Flight delay and cancellation compensation, Jet2.com ONLY
Comments
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I'd be interested in peoples thoughts around a tyre being blown being an EC. In my simpleton way, an aircraft tyre is a big, robust item. It wouldn't be burst by a single screw on the taxiway. As such, it leads me to lead to believe either the tyre was worn, substandard or the taxiway wasn't checked and correctly cleared. None of these are EC and I find it difficult to appreciate a viable argument for them fitting that criteria.
I don't like linking to the CAA, it's a love hate relationship, but I can't even recall a tyre busting as an EC on the now infamous NEB wish list!
Anyway, this seems to be the latest from the CAA..
https://www.caa.co.uk/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=4294979249
Good luckAfter reading PtL Vaubans Guide , please don't desert us, hang around and help others!
Hi, we’ve had to remove part of your signature. If you’re not sure why please read the forum rules or email the forum team if you’re still unsure - MSE ForumTeam0 -
Pcy - it was your post I saw further up that prompted me to stop lurking!
In relation to Pcy's outgoing flight, and I am possibly clutching at straws here, but given SKG is known for strong northerly winds between June and August, necessitating landing on runway 34, could Jet2 not have predicted the flight would find it difficult to land following its delay? The winds are known so hardly freak or wholly exceptional weather. The pilot on our reciprocal inbound flight told us he was not allowed to land on Runway 34 at night. We don't know the reason for this but I do know, from research (as posted above), that night landings are permitted providing PAPIS are available (precision approach path indicators - usually adjacent to runway) and EGPWS (enhanced ground proximity warning system - installed on plane) are serviceable. I checked the reg of the plane (FlightRadar24) and its manufacture date was Nov 1999. We'll never know, but I wonder if it was fitted? (It was developed late 90s). Also, found a BA document on line, and they don't permit landing on runway 34 at night. Wonder if Jet2 do? Not sure if it makes any difference at all, but could they have foreseen this could happen in the event of delay. And if they could, why schedule a flight to land late evening when, even if slightly delayed, known weather patterns combined with predictable runway restrictions could make it impossible to land?
J Pears and Novice Angel - you have been so helpful. After more thought, I think I will DIY this. Good to know that they can't rely on knock-ons.0 -
Thanks for this, I'm trying to absorb everything I read at the moment, in prep for bundle creation - not easy when I'm still in 2013 on the Court Success thread! :eek:
I'd be interested in peoples thoughts around a tyre being blown being an EC. In my simpleton way, an aircraft tyre is a big, robust item. It wouldn't be burst by a single screw on the taxiway. As such, it leads me to lead to believe either the tyre was worn, substandard or the taxiway wasn't checked and correctly cleared. None of these are EC and I find it difficult to appreciate a viable argument for them fitting that criteria.
Obviously this only accounts for 2hrs 50min of the delay, I'm just working through each piece of the puzzle.
Hi pcyuljr,
A burst tyre is not an EC, it is an inherent part of operating an airline. A bit like driving your car, you get a flat and it's up to you to get it repaired, same with the airline.
Manchester is one of J2's main bases so the onus is upon them to have alternative arrangements in place to prevent this type of incident turning a mole hill into a mountain. If they don't, it's their problem and they should pay up without attempting to avoid their responsibilities.
The regulations put a responsibility on airline to resolve these problems quickly and efficiently to save further inconveniencing their passengers further. This would include, for example, leasing in another aircraft to fill the obligations of the u/s aircraft or crew.
J2 know the in's and out's of 'extraordinary circumstances' after losing a high profile court case a couple of years ago, so you would expect that they would know better than trying hoodwink their customers yet again.
Good luck with your claim.Please read Vaubans superb guide. To find it Google and then download 'vaubans guide'.0 -
Hi pcyuljr,
J2 know the in's and out's of 'extraordinary circumstances' after losing a high profile court case a couple of years ago, so you would expect that they would know better than trying hoodwink their customers yet again.
Good luck with your claim.
Thanks for the input, all is welcome. To be fair to Jet2, in their refusal to pay compensation, they are claiming the weather was the cause of the delay. My argument is the weather only became a factor due to the original tyre burst.
No tyre burst = arrival on time = no weather issues = no 19hr delay!
That's my case right there...just need to get on with proving it now!0 -
Pcy - it was your post I saw further up that prompted me to stop lurking!
In relation to Pcy's outgoing flight, and I am possibly clutching at straws here, but given SKG is known for strong northerly winds between June and August, necessitating landing on runway 34, could Jet2 not have predicted the flight would find it difficult to land following its delay? The winds are known so hardly freak or wholly exceptional weather. The pilot on our reciprocal inbound flight told us he was not allowed to land on Runway 34 at night. We don't know the reason for this but I do know, from research (as posted above), that night landings are permitted providing PAPIS are available (precision approach path indicators - usually adjacent to runway) and EGPWS (enhanced ground proximity warning system - installed on plane) are serviceable. I checked the reg of the plane (FlightRadar24) and its manufacture date was Nov 1999. We'll never know, but I wonder if it was fitted? (It was developed late 90s). Also, found a BA document on line, and they don't permit landing on runway 34 at night. Wonder if Jet2 do? Not sure if it makes any difference at all, but could they have foreseen this could happen in the event of delay. And if they could, why schedule a flight to land late evening when, even if slightly delayed, known weather patterns combined with predictable runway restrictions could make it impossible to land?
I'm glad you're motivated to push it further, maybe we could look at creating our bundles together, they will be quite similar up to some point? You're clearly ahead of me with your research above!
Of note, the pilot did actually attempt a first landing at Thessalonika, aborting quite late into it. After this, we circled for around 30 minutes before the pilot stated we would have to go to Athens. If he made the attempt to land, I'd like to think it was within legal limits of both his capabilities as a pilot and the aircraft's operating limits...0 -
Thanks for the input, all is welcome. To be fair to Jet2, in their refusal to pay compensation, they are claiming the weather was the cause of the delay. My argument is the weather only became a factor due to the original tyre burst.
No tyre burst = arrival on time = no weather issues = no 19hr delay!
That's my case right there...just need to get on with proving it now!
I recall reading about that very same argument being put before a judge in a previous similar case. ie. most of the delay was none EC related but the last few minutes were.
The verdict was in the claimants favour, not sure where it was but I'll try to find it.Please read Vaubans superb guide. To find it Google and then download 'vaubans guide'.0 -
Guys you are overthinking this a little too much. As I posted above. Burst tyre, not EC. K2 took nearly 3 hours to get a replacement plane at one of their major hubs. (I had a RA flight in March from LBA, plane broke, they used one 2 stands down within an hour or so. And LBA is sparse for RA flights.)
If you had departed on time, possibly no weather issues, but also J2 could have used the other runway even if weather was bad.
Pcy - knock on from weather is not an EC, case law available I think, escapes me which case though.
Keep it simple. You don't need anything else.If you're new. read The FAQ and Vauban's Guide
The alleged Ringleader.........0 -
I'm glad you're motivated to push it further, maybe we could look at creating our bundles together, they will be quite similar up to some point? You're clearly ahead of me with your research above!
Of note, the pilot did actually attempt a first landing at Thessalonika, aborting quite late into it. After this, we circled for around 30 minutes before the pilot stated we would have to go to Athens. If he made the attempt to land, I'd like to think it was within legal limits of both his capabilities as a pilot and the aircraft's operating limits...
The research is from Google, so will need to work out how to validate...
I recorded the pilot's announcement on my phone (already on airline mode and prior to safety announcement requesting them to be turned off). He said he made an attempt to land, aborted and then spent 45, 50 minutes waiting. Transcript is in my post further up thread. But, and not sure how to post a screen shot, it's possible to see your flight's data on FR24. I paid the minimal monthly charge so I could trace the relevant flights... According to the data you got 425ft from ground before 'go-around'. I know little about aviation, so can only assume the pilot did everything right and parameters were safe for altitude and go-around.
I agree, consistency between bundles could be key. I am a little behind you in n process. My initial claim was rejected today....0 -
Guys you are overthinking this a little too much. As I posted above. Burst tyre, not EC. K2 took nearly 3 hours to get a replacement plane at one of their major hubs. (I had a RA flight in March from LBA, plane broke, they used one 2 stands down within an hour or so. And LBA is sparse for RA flights.)
If you had departed on time, possibly no weather issues, but also J2 could have used the other runway even if weather was bad.
Pcy - knock on from weather is not an EC, case law available I think, escapes me which case though.
Keep it simple. You don't need anything else.
You are entirely right. I am overthinking this
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Pcy - knock on from weather is not an EC, case law available I think, escapes me which case though......
https://www.flightdelays.co.uk/blog/2015/1388/another-win-at-court-for-flight-delays
https://www.flightdelays.co.uk/blog/2015/1395/another-weather-court-victory-for-flight-delays
These spring to mind (credit Vauban) for originally posting the links.After reading PtL Vaubans Guide , please don't desert us, hang around and help others!
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