PIP Help

Hi all,

New to this forum so hello from me.

Few days ago my son was awarded PIP and given standard rates for both. We are both delighted, but disappointed as the letter he received today isn't truthful.

Budgeting
We stated in the forms and face to face that my son is unable to make budgeting decisions. Due to his depression and unable to control finances, I have full access to his accounts and debit cards. I arrange the bills to be paid, rent and other expenses. This was stated to the assessor who came to his house. He was awarded 0 points and it states "You can managed complex budgeting decisions unaided"; which isn't true.

Mixing with other people
We stated in the forms and face to face that my son suffers from social anxiety and being in an open place with people causes him distress; let alone engage with them. He cannot go out unless it's with me and even then, he appears stressed and will make me take him home. As soon as the assessor sat down, he told her that I would be talking for him. She stated that he had to to understand it more. He did reluctantly under the impression he had to or wouldn't get the benefit. He was awarded 0 points and it states "You can engage with other people unaided"

Preparing food
We stated that he cannot prepare or cook a simple meal due not being able to concentrate. He burns himself when forgetting pans on the hob and due to having no sense of smell, he's at hazard of burning the house down or himself. I either cook for him or give him microwave meals. He was awarded 2 points and it states "You need an aid or appliance to be able to prepare or cook a simple meal"

Managing your treatments
We stated due to his depression and inability to concentrate and due to number of meds he takes, I sort his various meds out into a dossette box. I visit morning and evening to ensure he takes them as he has the tendency to forget. He was awarded 0 points and it states "You can manage medication unaided"

He was awarded 8 points.

Mobility - Going Out
We stated that he is unable to follow the route of a familiar or unfamiliar journey without another person. Whenever he does need to go out, e.g food or specialist appointments, I literally have to force him into the car to go. Whilst we shop for food, he will stay in the car. He cannot travel on public transport alone and he is never in public without me. Before we travel, I have to confirm with him the route of journey on Google Maps; this was then noted down that he likes to look at Google Maps; what a load of rubbish. It 's not a familiar route, he will panic, get anxious and refuse to go. He was awarded 0 points and it states "You are able to plan and follow a simple journey unaided"

He was awarded 10 points for moving around and 0 for going out.

What does he do now? He is worried his claim will get stopped if he even challenges it. Very disappointed as the points missing would of got him the higher rate on both.

Thanks in advance,
«134567

Comments

  • IAmWales
    IAmWales Posts: 2,024 Forumite
    What medical evidence do you have of the above?

    The assessor cannot just go on your word, especially when it might sound z little scripted.
  • acooper95
    acooper95 Posts: 33 Forumite
    They have been in contact with various specialists and GP's.

    They have on record his no sense of smell, inability to concentrate nor make decisions.

    Other than actually spend a day with us, I'm unsure on how to provide proof of the more physiological ones like journeys.
  • Tommo1980
    Tommo1980 Posts: 406 Forumite
    This is fairly standard practice. The assessor will make a judgement call based on a number of factors.

    If you truly believe the award is incorrect and you have medical evidence relevant to where your son fits the descriptors, then you should encourage him to appeal.

    But as you say, there is a chance your son could lose all or part of the award. Also the process is not exactly stress free.

    Tom
  • Tommo1980
    Tommo1980 Posts: 406 Forumite
    Evidence can be in the form of a diary or log of how you, or others, support your son in his daily life.

    Tom
  • acooper95
    acooper95 Posts: 33 Forumite
    Tommo1980 wrote: »
    This is fairly standard practice. The assessor will make a judgement call based on a number of factors.

    If you truly believe the award is incorrect and you have medical evidence relevant to where your son fits the descriptors, then you should encourage him to appeal.

    But as you say, there is a chance your son could lose all or part of the award. Also the process is not exactly stress free.

    Tom

    If I'm being totally honest, the process up to this has been dreadful and stressful for both.

    We applied for this assuming as per everyone else he'd be refused. But given accepted first time, I may just talk to him and explain take what been offered.
  • acooper95
    acooper95 Posts: 33 Forumite
    Another question, will this award effect his ESA and housing benefit?
  • Alice_Holt
    Alice_Holt Posts: 5,921
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    edited 18 March 2017 at 3:16PM
    acooper95 wrote: »
    Another question, will this award effect his ESA and housing benefit?

    If your son lives alone and receives income-based ESA he may be eligible for disability premium(s) which will increase his current ESA award.
    http://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/disability-premiums-in-benefits

    If he doesn't lives on his own, it may be possible for someone to claim carers allowance for looking after him.
    https://www.turn2us.org.uk/Benefit-guides/Carer-s-Allowance/What-is-Carer-s-Allowance

    His HB may increase - do tell his local council of this change in his circumstances.
    https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/before-claiming/extra-help-pip-entitles-you-to/

    I would suggest you both visit your local CAB for a benefits check, and for a chat about the pros and cons of challenging the PIP decision.
    https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/about-us/how-we-provide-advice/advice/

    Here is some info on appealing the decision:
    https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/appeals/mandatory-reconsideration/
    http://www.advicenow.org.uk/guides/how-win-pip-appeal
    http://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/pip-appeals

    Info on PIP points system and how there are interpreted:
    http://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/pip-points-system
    https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/547146/pip-assessment-guide.pdf pages 97-135.

    From your OP it could be that:

    DL -
    an additional point for managing medications
    3b. Needs any one or more of the following –
    (i) to use an aid or appliance to be able to manage medication;
    (ii) supervision, prompting or assistance to be able to manage medication.
    (iii) supervision, prompting or assistance to be able to monitor a health condition. 1 point.

    two additional points for managing budgeting decisions
    10b. Needs prompting or assistance to be able to make complex budgeting decisions. 2 points.

    two additional points for social engagement
    9b. Needs prompting to be able to engage with other people. 2 points.

    For mobility:
    four additional points for
    1b. Needs prompting to be able to undertake any journey to avoid overwhelming psychological distress to the claimant. 4 points.

    Could you get persuasive evidence to argue this case at tribunal?
    Would your son's GP / CPN provide written supporting evidence around this additional descriptors?
    Would you son be able to cope with an appeal?
    Could you get help from a CAB caseworker with any appeal?

    His existing award will continue to be paid if he does decide to appeal.
    On MR / appeal the whole of the award will be looked at again (so it could stay the same / go up / go down).
    Alice Holt Forest situated some 4 miles south of Farnham forms the most northerly gateway to the South Downs National Park.
  • acooper95
    acooper95 Posts: 33 Forumite
    Thank you so much for your detailed reply.

    I will contact ESA and Council on Monday and inform them of his award for PIP and ask if he will get any top ups etc. Would all mean so much
  • _CC_
    _CC_ Posts: 362 Forumite
    acooper95 wrote: »
    Mobility - Going Out
    We stated that he is unable to follow the route of a familiar or unfamiliar journey without another person. Whenever he does need to go out, e.g food or specialist appointments, I literally have to force him into the car to go. Whilst we shop for food, he will stay in the car. He cannot travel on public transport alone and he is never in public without me. Before we travel, I have to confirm with him the route of journey on Google Maps; this was then noted down that he likes to look at Google Maps; what a load of rubbish. It 's not a familiar route, he will panic, get anxious and refuse to go. He was awarded 0 points and it states "You are able to plan and follow a simple journey unaided"

    He was awarded 10 points for moving around and 0 for going out.

    Very disappointed as the points missing would of got him the higher rate on both.

    The above is an understandable misinterpretation of the descriptors for going out.

    The following familiar and unfamiliar journey descriptors are based on the claimants cognitive ability to follow the journey or use public transport. For these to apply the claimant would be expected to have some form of cognitive impairment such as learning difficulties, autism etc. Not being able to follow these journeys because of distress from anxiety is not covered and the descriptors are changing soon to clarify this.

    You could however possibly argue he should be award 4 points for needing prompting to undertake a journey which would take the total to 14. The corresponding notes do state that this needs to be the case on the majority of days and the symptoms so severe that the person is unable to function, such as those with dementia, agoraphobia or generalised anxiety disorder.
  • antrobus
    antrobus Posts: 17,386 Forumite
    _CC_ wrote: »
    .... Not being able to follow these journeys because of distress from anxiety is not covered and the descriptors are changing soon to clarify this....

    They came into force on the 16th March. I think.
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