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  • FIRST POST
    becciboop
    Landlord Won't Return Deposit
    • #1
    • 18th Nov 12, 10:40 AM
    Landlord Won't Return Deposit 18th Nov 12 at 10:40 AM
    Hi all
    I have recently moved out of a rented property after being there for just over 6 years. The whole place was cleaned top to bottom before I moved. The landlord told me that the blinds and some carpets need replacing as they were old/dirty. The carpet in the hall was damaged near the door. The blinds were dirty. I have asked him to send me receipts and a report of what needs doing and he said he will, but unfortunately he won't be returning my deposit. Where do I stand on this? Is there anything classed as reasonable ware?

    Thanks all.
Page 2
  • becciboop
    We're sorry to hear about the issues you've been having in reaching your local bureau on the phone, and hope that your email is answered quickly enough.
    Originally posted by CAB National Representative
    I got an email saying thanks but I cant make an appointment via email and when I call I can't get through!

    My tenancy agreement just mentions 'fixtures, furniture and effects'.

    I am guessing this means the carpets/blinds?

    Thanks all.
    • Fire Fox
    • By Fire Fox 20th Nov 12, 1:06 AM
    • 23,843 Posts
    • 27,064 Thanks
    Fire Fox
    Actually, its not even the landlord that I am dealing with, its the 'handyman' for the property that does all the landlords work/jobs on the flats. I have never seen the landlord in the 6 years I lived there. When I wrote to the landlord giving notice, I had to deal with the 'handyman'. He has told me I will receive a written report of what the charges are.
    The carpet was frayed because of our cats. I understand the charge for the carpet but I don't believe I should be charged for the whole of the amount as he's basically getting a free carpet from me! And the blinds just needed a clean, as expected after 6 years.
    Originally posted by becciboop
    Stop dealing with the handyman (who is acting as an agent of the landlord), you don't need to have seen the landlord for him to be the legally liable party. Organ grinder not the monkey!

    As stated "You need to write to your landlord asking for a breakdown of all the charges levied, copies of quotes and a copy of the dual signed check in inventory. Send two copies from different Post Offices and get a proof of posting each time. Do not communicate with your landlord via text message, you need a paper trail."
    There should be an address at which to serve notices on your tenancy agreement. Until you have all this information or it is clear it does not exist the CAB can only give limited help.

    No your landlord can't charge new for old as already stated, he would have to allow for depreciation. But you cannot formally dispute the charges until you know exactly what they are and what their evidence is. Dirt is NOT fair wear and tear, that is not expected after six years.
    What a difference a day makes, twenty four little hours.
  • Wywth
    I got an email saying thanks but I cant make an appointment via email and when I call I can't get through!...
    Originally posted by becciboop
    Keep trying!

    I know all the CAB offices are extremely busy at the moment (and will get even more busy in about 6 weeks time) dealing with enquiries ... but all those other people at your local office had to start by making an appointment by telephone so it must be possible.
  • becciboop
    Ok, so he has sent a copy of all the charges -
    all carpets - stained/chewed - £376 to replace where chewed, £30 to clean where dirty but not chewed
    scratch on doors - £50
    blinds in lounge - stained - £130
    freezer tray - £20
    door handle - £20
    16 lightbulbs- £24
    paintwork - £85
    minus 25% for ware and tare.

    I am going to reply asking for a signed inventory as I dont remember signing one. Can he charge for paintwork and lightbulbs? In my contract it states 'fixtures and fittings' but not specifics...

    Thanks
  • Wywth
    Ok, so he has sent a copy of all the charges -
    all carpets - stained/chewed - £376 to replace where chewed, £30 to clean where dirty but not chewed
    scratch on doors - £50
    blinds in lounge - stained - £130
    freezer tray - £20
    door handle - £20
    16 lightbulbs- £24
    paintwork - £85
    minus 25% for ware and tare.

    I am going to reply asking for a signed inventory as I dont remember signing one. Can he charge for paintwork and lightbulbs? In my contract it states 'fixtures and fittings' but not specifics...

    Thanks
    Originally posted by becciboop
    Did you take (or break) the lightbulbs when you left? If not, why are you being charged for them?

    Piantwork will again be for repairs over and above fair wear and tear. If you don't agree, you'll probably have to tell it to the judge.

    Fair wear and tear is not deductable, so you can tell that to the judge if necessary (and the judge will agree with you)
    However, ignoring that, the amount claimed is still in excess of the amount you deposited, so you may end up in court anyway (unless you pay the remainder)

    Edit: or is the "minus 25% for ware and tare" in relation to the £85 repainting charge only, meaning you are being deducted just £63.75 for repainting?
    If not, what is it 25% of ???
    Last edited by Wywth; 20-11-2012 at 6:30 PM.
    • dacouch
    • By dacouch 20th Nov 12, 5:59 PM
    • 20,281 Posts
    • 12,522 Thanks
    dacouch
    Did you take the lightbulbs with you?

    Any news on the inventory?
  • becciboop
    Did you take the lightbulbs with you?

    Any news on the inventory?
    Originally posted by dacouch
    No, we didnt take any light bulbs with us. Nor did we brake any.

    I dont seem to have an inventory - so next step is to write back and ask for one...
  • becciboop
    Did you take (or break) the lightbulbs when you left? If not, why are you being charged for them?

    Piantwork will again be for repairs over and above fair wear and tear. If you don't agree, you'll probably have to tell it to the judge.

    Fair wear and tear is not deductable, so you can tell that to the judge if necessary (and the judge will agree with you)
    However, ignoring that, the amount claimed is still in excess of the amount you deposited, so you may end up in court anyway (unless you pay the remainder)

    Edit: or is the "minus 25% for ware and tare" in relation to the £85 repainting charge only, meaning you are being deducted just £63.75 for repainting?
    If not, what is it 25% of ???
    Originally posted by Wywth
    No idea why we are being charged for them..didnt brake them or take any with us. His explanation on the report says '10 lightbulbs not working' - its those ones that are inside the ceilings, spot light I think they're called.
    I think the 25% is off the whole amount, rather than just the paint job. I am totally shocked that he'd charge us for lightbulbs and to paint the place!
  • Wywth
    No idea why we are being charged for them..didnt brake them or take any with us. His explanation on the report says '10 lightbulbs not working' - its those ones that are inside the ceilings, spot light I think they're called.
    I think the 25% is off the whole amount, rather than just the paint job. I am totally shocked that he'd charge us for lightbulbs and to paint the place!
    Originally posted by becciboop
    More confusion reigns.

    Is it 10 lightbulbs that are claimed you left in a non-working condition or 16?

    Ah, so you think hes given you the full re-instatement costs of everything, and then reduced it by 25% for fair wear and tear? That would still mean you owe more than you gave as a deposit ... and best not to go to court over it as dirty is not fair wear & tear; it is dirt! You were responsible for giving the property back in the same state of cleanliness as it was originally let. There is no fair wear and tear as far as soiling is concerned. You should have cleaned it, or got it cleaned.

    Similarly there is not usually any allowed fair wear & tear as far as lightbulbs or broken/missing door handles or freezer trays are concerned.
    Last edited by Wywth; 20-11-2012 at 8:51 PM.
  • becciboop
    More confusion reigns.

    Is it 10 lightbulbs that are claimed you left in a non-working condition or 16?

    Ah, so you think hes given you the full re-instatement costs of everything, and then reduced it by 25% for fair wear and tear? That would still mean you owe more than you gave as a deposit ... and best not to go to court over it as dirty is not fair wear & tear; it is dirt! You were responsible for giving the property back in the same state of cleanliness as it was originally let. There is no fair wear and tear as far as soiling is concerned. You should have cleaned it, or got it cleaned.

    Similarly there is not usually any allowed fair wear & tear as far as lightbulbs or broken/missing door handles or freezer trays are concerned.
    Originally posted by Wywth
    It was cleaned, it just didnt look as new as it did when we moved in as it'd been lived in for 6 years. Sorry typo..it was 16.
    • Fire Fox
    • By Fire Fox 21st Nov 12, 8:26 AM
    • 23,843 Posts
    • 27,064 Thanks
    Fire Fox
    Ok, so he has sent a copy of all the charges -
    all carpets - stained/chewed - £376 to replace where chewed, £30 to clean where dirty but not chewed
    scratch on doors - £50
    blinds in lounge - stained - £130
    freezer tray - £20
    door handle - £20
    16 lightbulbs- £24
    paintwork - £85
    minus 25% for ware and tare.

    I am going to reply asking for a signed inventory as I dont remember signing one. Can he charge for paintwork and lightbulbs? In my contract it states 'fixtures and fittings' but not specifics...

    Thanks
    Originally posted by becciboop
    Lifespan of most carpets would be five to ten years depending on the quality so after six years - assuming it was brand new to begin with, was it? - he needs to deduct rather more than 25% for wear and tear! Yes you can be charged for lightbulbs if you started out with working ones and didn't bother replacing them. Also can be charged for paintwork if you scuffed or damaged it, but not if it's just faded from sunlight say.

    You need to request dual signed check in and check out inventory including any photographs plus supporting quotes for the painting, carpeting and blinds if he needs to replace rather than clean.

    http://www.tds.gb.com/resources/files/A-guide-to-deposits-disputes-and-damages.pdf
    http://www.newviewresidential.co.uk/Documents/ARLA-GuidetoDepositsandDamages.pdf
    http://www.chrisulph.co.uk/2011/01/23/tenancy-deposit-deductions-and-apportionment-case-studies/#2
    Last edited by Fire Fox; 21-11-2012 at 8:30 AM.
    What a difference a day makes, twenty four little hours.
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