Help with Boundary Wall - Its about to collapse into my property

Hi there,
I badly need help with a boundary wall issue. We live in a row of terraced houses. When the house was purchased the surveyor noted in his report that after inspecting the deeds and condition of the garden walls, that garden walls were needed attention and that we should look into rebuilding/repairing.
There is then a picture shown, showing the right hand garden wall, with my back to the house. In chatting to the neighbour/landlord he also believes that this wall belongs to us.
With this in mind I spent most of last summer repointing this wall, and cementing the capping stones.
The boundary walls either side of us are a single skin red brick wall, 1 metre high, with supporting pillars every 4-5 foot. There is no rear access to any properties in our row of terraced houses as there is either a 12ft high wall or gable end wall of another house.
With our wall safe and sound I looked at trying to get the neighbour to re-point theirs on the left hand side (again with back to wall).
Unfortunately this isn’t simple as the house is rented out, and all contact MUST go through the letting agent. They have “allegedly” spoken to the landlord several times who claims the wall is:
• Either not there wall so don’t want to know.
• Claims it’s a party wall so only willing to do anything if we pay half
• Claim the wall only needs repointing and would be £900, so £450 each.
This may have been the case when I started chasing this 3 years ago, as each year has gone by the frost cracking has become worse and the wall is BADLY leaning into our property.
I have purchased the maps & info from the land registry costing £10, and sadly just shows maps, and pointless text with nothing clearly marked.
We have 2 young girls who last year couldn’t even play in their own garden/Wendy house as it is too dangerous for them to be in the garden.
With my little finger I can physically move the entire length of the wall and I am fearful it could now collapse at any minute. There are already 4 bricks that have come out of the wall and are on my property.
I have yearly chased the Letting agent with the same rubbish responses every year.
My objections on paying for the wall to be repaired are the following:
• I do not believe it’s my wall. The wall I am responsible for I have repaired!
• The wall is actually being use as a soil retaining wall, by said neighbour. As several extensions have been built over the years, rather than extract the soil through the house, which is the only option, they have illegally with no planning permission, raised the original ground level.
I can happily prove original ground level, through the roof pitch of the house, the original quarry tiles for what was the yard, and 1 inch below my top soil and are very obviously as it would have been, a quarry tiled yard.
The soil/increase in ground level is the sole reason why this wall is about to collapse, the wall was never designed as a retaining wall for soil, and when it rains, water comes through the wall with dirt and mud from the soil of next door.
The soil slopes from the middle of the garden and raises up to over 93cm up the wall. The soil is also 93cm high against the gable end wall of a house, easily breaching damp proof and causing damage, sadly this house is also rented and struggle to find landlord to so if we could both attempt to fix the issue together.
However because no 1 knew the ground level had been illegally raise and because it has been this way for more than 3 years, the council have advised it automatically has planning permission.
• If it wasn’t for this soil, I would just bite the bullet, demolish the wall and put 6ft panels in, and have a much better and more private garden. However as soon as the wall is demolished large amounts of soil will land in my garden.

I have spoken to the local council from a H&S point of view and the environmental health team said they would be interested in helping, but the help with be on the way of slapping an order on both properties, taking the whole thing to court IF no 1 acted, and then it would be down to structural surveys and planning people to argue the case, but would all become expensive.
I just really need a sensible solution to this so we can enjoy our garden, and the kids can play in the safety of the garden.

Any help/advise or solutions would be amazing, as I have now just resigned myself to the wall falling down and then trying to deal with and claim damages to my shed, patio etc.
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Comments

  • Le_Kirk
    Le_Kirk Posts: 22,284 Forumite
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    On your deeds does it show the boundary with a T mark? This normally indicates who would be responsible for the wall. For example, your wall on the right, does the T mark show it as your responsibility? I know that people (and the law) say that the deeds only prove the extent of your property (i.e. the boundary) and the T mark doesn't always mean "ownership" but it is used to indicate responsibility. Are there piers on the LH wall and if so, are they on your side or the neighbour's side? To me this would indicate responsibility. However it sound like you neighbour is the one lacking responsibility. It may be you'll have to bite the bullet and agree to go halves - at least that way the wall will be secure (will it, just by repointing) and your girls will be safe.
  • stator
    stator Posts: 7,441 Forumite
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    I don't know how the other neighbour convinced you that the wall you share is your responsibility, but that places no onus on your other neighbour.
    I don't think you have any evidence that it does belong wholly to the neighbour so it should be assumed to be owned 50/50.
    Split the cost of having it knocked down and rebuilt.
    Changing the world, one sarcastic comment at a time.
  • Warwick_Hunt
    Warwick_Hunt Posts: 1,179 Forumite
    Le_Kirk wrote: »
    On your deeds does it show the boundary with a T mark? This normally indicates who would be responsible for the wall. For example, your wall on the right, does the T mark show it as your responsibility? I know that people (and the law) say that the deeds only prove the extent of your property (i.e. the boundary) and the T mark doesn't always mean "ownership" but it is used to indicate responsibility. Are there piers on the LH wall and if so, are they on your side or the neighbour's side? To me this would indicate responsibility. However it sound like you neighbour is the one lacking responsibility. It may be you'll have to bite the bullet and agree to go halves - at least that way the wall will be secure (will it, just by repointing) and your girls will be safe.

    Isn’t a wall the same as a fence and it belongs to whoever paid for it?

    Responsibility for a boundary and ownership of the barrier erected on or near it are two separate issues.
  • Well there is a big issue why I wont pay for the wall.

    1st I don't believe it is mine, but secondly with the amount of soil that has at some point been built up, a single skinned garden wall will not hold back the soil. This is the reason this wall is in such a bad state, its not through lack of maintenance. It is because there is so much soil against the wall it is pushing it into my property. The wall was designed as a boundary wall, not a soil retaining wall.

    If the wall was to be rebuilt it would cost substantial figure as it will hold back the soil. The letting agents have said the lanlord will ONLY go 50/50 and will not remove the soil.

    To Le-kirk, pillars are my side, but they swap sides constantly as you go down the terrace. This is due to the houses have been around at least since 1850, and I think have been rebuilt a few times over the years.

    I know 2 houses down from us has pillars facing his property on the left and right walls.
  • There is nothing at all the the land registry documentation. Just boundary outlined in red. Thats it!
    £10 well spent.... not....
  • Le_Kirk
    Le_Kirk Posts: 22,284 Forumite
    First Anniversary First Post Photogenic Name Dropper
    Isn’t a wall the same as a fence and it belongs to whoever paid for it?

    Yes but if the houses/walls have been built for years and both neighbours have moved in since they were built, how would they be able to work out who paid for what?
    Responsibility for a boundary and ownership of the barrier erected on or near it are two separate issues.

    Can you be responsible for a boundary? I thought the deed just delineated where the boundary is and therefore where your property starts and ends.
  • PSG77 wrote: »
    Well there is a big issue why I wont pay for the wall.
    Then given the circumstances you describe, you won't be getting a new wall.
  • Furts
    Furts Posts: 4,474 Forumite
    I am not a lawyer - just a contracting type who has been involved with building lots of retaining walls between homes. The principle has always been ... the wall is holding up someones garden and they own this wall and have the responsibility for its' safety. Which seems logical to me. Why should a low level neighbour have the responsibility for preventing the high level neighbours garden from collapsing?

    Getting the high level neighbour to co-operate will not be easy because retaining walls are expensive pieces of construction. In the case of OP this is something to have been factored in when purchasing their home. Either do not purchase, or have the contingency to rectify the wall. Hopefully if the contingency route was taken then the purchase price fell to reflect this. The warning was clearly given by the Surveyor before purchase!
  • unforeseen
    unforeseen Posts: 7,279 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper First Post
    There is a big difference between building a new retaining wall and rebuilding a wall that has soil piled against it over time. Wit a new wall it is clear where the responsibility lies. With a wall that has soil piled against it over time then things aren't so clear as the wall was never designated as a retaining wall.

    It's a case of whoever wants the wall rebuilds it
  • unforeseen
    unforeseen Posts: 7,279 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper First Post
    edited 19 January 2018 at 1:15PM
    And whoever is worried about its safety takes steps to make things safe be that placing a barrier to prevent their children playing near it or taking it down themselves

    Before it gets mentioned the the neighbour has the liability of it collapses and injures somebody that is not the case. The OP is aware of the danger and it is therefore their responsibility to mitigate the danger in their garden
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