50,000 pounds to invest

2

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  • bostonerimus
    bostonerimus Posts: 5,617 Forumite
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    50Twuncle wrote: »
    QC charge a %fee of about 1.5%

    Which is bad enough, but the there's all the transaction fees too. Yet again I'm amazed that people in the UK are so sanguine about paying someone 1.5% to "manage" their money. At 50k the OP will do ok with an S&S ISA containing low cost tracker funds that requires minimal DIY management.
    “So we beat on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past.”
  • 50Twuncle
    50Twuncle Posts: 10,763 Forumite
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    Earning what ?
    1.5% if you are lucky ?
  • bostonerimus
    bostonerimus Posts: 5,617 Forumite
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    edited 6 July 2017 at 2:26PM
    50Twuncle wrote: »
    Earning what ?
    1.5% if you are lucky ?

    My low cost tracker portfolio earned +13% over the last 12 months, of course it might earn -13% next year.....but over 30 years it's averaged 8% a year and it would be easy for the OP to have a similar low cost diversified DIY portfolio in an S&S ISA.
    “So we beat on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past.”
  • cloud_dog
    cloud_dog Posts: 6,044 Forumite
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    bostonerimus wrote: »
    My low cost tracker portfolio earned +13% over the last 12 months, of course it might earn -13% next year.....but over 30 years it's averaged 8% a year and it would be easy for the OP to have a similar low cost diversified DIY portfolio in an S&S ISA.
    Ok, I'll bite.... Care to explain how easy this is because I have a some concerns around the possibility you may be making assumptions somewhere.
    Personal Responsibility - Sad but True :D

    Sometimes.... I am like a dog with a bone
  • bostonerimus
    bostonerimus Posts: 5,617 Forumite
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    edited 6 July 2017 at 3:02PM
    I'm in the US and have the following portfolio

    50% Vanguard Total US stock index
    20% Vanguard Total International Stock Index
    30% Vanguard Total Bond Index

    total average fees/expenses are 0.06%

    The OP could simply use VLS80 or VLS60 etc or go with a combination of a Global Tracker, a Global Bond index and maybe a UK equity tracker if they have a domestic bias etc. Those could be easily purchased directly from UK Vanguard or through another platform if you want. There are also lots of other trackers you could equally well use like those from Blackrock. Don't make this more expensive or difficult than it needs to be.
    “So we beat on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past.”
  • cloud_dog
    cloud_dog Posts: 6,044 Forumite
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    Hi...
    bostonerimus wrote: »
    The OP could simply use VLS80 or VLS60 etc...
    Ok, so how easy is it for me to know these funds exist?
    How easy is it for me to understand what these funds are about?
    What does the 80 or 60 mean?
    If I understand what they imply how do I ascertain what the impact of that is on me?
    Why should I split between bonds and shares?
    What percentage should I choose?
    .... Oh, so the percentage relate to an element of risk but what risk, what does it mean? (If there is risk then I'll shy away from it)
    bostonerimus wrote: »
    ...or go with a combination of a Global Tracker, a Global Bond index and maybe a UK equity tracker if they have a domestic bias etc.
    So, how do I know I need these types of funds (exposure)?
    Where do I find that information?
    ....If I find the information on the interweb how do I know I can trust it / it is reliable?
    What percentages should I put in to each fund?
    Do I monitor the funds?
    ....If they go up/down by an amount should I take action?
    ....What action should I take?
    ....Do I need to concern myself with if the increase/decrease is due to some currency effect?
    ....Should I take different action in this case?
    Do I just ignore the funds until retirement?

    bostonerimus wrote: »
    Those could be easily purchased directly from UK Vanguard or through another platform if you want. There are also lots of other trackers you could equally well use like those from Blackrock.
    Yes but, which ones?
    Why do some funds perform differently to others?
    bostonerimus wrote: »
    Don't make this more expensive or difficult than it needs to be.
    But, I don't know what 'expensive' is? Surely that is a relative term, so is £100 or £1000 expensive; I don't know?

    I have similar problem and dilemas with my car. I can probably buy a manual and change the oil myself and save myself money but I choose to pay the garage to do it year after year after year.

    Thanks for playing the game :)

    I'm not dismissing your low cost focus but I do feel you are missing / ignoring a number bigger picture / considerations.
    Personal Responsibility - Sad but True :D

    Sometimes.... I am like a dog with a bone
  • bostonerimus
    bostonerimus Posts: 5,617 Forumite
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    You ask excellent questions and a DIY investor should be have a grasp of the answers before they invest. But you really are making this more difficult than it needs to be. I don't believe that I'm ignoring any important considerations......or at least if I am they haven't hurt me too much over the past 30 years....maybe you could describe those as that would be a useful addition to the discussion.
    “So we beat on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past.”
  • cloud_dog
    cloud_dog Posts: 6,044 Forumite
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    bostonerimus wrote: »
    You ask excellent questions and a DIY investor should be have a grasp of the answers before they invest. But you really are making this more difficult than it needs to be. I don't believe that I'm ignoring any important considerations......or at least if I am they haven't hurt me too much over the past 30 years....maybe you could describe those as that would be a useful addition to the discussion.
    Principally, this is the main consideration you are making an assumption on.

    If you accept that I am not a person who can know how to progress investments, understand the steps to take, obtain and digest answers, or simply can't be bothered because I am a) too lazy, b) my time in monetary value is far more important than saving the associated cost of an adviser, then there must be another option.

    There are people who can / want to (you being one) and there are people who can't / don't want to DIY. If a person falls in to the later category will they be financially better off in the long run to:
    1. Undertake no investing and stick with savings (deposit accounts)?
    2. Incur additional costs and take professional advice so as to invest?
    Personal Responsibility - Sad but True :D

    Sometimes.... I am like a dog with a bone
  • bostonerimus
    bostonerimus Posts: 5,617 Forumite
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    edited 6 July 2017 at 4:46PM
    cloud_dog wrote: »
    Principally, this is the main consideration you are making an assumption on.

    If you accept that I am not a person who can know how to progress investments, understand the steps to take, obtain and digest answers, or simply can't be bothered because I am a) too lazy, b) my time in monetary value is far more important than saving the associated cost of an adviser, then there must be another option.

    There are people who can / want to (you being one) and there are people who can't / don't want to DIY. If a person falls in to the later category will they be financially better off in the long run to:
    1. Undertake no investing and stick with savings (deposit accounts)?
    2. Incur additional costs and take professional advice so as to invest?

    I think you aren't giving people enough credit. I little research will allow most people to successfully invest in a "lazy" tracker portfolio and if you are in a multi-asset fund the rebalancing will be done automatically. People should completely ignore active funds and funds with a tight focus and stick to broad market trackers. Once they do that there's no need to get deep into the performance of funds. Perhaps the most difficult aspect of DIY is the actions.....or lack of them.....to take when markets are falling, that's a time when mistakes can be made. But I stick by my initial proposal that with a little reading and education most people can successfully DIY invest in a portfolio of a small number of tracker funds and that would be a potential choice for the OP.
    “So we beat on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past.”
  • AndyT678
    AndyT678 Posts: 757 Forumite
    First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    bostonerimus wrote: »
    Perhaps the most difficult aspect of DIY is the actions.....or lack of them.....to take when markets are falling, that's a time when mistakes can be made.

    Mostly I'm in broad agreement with your point of view but I do think you're underplaying the significance of this effect...
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