THE Prepping thread - a new beginning :)

moneyistooshorttomention · 16 March 2017 at 8:24PM

In all these scenarios other people are (understandably) coming up with as "possible problems" the thing is to ensure, one way or another, there is a viable alternative if you don't look out for this boy.

If "the authorities" found out - then that boy could find himself in a rather worse scenario and for rather longer (eg taken into care). That would not be in the boys best interests and it would be rather a lot more in his best interests to ensure he is kept safe/sound and the "authorities" don't find out anything about it.

If you told the wrong person - then that person might take it upon themselves to interfere and tell "the authorities" and sit back and feel very righteous about themselves and ignore the fact "the authorities" might do something like putting that boy in an even worse situation (eg into care).

The nearest I've come to a situation like this over the years = I just kept my mouth shut and made sure the child concerned was looked after properly and no-one "official" any the wiser. I know we hadnt got to the over-cautious 2010's at that point - but I'm not a "child" person and found myself looking after a child before now for a fortnight and no-one batting an eyelid and the child duly telling everyone how well I'd looked after them afterwards apparently. I even landed up agreeing to look after another one I hadnt clapped eyes on:eek: at one point years back - and only didnt do so in the event because the next door neighbour did instead.

Both children were absolutely fine/there werent any problems at all. That was that.

thriftwizard · 16 March 2017 at 9:15PM

Echoing all that's been said above, jk0; it's a situation with wayyy too much potential for things to go wrong or mischief to occur, and the Dad seriously needs to re-think his plan or make sensible arrangements for the boy's care. We did leave our two older lads one weekend when they were in their mid-teens & we HAD to go to Wales to visit a very-sick elderly relative, but our then-next-door neighbour, a teacher and godmother to one of our other children, kept a very strict eye on them! There was plenty of food in the house, but they made & ate omelettes all weekend for some reason & there wasn't an egg left in the house or even the garden when we got back - and we had 12 chickens at the time.

At that time, and possibly to this day, there was no legal age for leaving a child alone in the house. It was deemed to be a matter for parental judgement, rightly so in most cases, because there's a world of difference between leaving a 15 y.o. alone in the house for half an hour to nip to the supermarket, and leaving them for 2 weeks to nip to Africa, or leaving a 5 y.o. alone for half an hour for that matter. Common sense should tell you that the last two are recipes for disaster, but the first isn't... The only remotely-relevant law at that time was that a child under 12 could not be left alone in a room with an unguarded fire; this may have changed since as they are now 27 & 28. The other factor is that a lot depends on the individual child; there are 12 y.o.s who can cope perfectly well for an hour or so, whatever life throws at them, and 17½ y.o.s who can't. Also, remember that it's not that long ago that people could leave school at 14 and go to work, and in many societies to this day they can get married at that kind of age because they are deemed to be adults... Would put that in italics if it'd let me, because jk0's friend may well consider his son to be virtually adult, coming from a different part of the world. (I mean no offence to anyone by that statement.)

Anyway, your friend needs to engage his common sense, realise that things may be seen very differently here, and that he's laying himself open to problems at the very least, even if his son is extremely sensible & trustworthy & comes to no harm. Please explain that to him!

GreyQueen · 17 March 2017 at 8:03AM

Less than a month after turning 15, my own parents were in the workforce, as was the norm for non-elite people of their generation. They were, however, living in their parental homes (and were until marriage), and their employers knew they were youngsters and they weren't expected to do a man's work or have the sense and abilities of a grown person. In effect, they were young adults on probation, easing their way incrementally into adult life. My Dad (mid-seventies now) has said several times that he didn't consider himself to be a child at 15 and would have been offended to be described as such.

I was thinking about this issue a lot after I went offline last night. In terms of physical ability, there is nothing about looking after themselves for a fortnight which ought to tax the abilities of a developmentally-normal 15 year old. Not cooking, a bit of cleaning, laundering clothes, doing one's homework with parental pestering and getting to bed and up at a reasonable hour.

However, there are good reasons why we don't allow 15 year old people to drive cars or trucks, fly airliners, operate heavy machinery, sign legal contracts include marriage contracts, and they are all to do with the immaturity of the 15 year old brain.

Risk asssessment, and the ability to predict consequences from actions based on experience, is accrued over time. A person in their mid-teens doesn't know what they don't know, they're ignorant of the many things which can go wrong and are unfortunately seen as easy prey by the unscrupulous.

jk0's pal is heading for a fall if he insists on following this course of action; all it would take is for a concerned neighbour to pick up a phone and call childrens' social services and they'll be on the case. He could also find the police waiting to have a word on his return, and the case back in the family court.:(

[Deleted User] · 17 March 2017 at 8:53AM

GreyQueen wrote: »

However, there are good reasons why we don't allow 15 year old people to drive cars or trucks, fly airliners, operate heavy machinery, sign legal contracts include marriage contracts, and they are all to do with the immaturity of the 15 year old brain.

And yet, just 12 months later, we allow two of those activities.

GreyQueen · 17 March 2017 at 9:00AM

Bedsit_Bob wrote: »

And yet, just 12 months later, we allow two of those activities.

Which of those do we allow at 16? Driving? I don't think so. Try to sign a tenancy as a 16 y.o and you'll be laughed out of the room.

Hell, I've worked in factories and under-18s weren't even allowed to use a meat-slicing machine.

moneyistooshorttomention · 17 March 2017 at 9:00AM

Certainly a generational thing here.

My parents (the very elderly generation) both left school at 14. My father was made to leave basically and not allowed to take up a scholarship he'd won (courtesy of large poor family). So both of them were out working at that age.

As for running a house - my mother was not only going off to work at 14 - but was also running her mothers house for her (eg doing all the housework for her lazy mother), despite being charged a high proportion of her salary as "board" by said lazy mother.

Add that a few centuries back the rich and powerful were marrying off their daughters sometimes at very early ages (despite no birth control around back then - so there must have been some children giving birth to children presumably).

Where do you draw the line? After all - our own Government doesnt accept people are adults until well into their 20s (think it might even be 35?) - if we judge by when they get full adult benefits etc (eg it's accepted they're entitled to rent a self-contained one bedroom flat - rather than houseshare) if they're unemployed.

jk0 · 17 March 2017 at 9:37AM

Thanks guys.

I think if there was no-one who thought it odd, or any other children in my friend's son's life, then he could probably cope okay with some extra food. He is a sensible lad, but 'easily-led'. The reason he is back in Reading is that he was caught as a passenger in a car his friends had stolen in London. Effectively then, he is the new kid at school, so might be even more needful of peer approval, which might lead him into trouble if left on his own.

I'll have a quiet word with Auntie. Funnily enough, we met outside one of my rentals last summer, and had a nice chat.

monnagran · 17 March 2017 at 11:26AM

Phew! thank goodness jk0, I was just concerned that in your desire to help you might land yourself in bother. Definitely have a word with Auntie, she should be able to sort things out from the basis of family concern.
If you still want to help, you could offer to help HER. Therefore not being responsible yourself but still offering some assistance.
Win, win.

Nargleblast · 17 March 2017 at 12:54PM

Good thinking, jko. If your mate doesn't appreciate it then he's a prat who doesn't deserve a friend like you.

[Deleted User] · 17 March 2017 at 1:11PM

GreyQueen wrote: »

Which of those do we allow at 16? Driving? I don't think so.

Driving at 16 is allowed, for people with disabilities.

It's also allowed at 16, on mopeds.

The other one I was referring to, is getting married.

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THE Prepping thread - a new beginning :)

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