CCJ for Statute Barred debt, have emigrated but it's my Mum's house, grr

awkawk · 17 October 2016 at 3:43PM

Hello all!

I am here because, I don't know what action to take.

Today my mother informed me she has received a CCJ letter, mentioning bailiff's and that I should pay, for a debt I'm not sure of, that in any case is statute barred.

I say it's statute barred because I nor anyone acting on my behalf has acknowledged this debt, nor made any payment toward it (why would I, I'm not sure it's mine) for over 6 years.

Even if I did owe the money (around £3000), I'm not in a position to pay.

She's ill, and I no longer live in the UK. As you can imagine, it's a real headache - what I want most of all is minimal stress for her, but I'm not in a position to "just pay it".

I've read today on here and elsewhere that my options include, finding a hefty £255 fee, in order to have it "set aside" (on the basis that it's statute barred). However, there may be a hearing, and I can't afford to come to the UK for it.

I've also read, that if I do manage to get through that procedure, the debt could be sold on, and this could happen again (reminds me rather of The Trial).

So, the action I have decided to take is this:

Ask my mother to send a "statutory declaration letter" informing them I do not live there.
If someone has a template, if more than simply "he doesn't live here" is required, that would be very helpful - I haven't been able to find one.

I believe this should be posted to the court. I don't know who else it should be sent to - should she send one of these to the address of any correspondence regarding my statute barred debt she receives?

Secondly:

This £255, is it worth doing that? As I say, I won't be able to attend a "setting aside hearing" so it seems a bit of a risk. On the other hand, I have a perfect UK credit report (haven't taken out any credit for years), and it's rather annoying to have a CCJ. I have been pondering the question, will I return, and if I were to do so, would I want to buy a house. The simple answer is no, I am unlikely to return, and even if I do, your property prices are quite ridiculous - houses cost 3-5 times less here, and are on average nicer (as well as having better weather).

I should note, I continue to use my mother's address to have my UK bank account registered to. They know I don't live there, but Experian have told me today, that that doesn't affect whether they pass the information on or not as a "linked address".

All for statute barred debts, most annoying!

I'm hoping someone here has a bit more experience/knowledge with this sort of thing than I - what I am most concerned about is my mother not receiving these letters any more - I've told her for a long time not to open them, but she still does..

National_Debtline · 17 October 2016 at 4:48PM

Hello awkawk

I'm sure you understand the following point already, and that you are chiefly seeking to minimise any concern on your mother's part, but it is worth reiterating that no action can be taken against someone who just happens to live at the address where the CCJ has been granted.

I appreciate that that may not be enough to entirely reassure your mother if she is opening letters referring to bailiffs etc., no matter that the intended recipient is someone else altogether. Let me add, therefore, that bailiff action is relatively unlikely here. The creditor has already paid out to issue the claim and seen no return on its investment - not so much as a reply to the claim form. Paying further fees to instruct bailiffs when they don't know whether you even live there, let alone have valuable cars/other belongings they could seize to cover the debt, would be very speculative and quite a gamble. Hence a lot of cheap, generic letters threatening enforcement are likely to be sent out, as opposed to actual formal enforcement notices.

Is it worth paying the set aside fee of £255? That depends on whether you see that as the only way of ultimately securing peace of mind for your mother. Ideally, you can achieve that by simply passing on advice like that which I've given above. You've made it clear that adverse UK credit for you is unlikely to be relevant in the foreseeable future, at least for the six-year lifespan this CCJ would have.

I don't know that taking the steps you describe would suffice to stop letters coming through. Realistically, creditors are going to want an alternative point of contact before they redirect future correspondence. It's up to you how specific you want to be - "I live in country XYZ" might persuade them to give up the ghost, then again it might not. If you give them a current address, it deprives them of any excuse to continue writing to your mother's place.

Dennis
@natdebtline

MrsTinks · 17 October 2016 at 4:57PM

Just as well she did if it's a court letter stating the CCJ is now in place as otherwise she could have been woken up by the bailiffs completely unprepared...

Is there now a CCJ in place? what exactly does the letter state? That will kind of determine what you need to do. If it's already in place then I would suggest the set aside fee may be relevant to cough up to get this resolved properly if only for your mums sake.

Change your bank account to your own address - I have a foreign bank account, with my UK address. (I'm from where the account is and they didn't have an issue with this - had it for about 15 years now) - minimise the crap going to your mums address - it sounds like she could do without the stress this is causing her. Not opening the mail in this instance is NOT a solution for her, it really should be you dealing with this and at the very least having had mail re-direct in place but ideally not having let it get to this point in the first place.

Maybe someone has something more constructive about the set aside and being abroad - there might be issues I'm not up to speed on there but for the sake of your mum I would say dealing with this through the court if the CCJ is already in place is the thing to do.

For now she needs to know not to open the door to any bailiffs, to keep her car in the garage or somewhere else secure. If she can't then I would recommend she keeps the receipt for the car to hand, the reg documents won't always do it and ideally keep some proof that you do not live at this address. Normally I would say the onus is on them to prove you live there but for HER sake it's easier if she can get rid of them as quickly as possible to stop her getting stressed until you sort this out.

ETA - most of this advice is focused on the impact on your mum - not on what I would advise normally in dealing with this - how you act will depend on your priority really...

sourcrates · 17 October 2016 at 5:18PM

Hi,

Ok, you say " CCJ Letter".

You need to clarify what you mean by this, has a judgement in default already been granted ?

If not, then it may not be to late to defend this.

It may be a claim form she has received.

Can you clear this up first ?

awkawk · 17 October 2016 at 7:32PM

The letter reads:

FRONT:

Notice of Issue of Warrant of Control
Creditor: Hoist Portfolio Holding 2 Ltd
Debtor: Blah
In the: County Court Business Centre
Court Code: 355
Case Number: Blah
Warrant Number: Blah
Local Number: Blah
Creditor's Ref: Blah

Urgent
To the Debtor
You have not made payment under the judgement as you were ordered. The creditor has therefore asked for a warrant to be issued to the bailiff to seize and sell your goods. Unless you pay the amount due to the county court before ~30 October 2016 the bailiff will call and may remove your goods for sale at public auction. This may mean that you will have to pay further costs.

Total to Pay (including fees): >£3000
Dated: ~10 October 2016

---

BACK:

to the court office at:
The County Court at Edmonton
59 Fore Street
London
N18 2TN

BAILIFFS OFFICE IS OPEN FROM 9AM to 10AM
TELEPHONE NUMBER 02088846500

You can pay the court
by calling at the court office which is open
10AM to 2PM Monday to Friday

Etc...

Cheques and drafts must be made payable to HM Courts & Tribunals Service and crossed.

---

My problems with paying the £255 are multiple; it's a lot of money to me - my wages here are 1/3 what they would be in the UK. Returning to the UK for a setting aside hearing, I'd have to take time off, and spend hundreds in order to make it there. The total cost of my taking that route would be at least £500.
I have read that, after this is set aside, there is nothing to stop the debt being sold on, and this starting again.

I'm going to close my UK accounts. It never occurred to me that it might be possible to send bailiffs to the house, since the debts are over 6 years old, this CCJ has really taken me by surprise. Now things like TransferWise exist, it's not so necessary to have one.

Her car is in the road, rather than on the drive (there isn't one), but in any case, are you honestly suggesting there's any possibility that it could be towed away? I thought they had to prove rather a lot before they went taking goods.
EDIT: This was in response to MrsTinks. Thank you Dennis, on re-reading, your post has already cleared this up. And, sorry for my tone - it's just, this is stressful enough, the suggestion that she might need to worry at all about her car, kneejerk reaction...

Since this is a statute barred debt we're talking about, is there (not just some, but a pretty much certain) chance that I could take time off work, pay the fee, fly back, contest it, and then ask them to repay all my costs?

sourcrates · 17 October 2016 at 7:59PM

Right so judgement in default has been granted then.

Well it's like Dennis says above, it's highly unlikley they will want to splash out any more cash by way of bailliffs, I don't know which country you are in but basically without an addresss, there is nothing the creditor can do.

It may put some undue pressure on your mother though initially, until it's established you do not live there.

They cannot force entry, but if there are goods outside, such as a car, they could seize this until mother can prove ownership.

MrsTinks · 17 October 2016 at 10:20PM

As sourcrates says, it's unlikely they will pay for a bailiff, but importantly it is NOT impossible. That means they could seize her her (probably clamp it) until she proves it's hers. It's also embarrassing for her to have the bailiffs turn up with the neighbours I guess.

As for them refunding all your costs to fly back? Doubt it...

Sensible thing is to stay away if that is your intent anyway, but initially there will be stress for your mum. And are you sure the CCJ was not granted before it was statute barred?

I would suggest writing to them and posting with fastest post from where ever you are that you now reside in x country and have no resided at that address for X years... and hope for the best.

fatbelly · 18 October 2016 at 12:34PM

Guys it's already with bailiffs - the county court bailiffs at Edmonton County Court

That's a warrant of control.

Now I don't know the particular bailiffs concerned but the county court ones are generally OK - not the idiots that the likes of Rossendales employ.

So sending them some evidence that the debtor does not live there (probably not a stat dec necessarily but check) should work.

awkawk · 18 October 2016 at 12:52PM

The best course of action, as per usual, is none.

I greatly appreciate your replies.

sourcrates · 18 October 2016 at 1:50PM

fatbelly wrote: »

Guys it's already with bailiffs - the county court bailiffs at Edmonton County Court

That's a warrant of control.

Now I don't know the particular bailiffs concerned but the county court ones are generally OK - not the idiots that the likes of Rossendales employ.

So sending them some evidence that the debtor does not live there (probably not a stat dec necessarily but check) should work.

I really should read these things more thougherly !!!

awkawk · 28 October 2016 at 4:07PM

I was on here, reading about something else, and decided to check up on this thread. fatbelly must have posted whilst I was writing my reply - I only saw it now.

That's good to know - that they're reasonable folks. Hopefully that means they won't attempt to clamp her car - I don't even hold a drivers licence!

CCJ for Statute Barred debt, have emigrated but it's my Mum's house, grr

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