PCN after time limit - PLEASE HELP

Detta · 2 August 2016 at 9:26PM

Please if anyone can advise me. I received a PCN which was over the time limit from what I read in the forum. It was issued 18 days after the event, I counted from the day after the event and I only counted Mondays to Fridays (no public holidays in between), it was delivered 3 days later. I wrote to the company, not naming the driver, stating 'The Notice to Keeper failed to meet the requirements of Schedule 4 of the POFA Act 2012. The Notice to Keeper was not delivered to the keeper within the prescribed timescale; not within a period of 14 days beginning with the day after that on which the specified period of parking ended'. And specifying the dates. I first received a letter back which took 6 days to arrive and was basically a reminder of the but it arrived 1 day after the 14 day discount ended. And they quoted the Beavis case (which is nothing to do with my case). I wrote back stating they did not acknowledge my first letter (which I sent again) and obviously they had not read the contents. They had replied saying the appeal is unsuccessful and gave a POPLA code. I would like to know:
1-What happens if the POPLA appeal in unsuccessful?
2-Is it enough if I appeal to POPLA with the above reason only?
3-Do I have to provide the recorded delivery receipts (although their letter dates show it was issued 18 days later)?
Please help and thank you for any advice.

pappa_golf · 2 August 2016 at 9:47PM

1: why did you send it recorded delivery? I am surprised they actually accepted it.

2: who is the parking Co.

Detta · 2 August 2016 at 9:51PM

1-I sent it recorded to have proof they received it. I didn't know they could refuse it.
2- Parking Eye

pappa_golf · 2 August 2016 at 10:10PM

ok PE , you could have done an online appeal

now PE use UK mail and are notorious for late delivery , however you state that it was not issued until day 18 (exc weekends)

please answer the following

1: is the car registered (name on v5) at your home address or I this a lease/hire type car

2: are you in England/wales or are you Scotland/NI

3: is there a sentence on the NTK that states they are relying on POFA , or have they left this out

4: type of carpark (location?)

Detta · 2 August 2016 at 10:25PM

I didn't know about appealing online.

1- yes registered at home address (not lease/hire)
2- England
3- I can't see this sentence anywhere, would it be in the body of the letter?
4- Aldi car park. The allowed time is 1hr 30 mins but it states that the stay was 1hr 50 mins

pappa_golf · 2 August 2016 at 10:32PM

OK they are not looking to act on POFa ,

not seen an aldi case go to court?

have you been back to aldi and ask them to cancel? , they often will if you can show recepts/bank statements

and as a final point

BPA code of conduct:

13 Grace periods
13.1 Your approach to parking management must allow a driver who enters your car park but decides not to park, to leave the car park within a reasonable period without having their vehicle issued with a parking charge notice.
13.2 You should allow the driver a reasonable ‘grace period’ in which to decide if they are going to stay or go. If the driver is on your land without permission you should still allow them a grace period to read your signs and leave before you take enforcement action.
13.3 You should be prepared to tell us the specific grace period at a site if our compliance team or our agents ask what it is.
13.4 You should allow the driver a reasonable period to leave the private car park after the parking contract has ended, before you take enforcement action. If the location is one where parking is normally permitted, the Grace Period at the end of the parking period should be a minimum of 10 minutes.

please remember , the cameras are on entry/exit (time on site) NOT the time parked

Detta · 2 August 2016 at 10:46PM

I have been back at Aldi but I threw away receipt before that as it was cash. The manager was really unhelpful and seemed uninterested. I had a child with me and had to walk to Tesco cash point to get cash, but since I didn't say who driver is I can't really say that.

1- So in the POPLA appeal I can quote the bit about the grace time? Although it was 20 minutes not 10.

2- What do you mean they are not looking to act on POFa?

3- Can I rely on the timing only (as above about the 14 days)?

Redx · 2 August 2016 at 10:51PM

if you read the BPA CoP again , carefully , you will see that grace time is to be allowed on either side of the parking time

so say 10 minutes before and over 10 minutes afterwards may equate to the time spent parking up , reading signage etc , and departing again

Detta · 2 August 2016 at 11:12PM

I am sorry I don't know much about this subject or searching for posts etc.

Please can you advise me:

1- regarding the POFa mentioned by pappa golf; what does it mean that they are not looking to act on POFa?
2- when I appeal to POPLA what shall I say? That is,
-can I rely on the timing, i.e. past the 14 days?
- do I mention the grace time?
would these 2 points be enough or have I got a hopeless case?

Redx · 2 August 2016 at 11:19PM

1) he seems to say that yes, perhaps because they are past the 14 day limit for POFA2012 ?

2) nobody can say if you will win or lose as there have been many bad decisions made at popla

I would say those are 2 of several appeal points you can make at popla which hopefully would mean you would win, but there can be no guarantees

personally I would add more points , like no locus standii and poor signage that fails the BPA CoP as well, and try to argue that it is not the same as the Beavis case

so your popla appeal should be based on recent examples submitted by other people after approval

you only need one winning point to win , even if you have several

if you do win , its binding upon PE , who will move onto new prey

Detta · 2 August 2016 at 11:29PM

Thank you. But I don't think that I can put more points as the signage was probably ok and other points too. I don't know if I can argue any other points.

PCN after time limit - PLEASE HELP

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