a single parent and you are claiming an allowance in your CMS calculation due to living with her and her child, they're going to know something is up.

    You and your girlfriend may then find yourselves on the receiving end of several investigations from multiple government departments. Will it really be worth it for a discount that for most people equates to a few pounds a week?

    For example, if you were earning £25k you would pay £57.53 a week for one child, reducing to £51.21 a week if you also had a child in your household.

    That's before you even get to the whole "it's a criminal offence to knowingly provide false info to CMS" consideration. Whilst very few people actually are prosecuted, the possibility exists.

    If in fact you do live with your girlfriend and her child, my apologies for reading more than was meant in your post. In that situation, does it matter if they ask for proof? You would surely have something that proves where you live to be able to get the change made?
    I often use a tablet to post, so sometimes my posts will have random letters inserted, or entirely the wrong word if autocorrect is trying to wind me up. Hopefully you'll still know what I mean.
  • Wrighty1977
    Wrighty1977 Posts: 26 Forumite
    It would save me £57 a month but was wondering if it would be worth the hassle.
    When I told the CMS about my boys staying overnight they said they'd get my ex to confirm it. They then sent me a letter saying they could not accept the changes to the shared care agreement so I assume my ex didn't confirm it. If she didn't does that mean she has committed a criminal offence?
  • HoneyNutLoop
    HoneyNutLoop Posts: 568
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    It's a criminal offence to knowingly provide false information to them. But as I said before, few people have actually been prosecuted. P

    However, unlike your scenario with your girlfriend's child, where there may be plenty of evidence available to them to indicate the validity or not of a statement about living together, they have no access to independent evidence from other government departments about your children's shared care arrangements.

    So, then you're in a classic he said, she said. From a third party's point of view, is there actually any evidence available to prove it's your ex that's lying and not you? sorry, I know that sounds harsh but I'm trying to present the view of an unrelated third party who knows neither of you. At this point, is there any independent, hard evidence available to prove your shared care arrangement?
    I often use a tablet to post, so sometimes my posts will have random letters inserted, or entirely the wrong word if autocorrect is trying to wind me up. Hopefully you'll still know what I mean.
  • Wrighty1977
    Wrighty1977 Posts: 26 Forumite
    The CMS have said they will only take her word for it or a court order. She has failed to confirm it and the application for a court order was dismissed because I couldn't commit to every other weekend. I work in a hospital laboratory and we offer a 24/7 service. Everyone has to work 1 in 4 Saturdays and 1 in 8 Sundays but they do not always occur on a regular basis so I could only commit to 50% of the weekends. I've rearranged my weekends so I can commit to every weekend now and have e-mailed my ex this but she says she will only discuss this in person and is refusing to reply to my e-mails. The MIAM I had expires on the 4th of August so I may make a new application. At the last hearing my ex objected to the boys staying overnight during the week because I live above a pub and she doesn't want them to be tired for school. They sleep well at the weekends when it's a bit noisy and there's no noise at all during the week.
  • Mojisola
    Mojisola Posts: 35,547
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    I
    She has text me saying she wants to meet in person. I think she's saying this so nothing will be documented so I have e-mailed her saying I will only meet in person if a mediator is present. Has anyone got any ideas?

    With smart phones, it's simple enough to record the meeting.

    Do it openly so that she knows she is being recorded.
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