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  • FIRST POST
    • Gatser
    • By Gatser 14th Dec 09, 1:44 PM
    • 576Posts
    • 207Thanks
    Gatser
    Pensions Planning: The NUMBER
    • #1
    • 14th Dec 09, 1:44 PM
    Pensions Planning: The NUMBER 14th Dec 09 at 1:44 PM
    The NUMBER is how much income you need to "live comfortably"
    So What's your number?
    Very important for pensions planning, to know what you are aiming for.

    My Number? (for a couple)
    I calculated: £22,000
    based on
    Food £5,000
    Car/transport £5,000
    Bills/Utilities £4,500
    Holidays/Leisure £4,500
    Clothing/Cash/Xmas/Other £2,000
    Repairs/replacements £1,000
Page 2
  • Harry Powell
    if anyone can tell me how to live on £4k (and be happy)....I can retire.... 20 years ago!
    Originally posted by Gatser
    I think their £4k has rather narrow parameters and consists of 'living' on an annual Sky TV subscription, mobile phone contract, takeaway food stipend and wii game purchasing allowance that comes to no more than £4k annually.
  • whiteflag
    Touch of sarcasm Whiteflag?
    Nothing of the sort, pity you feel that way, i mean I even bloody thanked you !

    If you had read some of my previous posts you would have seen that I am passionate about the need for financial planning and I have put personal cashflow planning at the core of my business. Wehave found funnily enough there are some people who have grasped the concept that running out of money in the future is not a good situation!

    I got THE NUMBER from a book written by Lee Eisenberg.
    The reviews suggest its $%$%$ (bad!) but I do agree with the concept of having some idea of what we are aiming for in life and knowing if we are on target.
    not really interested after your opening comment
    Last edited by whiteflag; 17-12-2009 at 3:29 PM.
  • houseboatdream
    MFW = Mortgage Free Wannabe, DFW = Debt Free Wannabe. They're two boards on MSE that attract quite a few people. The strategies there seem to consist of making your life miserable and scraping by in order to meet some financial target. In DFW the target is to get rid of debt and on the MFW the target is to get rid of a mortgage. It's been said many times before that it's the financial equivalent of crash dieting, and usually has the same outcome.
    Originally posted by Harry Powell
    GALLYGIRL - now you can see why I was hesitant to start a "Retire 10 years early" thread!!
    Downshifted once.....saved up, sold up and travelled Europe in our campervan. Then bought a house in France......

    Now need to pay off the debts and devise a plan to live there full time
  • Harry Powell
    GALLYGIRL - now you can see why I was hesitant to start a "Retire 10 years early" thread!!
    Originally posted by houseboatdream
    Why do you need a thread, why not just do it? :confused:

    There seems to be a lot of prevaricating on MSE. I came across a "Pay off your mortgage" thread where people seem to have been joining up for the last 9 months before they even start. Crazy!. :rolleyes:

    If they must plough all their wealth into a single asset then why wait around talking about it? Just get on with it.
  • houseboatdream
    Why do you frequent these boards and post on here then Harry?

    Is it for the advice, ideas and mutual support?

    Or do you enjoy putting others down and judging the way they choose to live their lives? :confused:
    Downshifted once.....saved up, sold up and travelled Europe in our campervan. Then bought a house in France......

    Now need to pay off the debts and devise a plan to live there full time
    • Gatser
    • By Gatser 18th Dec 09, 9:02 AM
    • 576 Posts
    • 207 Thanks
    Gatser
    The NUMBER
    The NUMBER is how much income you need to "live comfortably"
    So What's your number?
    Very important for pensions planning, to know what you are aiming for.

    My Number? (for a couple)
    I calculated: £22,000
    based on
    Food £5,000
    Car/transport £5,000
    Bills/Utilities £4,500
    Holidays/Leisure £4,500
    Clothing/Cash/Xmas/Other £2,000
    Repairs/replacements £1,000

    ...for those that have forgotten what this thread is about (and digressed into personal insults...) Happy Xmas!
  • houseboatdream
    Gatser

    I thought your post was great and was looking forward to a sensible discussion of something that i had being giving lot of thought to recently. However it is clear that posting any further details will just lead to critiscim and sarcastic remarks from some posters.

    I've read a few more threads on the pensions board now and unfortunately this seems to be a common occurrence.

    I think I will just join the "How much can you save?" thread over the on the savings Board where the posters are far more friendly and supportive. - Whiteflag - you do not need to make any comment!
    Downshifted once.....saved up, sold up and travelled Europe in our campervan. Then bought a house in France......

    Now need to pay off the debts and devise a plan to live there full time
    • gallygirl
    • By gallygirl 18th Dec 09, 9:45 AM
    • 16,467 Posts
    • 108,103 Thanks
    gallygirl
    MFW = Mortgage Free Wannabe, DFW = Debt Free Wannabe. They're two boards on MSE that attract quite a few people. The strategies there seem to consist of making your life miserable and scraping by in order to meet some financial target. In DFW the target is to get rid of debt and on the MFW the target is to get rid of a mortgage. It's been said many times before that it's the financial equivalent of crash dieting, and usually has the same outcome.

    Much better surely, to save a little, overpay a little and spend a little to achieve your financial targets? :confused:
    Originally posted by Harry Powell
    Therre are people like that, or course there are, but plenty others who do have a balanced approach. Myself for instance, on the MFW board, yes I do watch every penny, but I'm frequently watching those pennies being spent on holidays , 7 this year. It's about not wasting money - e.g. £5 a day on lunch, £2 lattes when work provide free coffees etc.

    And yes, whilst we should be juggling saving & paying debts there are people on the DFW baord who are struggling to make minimum payments so paying into an option is something which has to be put on hold.

    I think their £4k has rather narrow parameters and consists of 'living' on an annual Sky TV subscription, mobile phone contract, takeaway food stipend and wii game purchasing allowance that comes to no more than £4k annually.
    Originally posted by Harry Powell
    You've obviously been reading different threads to me then. Most of the ones I've read people are leading 'simple' lives where the last thing they'd be spending on are those items.

    And as to people waiting to join challenges, they DO just get on with it in the meantime. However, having a common shared goal where we all record progress and encourage one another is great and I would have thought would have been equally of use in pensions planning which is a longer term goal. However, you're obviously motivated enough to not need any encouragement from others.

    GALLYGIRL - now you can see why I was hesitant to start a "Retire 10 years early" thread!!
    Originally posted by houseboatdream
    Hmmm, yes, I see your point
    A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort
    Mortgage Balance = £0
    "Do what others won't early in life so you can do what others can't later in life"
    • zygurat789
    • By zygurat789 18th Dec 09, 10:17 AM
    • 4,236 Posts
    • 1,993 Thanks
    zygurat789
    The NUMBER is how much income you need to "live comfortably"
    So What's your number?
    Very important for pensions planning, to know what you are aiming for.

    My Number? (for a couple)
    I calculated: £22,000
    based on
    Food £5,000
    Car/transport £5,000
    Bills/Utilities £4,500
    Holidays/Leisure £4,500
    Clothing/Cash/Xmas/Other £2,000
    Repairs/replacements £1,000

    ...for those that have forgotten what this thread is about (and digressed into personal insults...) Happy Xmas!
    Originally posted by Gatser
    I calculate that to achieve this net you would have to be in receipt of pensions totalling £25,125.
    The only thing that is constant is change.
  • whiteflag
    ...for those that have forgotten what this thread is about (and digressed into personal insults...) Happy Xmas!
    Originally posted by Gatser
    Gatser it would be nice if you can post the personal insults as I cant see any aimed at you.

    What did you hope to gain by calling my post sarcastic?
    • jonnyb1978
    • By jonnyb1978 18th Dec 09, 4:04 PM
    • 1,319 Posts
    • 374 Thanks
    jonnyb1978
    I though this was a good thread as people are constantly curious what a good figure is. Yes all needs are different but its good to compare and see where you are in comparison to others.

    If you dont like this thread then dont spoil it for others. Why bother posting at all.
  • houseboatdream
    So shall we continue the discussion?

    My figure is £20k based on:

    Bills & utilities £3700 (current costs - we have v small property!)
    Food £5200
    Pocket money and personal stuff £3800 (for 2)
    Vehicle £1500 - not factored in replacing it, something to think about..
    Holidays £3000 (campervan)
    Repairs £1000
    Pets £1000
    thats £19200 which I round up to £20k

    So, I'm thinking £20 - 22 is where to aim. I know we can live on a lot less. When we travelled round europe we lived on £10k per year, but we did not have the house costs to pay. Scary though, not having a house...

    Someone made interesting point that to have net £22k you need gross £25k. That raises the issue of tax, because it seems that you need to manage your retirement funds to pay the minimum tax possible, especially if you retire before proper pensionable age becasue you won't get the enhanced personal allowance until then.

    Our issue is that we will be OK once I reach 65, but by then OH will be 73. There's lots of things we want to do before then. I am the main earner in the household and want to retire in 10 years time when I will be 55. Question is how to bridge the gap between 55 and 65. Thats where my "Retire ten years early" thing comes from.
    Downshifted once.....saved up, sold up and travelled Europe in our campervan. Then bought a house in France......

    Now need to pay off the debts and devise a plan to live there full time
    • Gatser
    • By Gatser 18th Dec 09, 8:24 PM
    • 576 Posts
    • 207 Thanks
    Gatser
    We appear to be roughly on the same lines HOUSEBOATDREAM.

    I had great plans until I was "politically removed" from my job after 20 years.
    However, thanks to my spreadsheet and calculated NUMBER, I have worked out how to get back on course.....eventually.

    Interesting to hear your plans.
    I am 52 and hope to start working less time at 55.

    Tax is certainly an important factor in the whole equation.
    I am trying to get the balance right between Pension & Savings (ISA's) so that income can be split between OH & myself and make full use of our individual tax allowances.

    I realise in my NUMBER calculation, I have been prudent in my estimate of future bills, food costs etc but its always best to have some "fat" in the figures....just in case interest rates stay at 0.25%!
  • Rob Marx
    i would need £250k a year just enough to keep attract 21 year old blondes and replacing them every 2 years
  • whiteflag
    i would need £250k a year just enough to keep attract 21 year old blondes and replacing them every 2 years
    Originally posted by Rob Marx
    you are correct Rob, its all about lifestyle. Everyone is different therefore it doesnt make sense to use what others on here are doing as a benchmark for your own planning.

    Btw Gatser I knew I had come across you before and I see being discourteous isnt a new thing for you - although I have to say this old thread was most entertaining- did you ever post whose SIPP you went with?

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=991161
    Last edited by whiteflag; 20-12-2009 at 4:47 PM.
    • silvercar
    • By silvercar 20th Dec 09, 4:48 PM
    • 36,388 Posts
    • 153,836 Thanks
    silvercar
    Maybe I'm missing something, my NUMBER is too high. I am working on having the same standard of living but more free time means more holidays. I'm including things like still running two newish cars, keeping living in the family home, so expenses like a gardener.
    • Gatser
    • By Gatser 20th Dec 09, 6:57 PM
    • 576 Posts
    • 207 Thanks
    Gatser
    Everyone is different therefore it doesnt make sense to use what others on here are doing as a benchmark for your own planning.
    Originally posted by whiteflag
    I prefer to listen to the experience of others and learn from them.
    Others may similarly learn from my mistakes (I am not perfect either, WhiteFlag :rolleyes
    Therefore.....I disagree with your view.

    Btw Gatser I knew I had come across you before and I see being discourteous isnt a new thing for you
    Originally posted by whiteflag
    Diskertius? Moi?? I cannot even spell it!
    Perhaps you are a sensitive soul... My humble and unreserved apology if anyone is upset by my comments.... who else have I upset I now wonder?

    Let's try to stick to the thread shall we....
    • Gatser
    • By Gatser 20th Dec 09, 7:06 PM
    • 576 Posts
    • 207 Thanks
    Gatser
    Maybe I'm missing something, my NUMBER is too high. I am working on having the same standard of living but more free time means more holidays. I'm including things like still running two newish cars, keeping living in the family home, so expenses like a gardener.
    Originally posted by silvercar
    Everyone's NUMBER is fine...if it can be achieved.
    The point of calculating your NUMBER is to know where you should be aiming, not to try and match someone else's.

    I put £5k in for food.
    Others may shop at Waitrose/M&S and need £10k.

    As I talk to (semi/retired) friends they tell me its possible to survive on less than we first think... but I have never had a gardener so thats a luxury I will have to forego. (but good luck to you)
    Same with cars... I have never been motivated by cars but thats a personal choice, if you can include them in your NUMBER and afford it, Great!

    I guess your NUMBER is nearer £40k?
  • EdInvestor
    Maybe I'm missing something, my NUMBER is too high. I am working on having the same standard of living but more free time means more holidays. I'm including things like still running two newish cars, keeping living in the family home, so expenses like a gardener.
    Originally posted by silvercar
    Quite a lot of costs go down = no NI, no pension payments, no transport costs to work, no 'incidentals' (lunches coffees gifts,drinks etc) related to work. No need for expensive work clothes. Tax allowances go up quite a lot after 65. You may find the free bus pass is a moneysaver, depending on where you live, along with the senior railcard. There are various other freebies such as prescriptions.It all mounts up.

    Some costs rise, eg utilities, if you are at home all day, but winter fuel allowance helps with that. Being around at quiet times means you have access to plenty of bargains in the shops.There are discounts for retired people at many museums, theatres,galleries, etc.

    I'd say costs definitely go down after retirement comparing like for like, but some people do adopt a more expensive lifestyle, catching up with travel and leisure activities they put off when working, and this can be more expensive.
  • whiteflag
    Maybe I'm missing something, my NUMBER is too high. I am working on having the same standard of living but more free time means more holidays. I'm including things like still running two newish cars, keeping living in the family home, so expenses like a gardener.
    Originally posted by silvercar
    no silvercar, luckily for you, you have not missed anything. Your number is your number- if thats what it takes then thats what you should aim for.

    Life isnt a dress rehearsal, theres no point in lying on your death bed regretting not doing all the things you could have done. If you know what you want ( and I can see from other threads you are making plans) then plan to achieve it.
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