Abusive Boss

24

Comments

  • Takeaway_Addict
    Takeaway_Addict Posts: 6,538 Forumite
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    Undervalued wrote: »
    The OP said....



    Which seems clear (to me) that they simply made a copy for themselves, not destroyed the original.
    Perhaps but considering he is effectively holding them as ransom my point is still valid.
    Don't trust a forum for advice. Get proper paid advice. Any advice given should always be checked
  • Undervalued
    Undervalued Posts: 8,840 Forumite
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    Takeaway_Addict wrote: »
    Perhaps but considering he is effectively holding them as ransom my point is still valid.

    Well maybe I'm missing something but how is he "holding them to ransom"?

    Surely, if he is owed this commission and the data confirms the details, then all he has done is obtained a copy of some evidence to back up his claim? At least that is how I read the OP.
  • ScorpiondeRooftrouser
    ScorpiondeRooftrouser Posts: 2,851 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary Combo Breaker
    Takeaway_Addict wrote: »
    Perhaps but considering he is effectively holding them as ransom my point is still valid.

    The point is that if he has copied and removed from the premises data he shouldn't have, then "giving it back" is going to be neither here nor there. The breach has occurred, and they are liable for the consequences. There's no way of knowing if he has made additional copies of it while he has it at home.
  • foolofbeans
    foolofbeans Posts: 385 Forumite
    ScorpiondeRooftrouser wrote: »
    The point is that if he has copied and removed from the premises data he shouldn't have, then "giving it back" is going to be neither here nor there. The breach has occurred, and they are liable for the consequences. There's no way of knowing if he has made additional copies of it while he has it at home.
    A breach may have occurred but there is no quantifiable loss so there could not be any penalty to pay. If OP was selling the data I could understand the upset but to just obtain details of the pay they are owed is not a sin.
  • ERICS_MUM
    ERICS_MUM Posts: 3,579 Forumite
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    If the data contains details of commission due for various pieces of work, it might also contain details if the work - e.g. Price and client. This could be used by OP in his next job, maybe to 'lure' clients from the old company.
  • Guest101
    Guest101 Posts: 15,764 Forumite
    foolofbeans wrote: »
    A breach may have occurred but there is no quantifiable loss so there could not be any penalty to pay. If OP was selling the data I could understand the upset but to just obtain details of the pay they are owed is not a sin.



    It's theft. It really is as simple as that.
  • jobbingmusician
    jobbingmusician Posts: 20,343 Forumite
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    Guest101 wrote: »
    It's theft. It really is as simple as that.

    With respect, this is total rubbish. You don't know what the OP has taken. If s/he had copied down sales made, and commission due, on a piece of paper to ensure that they can check that the commission that they are paid is correct, would you consider this theft? Would your answer differ if they had made contemporaneous records in a notebook when they were making the sales, and if so, why?

    And if your answer to first question above is 'yes', how else would you suggest that they check their commission?

    If your answer is 'no', how does saving this data electronically differ from writing it down on a piece of paper?

    I am willing to change my view, potentially, if you can come up with a way that the OP can check their commission payments......
    I was a board guide here for many years, but have now resigned. Amicably, but I think it reflects very poorly on MSE that I have not even received an acknowledgement of my resignation! Poor show, MSE.

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  • Guest101
    Guest101 Posts: 15,764 Forumite
    jobbingmusician wrote: »
    With respect, this is total rubbish. - With respect, no it's not. You don't know what the OP has taken. - Clearly he/she has taken computer data from work. If s/he had copied down sales made, and commission due, on a piece of paper to ensure that they can check that the commission that they are paid is correct, would you consider this theft? - The data on the IT system remains the property, always, of the employer. If the OP had noted down figures and names on their own phone or notepad, then no that would not be theft. Would your answer differ if they had made contemporaneous records in a notebook when they were making the sales, and if so, why? - Because the data held on IT systems belongs to the employer.

    And if your answer to first question above is 'yes', how else would you suggest that they check their commission? - Given I've worked in a commission payment role, I would suggest they phone the 'me' of their company and ask. Or take notes on the own system.

    If your answer is 'no', how does saving this data electronically differ from writing it down on a piece of paper? - Because the data on the IT system belongs to the employer.

    I am willing to change my view, potentially, if you can come up with a way that the OP can check their commission payments......



    Sure there's the way I described above.


    There's taking notes on your own system / property.


    There's a thing called memory. Where you remember what you've done.


    I can tell you that having worked in a role paying commission to sales people, only a handful of people have access to that - and this was a international operation - I paid 20+ teams across Europe.
    The OP would need to take in essence the sales contracts, which would include personal client data. If they simply wanted their commission why wouldn't they look up their sales on the system and note down: contract number, amount and deductibles? - that is literally all they would need
  • sangie595
    sangie595 Posts: 6,092 Forumite
    The argument here is all moot. Nobody knows what files were taken or why they were taken, so what the OP did is unknown. All we know is that the company knew what they did and have referred the matter to their solicitors - which is unsurprising.

    I suspect that there is a great deal more to this story than had been said, so deciding whether the OP was in the right, or the employer was, or they are as bad as each other, is a pointless exercise. If the OP was so concerned about all this, you'd think they'd have been back on the thread by now to explain.
  • stator
    stator Posts: 7,441 Forumite
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    Stop making up stuff.
    Wait for the OP to return, if they ever do.
    Changing the world, one sarcastic comment at a time.
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