Can I get fired for this?
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It's a common issue with joint tenancies.
And fees are to be made illegal shortly, so this wont be occurring for much longer, 12-18 months maximum.
Basically a new tenancy is being set up, which is nothing to do with the outgoing tenant.
Ah - I cross posted with you. So are you saying that these "fees" the OP refers to are payable because the old tenancy ended, and these "fees" relate to setting up a new one? (Never rented so don't know myself).
Well if that's the case, I think the outgoing tenant agreeing (according to the OP) to pay 1/4tr of the fees in relation to a tenancy they won't enjoy is pretty generous.
But shouldn't all this have been covered in the original tenancy agreement as to what happens if one tenant leaves???
Have I got completely the wrong end of the stick after all?
(EDIT Happy to own up and apologise to OP if I am completely wrong!)0 -
It is far too small a sum to jeopardise your future career/credit rating for.
Pay it, protect your livelihood, and pursue the leaving tenant for the money if that's what you need to do.
Sometimes just doing something that feels unfair will save you lots of grief in the long run.
I thought when reading the post that you were going bankrupt or something.0 -
Manxman_in_exile wrote: »Ah - I cross posted with you. So are you saying that these "fees" the OP refers to are payable because the old tenancy ended, and these "fees" relate to setting up a new one? (Never rented so don't know myself). - Yes, in essence letting agents charge a fee as part of their business model. The fee is made up of £30-40 for credit checks printing etc, and the rest as their profit.
Well if that's the case, I think the outgoing tenant agreeing (according to the OP) to pay 1/4tr of the fees in relation to a tenancy they won't enjoy is pretty generous.
But shouldn't all this have been covered in the original tenancy agreement as to what happens if one tenant leaves??? - Joint tenancies don't differentiate. There is one legal tenant, made up of several people. Each is considered to act as 'The tenant'.
Have I got completely the wrong end of the stick after all? - sort of. It's complicated. And better placed on housing board realistically, but I post there regularly so win/win.
(EDIT Happy to own up and apologise to OP if I am completely wrong!)
You're not wrong per se. the OP hasn't explained it well at all. and I'm construing some of these points based upon common experiences.
So: A, B and C rent a property, jointly. They will have paid the fee at some point, and each be liable for the full rent. They may split it 33.3% each, OR if rooms are larger smaller split 30/30/40 etc. BUT legally each is liable for 100% of the rent to the LL.
C wants to leave, serves notice. This end the whole tenancy, ALL people must leave. (and if they don't, they are liable for double rent - Distress of rent act)
A and B want to stay, so they find D (or the LL does, or C does, it doesn't really matter who finds them), now A, B and D must be checked and verified by the agent (hence the fees again)
The only time this would be incorrect is if they are still in the fixed contract (typically 6 months) the OP didn't mention that so I assume they aren't. and it's still possible during the fixed contract, it just requires agreement from all parties (so A, B and C and the Landlord).
Basically, from what I can see 'C' the leaver, doesn't owe anything.
HOWEVER landlords and agents are notoriously bad at this, with some swapping tenants 6 or 7 times and not changing the tenancy agreements, deposit details etc.
(and £1200 is crazy amount for fees!, but I presume this is London!)0 -
guys, thanks so much for your responses - going to answer some of the questions here:
Why did the other tenant (who is staying) tell the new tenant that they wouldn't have to pay any fees if the rest of you are?
- She's not very nice. She wanted to lump as many fees as possible on to the outgoing tenant because she doesn't like her, and thought this would do the trick.
But why aren't you paying your rent?
- I've paid my share, I'm up to date. The outgoing tenant hasn't paid for November, because she says it should have all been sorted by now and the hold ups are nothing to do with her, she says we're dragging our feet and have prevented her from filling the room so therefore we should pay this month's rent, as otherwise she could have filled it and been done with the situation by now.
What are these "fees"?
They are agency fees specifically associated with breaking the tenancy and signing a new lease:
Deposit protection (because the deposit has to be re registered) - Outgoing tenant has agreed to pay
Rental insurance - outgoing tenant has agreed to pay
Referencing- needs to be done again for all tenants - we are paying individually, about £150 each
Agency fees (for the work involved) - this is the contested fee that the remaining tenant told the replacement tenant they wouldn't have to pay, and that the outgoing tenant is refusing to pay. Outgoing tenant has forfeited her deposit and said that needs to cover a portion of the fees and a portion of November's rent, but that she won't cover all of both.
The agency are refusing to proceed until the rent (£600 down) is up to date, and the fees are paid, but now that the replacement tenant is saying they won't pay fees because they weren't informed of them.....nobody is moving.
so for me to rectify the situation i'd not only have to pay the extra fees, approx £290, but I would also have to pay £600 rent before the agency agreed to move forward in the process.0 -
Are you able to move back home?
what a mess though. 0 -
libramoon175 wrote: »guys, thanks so much for your responses - going to answer some of the questions here:
Why did the other tenant (who is staying) tell the new tenant that they wouldn't have to pay any fees if the rest of you are?
- She's not very nice. She wanted to lump as many fees as possible on to the outgoing tenant because she doesn't like her, and thought this would do the trick. - That's unfortunate.
But why aren't you paying your rent?
- I've paid my share, I'm up to date. The outgoing tenant hasn't paid for November, because she says it should have all been sorted by now and the hold ups are nothing to do with her, she says we're dragging our feet and have prevented her from filling the room so therefore we should pay this month's rent, as otherwise she could have filled it and been done with the situation by now. - She's probably correct, and if she's done everything by the book, realistically owes nothing.
What are these "fees"?
They are agency fees specifically associated with breaking the tenancy - is she breaking the tenancy, or ending it??!! and signing a new lease:
Deposit protection (because the deposit has to be re registered) - Outgoing tenant has agreed to pay - Crazy.
Rental insurance - outgoing tenant has agreed to pay - !!!!!! is rental insurance?
Referencing- needs to be done again for all tenants - we are paying individually, about £150 each - Crazy
Agency fees (for the work involved) - this is the contested fee that the remaining tenant told the replacement tenant they wouldn't have to pay, and that the outgoing tenant is refusing to pay. Outgoing tenant has forfeited her deposit - ON WHAT BASIS?? and said that needs to cover a portion of the fees and a portion of November's rent, but that she won't cover all of both.
The agency are refusing to proceed until the rent (£600 down) is up to date, and the fees are paid, but now that the replacement tenant is saying they won't pay fees because they weren't informed of them.....nobody is moving. - ARE YOU STILL IN THE FIXED TERM?
so for me to rectify the situation i'd not only have to pay the extra fees, approx £290, but I would also have to pay £600 rent before the agency agreed to move forward in the process.
Answer the questions for appropriate advice0 -
Well, I'm thinking about moving out as well. It's been a really unpleasant living experience and I understand why this girl is leaving. But god knows i don't want all this drama over fees myself, so i might just have to suck it up for the remainder of the fixed term (10 months!)0
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libramoon175 wrote: »Well, I'm thinking about moving out as well. It's been a really unpleasant living experience and I understand why this girl is leaving. But god knows i don't want all this drama over fees myself, so i might just have to suck it up for the remainder of the fixed term (10 months!)
..... Could've just got a lodger in to replace her and not paid a penny, instead you (collectively) created all this drama.....0 -
We are still in the fixed term - we only moved in on september 1 and things have rapidly deteriorated since then. so legally we have signed a 12 month lease, and the outgoing tenant is breaking it, hence causing all these fees.
the outgoing tenant is still on the lease despite having moved out, so how can she not still owe rent? It was due on the 1st and she simply hasn't paid it.0
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